Ooops! – Lost a small part in the engine? Help!!

[87-911]

Was doing the valve adjustment on my 87 w AC. Many of the studs for the valve covers backed out with their nut instead of staying in place. I was working blind reinstalling the upper rear-most stud under the AC compressor and dropped the 6mm x 35 mm stud. The sound as it fell was solid, not the clinky thud of hitting the tinwork or the ring of hitting cooling fins. I assumed it had fallen into the #4 cam tower but the stud was no were to be found. That was last weekend. I’ve two other pair of eyes go over every thing but no success. Used the light, magnet, wire probes, and inspection mirror to search every nook and cranny (except the unknown one occupied by the stud) – but no luck. Even though it didn’t seem possible, I pulled the lower valve cover hoping to find the stud had fallen all the way through; nadda!.

Anybody know of a special hidie-hole in that area. I’ve yet to rotate the engine. Doing so with a part that size missing possibly in the valve train just doesn’t seem prudent. ANY SUGGESTIONS?? Is there a protocol or set of guidelines for this sort of thing?

I don’t relish the alternatives. HELP!!

Thanks,
Bozo

[Wayne 962]

Hi there. This kindof sucks. If you look at this picture:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/911_valve_adjust/911_valve_adjust_pic9.jpg

you will see that the studs don't really have much room to go anywhere. If they fell into the spark plug areas, then you shouldn't have too much to worry about (except getting the wires on the plugs, and perhaps them shorting out!), as this area is 'external' to the engine oil supply.

I'm sure that it's in there somewhere, and the visibility is really, really really bad in there. Try using a magnet, or a few magnets tied to a string (don't drop those in there), and they may magically pick up the stud. In fact, I think that's your best bet...

Oh, there is an exact map of all the hiding places in the cam towers in "101 Projects for Your Porsche 911" - just kidding...

-Wayne

[87-911]

Thanks Wayne - I have looked in 101 for pics and suggestions. The spark plugs were not in but I see no way for the errant stud to find it's way there - but then I also didn't see a way for the stud to disappear to begin with. I assume that if it did find it's way that far that I would not be able to rotate the engine by hand.

[ChrisBennet]

See if you can borrow someones Boroscope to look in there.

[Superman]

Just turn the car upside down and shake it. Oh no superpowers, sorry.

Know any surgeons? One of the first things I like to know at a time like this is whether there is any possibility for the item to get into the combustion chamber. (I drop things all the time) if the spark plug was out then it would be possible for the stud to get in there. If you're saying you were working below the spark plug on the intake side, then it is quite possible that it fell down to the exhaust side. At any rate, if it went into the spark plug hole, then it would probably just lay down in the cylinder lengthwise, keeping that piston 35mm away from the head. A magnet could probably get it out. The other danger is it getting under a valve spring or rocker.

I have several screwdrivers that are magnetized and this is the tool I reach for first when I drop stuff. To magnetize a screwdriver, wrap an insulated wire around the shaft several times and tap the ends of the wire on car battery terminals, VERY BRIEFLY.

Keep looking.

[Early_S_Man]

Even if it fell down into an oil return tube and is down in the sump ... there isn't much to worry about, as there is the screen for the oil pump intake, and the mesh 'windage' tray to keep it from ever causing damage to crank or rods!

We had the same type of discussion about one of the 'missing in action' nuts and screws for the P-213 feeler gauge that came loose on a guy doing his first valve adjust ... and bits of broken chain ramps found on rstoll's oil strainer, too! Nothing to worry about, though the imagination can turn it into a horror story ... if you let it run wild!

[Doug Zielke]

A while back I was helping Pelican-head Rob Fix (hi, Rob) adjust his valves. "We" had the misfortune of dropping a small aluminum washer, into the upper cam-tower. Rob saw it go in, but we could never see exactly where in order to fish it out.

Rob was pretty pissed, but my contention was, being aluminum, it would do no harm. I guess we'll find it when time comes for a motor overhaul. (Rob wanted to flip the car over, but I deferred...bad back ya know!)

[Bill Douglas]

My recommendation is to start the engine and see where the crunching sounds come from and judging by where the bits of metal are flying out from (or look for a stud shaped hole in the crankcase) you should be able to figure out where the stud ended up.

[Wayne 962]

Hmm, having rebuilt these motors, I disagree with everyone here who says don't worry about it. Heck you go thru a lot of trouble to clean out your oil of dirt and metal particles, don't you think a stud or a washer is a rather large item that can get caught in the valve train?

Chain ramps are plastic - very, very malleable. Steel studs, and even aluminum washers are a very, very different story...

-Wayne

[pwd72s]

"To magnetize a screwdriver, wrap an insulated wire around the shaft several times and tap the ends of the wire on car battery terminals, VERY BRIEFLY." -Superman Superman, tips like this one alone make reading the board a pleasure. Never heard of doing this before your post. Anybody wanting a small but powerful magnet might go to a farm supply store, ask to look at stomach magnets. These are 2-3" long, about the diameter of an index finger, round on ends. Cattlemen use them for cow's stomachs...they pick up bits & pieces or wire, other metals that might be found in hay, don't allow intestinal damage because the harmful bits stay in the stomach. I've found lots of uses for these magnets over the years.