Buying used - Best years? Worst years?

[curious sam]

OK, so I've always wanted a 911... and after BMWs, a Volvo S60R, etc etc, I am finally in a position that I can afford to maintain a decent used 911.

Here is what I need to know - what years are the good years to buy, from a frequency of repair standpoint?

What I mean by that is in my experience, every manufacturer has good years and bad - for example, the 1999 Volvo S80 was a black hole for repairs, whereas the 2005 S60R is a gem that shames Hondas. Likewise with BMWs, etc etc.

If I was looking at water cooled 911s (I live in Louisiana, so I'm guessing air cooled isn't the best idea, but I'm not opposed to air cooled on principle or anything).

So... what years should I look at, and which should I avoid like the plague?

Edited to add - I want a manual transmission, automatic need not apply. Hardtop, no cabriolets. I like AWD quite a but BUT would be perfectly happy with 2WD.

[Flieger]

1989 964 Carrera 4 or Carrera 2. Good HVAC for LA, nice interior, option of 4 wheel drive. Air cooled, looks classic.

If not, then a 993 Carrera 4 or Carrera 2. Cost more than the above.

[curious sam]

I was looking at 2004 models - appears a base carrera without bells/whistles can be had in the mid 30's on eBay and autotrader.

Any particular years for the 993 if I go that route?

[Flieger]

There is a big difference in character between the air-cooled cars and 996/997. On this forum, everyone will recommend something air-cooled. Probably a 911SC or Carrera 3.2

You should drive a few of the models you are considering. Also, try the 996/997 Forum down the page of Pelican Parts Technical Forums. Porsche 996/997 Forum - Pelican Parts Technical BBS

993s are all pretty good. 964 vs 993, a systems analysis

All models have their issues/quirks. Just find one that makes you happy to drive and do not think of this as a logical/sane investment, just a play thing. The 964,993, 997 do make great daily drivers, though.

[curious sam]

It will be a daily driver. I'm considering an Avalon as a third vehicle for times I need a backseat/rain/etc or times the wife doesn't need an Expedition.

I fully understand buying a used 911 isn't logical or sane, but life is short and a 911 simply needs to happen.

Thanks for the quick replies and guidance!

Sounds like I do need to do some more research and test drives....

[WPOZZZ]

Originally Posted by curious sam

It will be a daily driver. I'm considering an Avalon as a third vehicle for times I need a backseat/rain/etc or times the wife doesn't need an Expedition.

I fully understand buying a used 911 isn't logical or sane, but life is short and a 911 simply needs to happen.

Thanks for the quick replies and guidance!

Sounds like I do need to do some more research and test drives....

To help us narrow down a 911 for you, perhaps you can answer these questions.

1. Why do you want a 911?
2. Do you need creature comforts or full on luxury?
3. Does resale value make a difference to you?
4. What is your budget?
5. What kind of BMWs did you have?

[curious sam]

1. I've always loved them. Family had them. FWIW, I don't want a boy racer set up - I want the smallest wheels possible, i.e. most tire, i.e. least likely to crack a rim.

2. I'm not opposed to creature comforts and luxury, but they aren't deal breakers.

3. Resale... good question. I'll either drive it into the ground or sell it in 3-5 years so that I can take Euro delivery of a new one.

4. My budget is flexible between $20-$40K, obviously less is better, but if the difference is made up in the lack of headaches and reapir bills - otay.

5. M3

[twistoffat]

Based on what you just answered I´d say a 993 C2. I´d never look at driving any car into the ground. Take care of them and they´ll take care of you thats my motto. 996´s the first of the water cooled for me have less soul unless its a turbo or GT3 and the first 996´s had engine problems. A good low mileage 993 is what you want. Get a pre purchase inspection done and if it comes up trumps then you´re in. Its the last of the air cooled beasts and maintenance is still relatively simple

[WPOZZZ]

Originally Posted by curious sam

1. I've always loved them. Family had them. FWIW, I don't want a boy racer set up - I want the smallest wheels possible, i.e. most tire, i.e. least likely to crack a rim.

2. I'm not opposed to creature comforts and luxury, but they aren't deal breakers.

3. Resale... good question. I'll either drive it into the ground or sell it in 3-5 years so that I can take Euro delivery of a new one.

4. My budget is flexible between $20-$40K, obviously less is better, but if the difference is made up in the lack of headaches and reapir bills - otay.

5. M3

If you're looking at a new Porsche in a few years, you could try something very different. That would be an air-cooled 911, 964 or 993. If you need ac in LA, you will want to get at least a 964 unless you want to retrofit your 911 with a Kuehl kit. I think the resale values are best with the 911 and 993.

As for M3s, this is how I would compare a 911 to a M3. Personally, I had an E30 M3 and love my 911 way better!

E30 M3 - 911
E36 M3 - 964
E46 M3 - 993

If you are getting a water cooled car, $40k will get you a base 997, whereas it could get you a 996 turbo with higher mileage. Come up a little more and a 996 GT3 is possible.

Just drive all of them to see which you like the best.

[billybek]

Best 911---- The one you can afford.

The worst 911---- The one you want but can't afford.

Good luck with your search and post pictures when you find "the one".

[WIL84911]

But if you prefer watercooled over the aircooled 993's may I suggest a 997 which looks way better than a 996.

[chuckr]

I'm in Monroe and on my third air cooled 911. All good advice above, get the newest you can. Older ones like mine, I have a 1988, do require a bit of maintaining on your own so if your are not capable, knowing a good mechanic is recommended. I find the joy of owning an older 911 to be part of the experience. I actually love working on my car and it is not that much effort or that difficult. Good luck in your search.

[Peter Zimmermann]

I humbly suggest that you log on to Amazon.com and place an order for the 8th Edition of my book, The Used 911 Story, which covers the beginning through 2005 models. You just never know what you'll discover!

[81SCRosewood]

Originally Posted by Peter Zimmermann

I humbly suggest that you log on to Amazon.com and place an order for the 8th Edition of my book, The Used 911 Story, which covers the beginning through 2005 models. You just never know what you'll discover!

I'll 2nd this! Thanks for a great book Peter.

[rds993]

Get an SC any year. The motors are bullet proof.
I had one for 10 years with lots of mods. It never let me down-once!
Rich

[Rodsrsr]

Based on what your criteria is Sam, I would agree that the 993 is your best match.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Originally Posted by Rodsrsr

Based on what your criteria is Sam, I would agree that the 993 is your best match.

Totally agree.

[jackb911]

I've owned pretty much everything Porsche made (except a 944) since I bought my first one in 1972, so I speak with some experience...

In your situation, I'd recommend a '92-94 964 Carrera 2 or a 993, preferably a 1995 model. These cars are very reliable and have air conditioning that actually functions as air conditioning should.

In Louisiana you really don't need the extra weight/complexity of 4 wheel drive. Unless you live in snow country the 2 wheel drive versions generally have better resale value. And while my favorite Porsche to drive is the '87-89 3.2 Carrera with the G50 transmission due to the more "involving" driving experience they offer, the A/C systems on these cars are horrid unless you spend thousands to upgrade them. My 3.2 is a "weekender", not a daily driver.

Every 911 version since the first one has it's strong and weak areas. None of them are perfect. The later 964's are especially good value for money and are probably the most underappreciated 911 of all. Stay away from the 1990 models unless the cylinder head sealing issue has been addressed.

[bdisco]

I fully understand buying a used 911 isn't logical or sane, but life is short and a 911 simply needs to happen.

^ You'll do just fine around here.


great info > http://www.pelicanparts.com/911/technical_specs/911_guthrie_faq.htm

[curious sam]

Gentlemen, you are a wealth of information and I thank you.

I'm looking at 993s now, but I have to ask about the 1995 cars - why are they more desirable than a 1996 or 1997?

As far as AWD vs 2WD - I like the stability and peace of mind AWD allows for. I will likely take my car to a driving school or two as I'm aware that physics can and will eventually come into play with regard to where the engine is placed on those cars... I know AWD isn't a cure all for driving stupidity, but I also know my S60R feels faster than my M3 did and yet I have never even come close to feeling like I was on the edge of losing traction.