Do I have to remove the CV shafts (g50 tranny) to get the rear torsoin bars out????

[RichHawk]

Really, I'm pissed. I hate it when the car beats me.
And I'm upset at the posts I've read that make pulling the rear torsion bars out seem like it should be a 20 minute deal.
I fought for 2 hours this evening and failed at getting even one off.

87 Targa, with G50 transmission. I've got everything disconnected and can't get the droop needed to unload the torsion bar.

So with it drooped down as far as it's able, I figured that's got to be enough. Nope. Unbolting the radius arm cover plate from the chassis each bolt was trapped from tension, as are the radius arm to trailing arm bolts.
Yes the shock and sway bar are unbolted and not touching.

The only thing left that I can even think of is the CV shaft to joint binding up and not letting me get the full droop until I remove the inner joint from the transmission..

REALLY!??? do I have to take the d@mn axles loose?

Here's a couple pictures of the current status. The jack isn't touching anything.




Richard, the frustrated.

[James Brown]

See that shock? the yellow thing? Put a jack under the trailing arm, rase a bit, remove lower shock nut, remove shock, lower arm. Proceed with torsion bar removal.

[RichHawk]

Originally Posted by James Brown

See that shock? the yellow thing? Put a jack under the trailing arm, rase a bit, remove lower shock nut, remove shock, lower arm. Proceed with torsion bar removal.

Did that first. Shock is dangling, and touching nothing on the lower part.
Richard

[James Brown]

Ok, so the trailing arm is in 'neutral' (no load on it other than axle )? Than you need brute force to get them out. Look for several HELP threads on removing them. Most likely there rusted in and/or torqued in. That and the rubber is most likely fused to the cover. Have you removed the torsion plate? (pulled outward) with the floor jack under it to releave tension, then when clear bolts, drop jack.
Once removed, and left in the neutral position, you can measure the angle for reference.

[RichHawk]

Originally Posted by James Brown

Ok, so the trailing arm is in 'neutral' (you can move it up and down a bit)? Than you need brute force to get them out. Look for several HELP threads on removing them. Most likely there rusted in and/or torqued in. That and the rubber is most likely fused to the cover. Have you removed the torsion plate?

That's actually the problem. The Trailing arm is not "neutral". I can't wiggle it by hand. It does move up and down with the jack, but the jack goes down more, and the trailing arm hangs up. There is a good 6-8 inches between the bottom of the rotor and the floor. The spring plate is not angled down as far as I would expect it should be. It's not covering the bottom hole of the mount plate.
It's not the shock
It's not the torsion bar
it's not any of the cables or lines.

I'm down to two things. Either the CV shaft is binding up and it won't allow me to droop low enough, or the Trailing arm itself is binding somehow.

Has anyone removed torsion bars on a G50 Transmission car, and done it without taking the CV shafts off?

[pete3799]

You need to jack the spring plate up to get the weight off all the bolts on the end of it and
remove them. then the spring plate will swing down all the way.
All 4 bolts in your last picture must be removed.

[James Brown]

the jack goes under the stamped metal part, not the trailing arm, just enough to take weight off from the bolts. pull out, then lower the jack.

[D911SC]

I recently removed my radius arm and have similar difficulties. The adjustment bolts in the centre of the arm were 'fused' in so I used a jack to relieve the tension on the arm and carefully tapped out the bolts that connect the radium arm to the trailing arm. This involved some PB Blaster and gentle swinging of a weighted hammer. Once these bolts were out I was able to pry the radius arm off the trailing arm.

I hate to say it but this was easier than actually removing the radius arm from the torsion bar!

[Tom '74 911]

Richard -

Am I reading your situation correctly in that jacking up the trailing arm makes the binding WORSE, not better? You need the trailing arm to swing LOWER to relieve the tension?Could you try to use the adjustable eccentric bolt to lower the arm as much as it will allow? Maybe that extra little bit will make the difference?

I think people are confused because the tension typically happens in the other direction, so a slight amount of jacking UP is what's needed. (maybe I'm not reading your situation correctly though).

Tom

[Tom '74 911]

Also - you should not have to take the CV's off to get to the torsion bars.

[KTL]

Agreed the CV axles don't come out to remove the spring plates. Keep playing with the jack on the trailing arms to relieve the load on the spring plate. I've pulled the torsion bars on my G50 a number of times and the axle was in place each time. You'd be surprised how much droop there is on the trailing arm before it unloads the torsion bar. Don't be shy about jacking up the trailing arm a good bit to unload the torsion bar.

You'll notice when those bolts finally do come out that the threads are smushed in the location of where the bolt is inside of the trailing arm and spring plate. Point being is those bolts are routinely stubborn to insert or remove without some coaxing.

One of your pictures shows the alignment eccentrics still in place. Remove those now because they are also loading the trailing arm. The toe eccentric pulls the trailing arm fore-aft to set the toe and the camber eccentric pulls the trailing arm up-down to set the camber.

When you get the spring plate off, don't be surprised if you have a stuck torsion bar in the spring plate. My car is virtually rust free and even mine had a torsion bar that didn't want to come out of the spring plate's long tube (not the torsion bar housing in the chassis itself). Don't be shy about whacking that torsion bar back and forth or in & out to break that rust free. Use PLENTY of grease on the bars and splines upon reinstallation. Preferably a good quality synthetic water resistant grease.

[RichHawk]

yep that did it.

I was hesitant to jack up the radius arm thin plate of metal directly for fear of bending it. And when I did jack it up by the plate metal radius arm, it didn't noticeably move relative to the bolts or the swingarm. But it DID remove enough tension that the bolts drove out easy with a few easy swings of the plastic deadblow hammer. And when the last bolt let go, the pivot arm sprung down a good couple inches, as it also slipped off the jack lip from my pounding. (I'll be more careful withthe next side)

Finally I understand how you can lose reference. The Torsion bar sticks to the OUTSIDE splines, and comes out with the radius arm. It took me holding the torsion bar in my hand, and smacking the radius arm with the deadblow a couple times to get the two separated.

Cleaned and re-inserted, T-bar covered with grease, all bolts and adjusting cam bolts coated with anitsieze. now to try to guess at the correct angle placement, and then get the bolts back in.

Thanks Will Ferch!
911 Spring Plate Angle Calculator

And thanks James / D911SC !

Richard

[James Brown]

So anyway, my guess is your lowering the car?

[RichHawk]

Originally Posted by James Brown

So anyway, my guess is your lowering the car?

Yep, Added Bilstein sports all around, and needed to lower to Euro Height. I had 1.5 inches needed to drop out of the rear to get it to Euro height after Bilsteins.

It all worked fine. Using the Harbor Freight Digital angle gauge made getting the angle of the banana arm easy, and spot on per Will's directions.

[jimbauman]

Adjustable spring plates make everything sooooo much easier FYI....

[James Brown]

This lowering is free, adjustable spring plates are how much??

[midnight911]

man, this thread was entertaining.

nope, i'm not gonna go back and mess with the splines. my ride height is in the range of stock adjustable spring plate allowance. i stay low...like i've been told to when learning how to tackle...

:-)