The engine is back in now what

osidak · 02-24-2002, 10:01 AM

I got my engine back in after a rebuild. Everything is hooked back up correctly (I think). I put oil in it and disconnected the coil wire and tried to crank it. All I got was a loud clicking like I had a dead battery

I charged the battery up over night and tried again. Same thing. The battery reads 13.98 volts when I put my voltmeter on it. I checked to make sure the car was out of gear and it is (wheels will rotate freely when off the ground)

I also checked to make sure the engine would turn over by hand, which it does but requires some effort which I believe is due to compression. The ground strap from the transmission to the chassis is connected. I haven't checked the wiring connections on the starter itself but I tapped the started a few times with a hammer (this worked once on my MB 240D)

I am at a loss and would appreciate any advise on where I should start. Thanks in advance and the car is a 78 Euro SC

Doug Zielke · 02-24-2002, 10:09 AM

Loud clicking?
In other vehicles I've owned that always meant a starter solenoid that was trying (unsuccessfully) to engage the bendix drive to the flywheel ring.

Reasons: Low voltage at the solenoid; a defective solenoid or bendix drive. I'm sure there is more. At the very minimum, double check all electrical connections and grounds. Good luck!

Early_S_Man · 02-24-2002, 10:26 AM

Did you put the ring gear back on with the clutch pressure plae? It wouldn't be the first time iot was left off by mistake!

If ring gear is in place ... remove the starter, and disassemble the bendix mechanism, clean thoroughly, and lubricate with a good moly grease like Swepco 101. Test the starter off the car before reinstalling.

osidak · 02-24-2002, 10:43 AM

I put the ring gear back on. Is it possible that I put it on backwards? I took a photo of it when I putting the flywheel on but I m unable to find them right now. I will locate and post when I find it (if it is possible to put it on backwards that is)

osidak · 02-24-2002, 03:56 PM

Ok what is the trick to getting the starter out when the engine is still in the car. I have the lower 15mm nut off and all wires disconnected. The top 15mm nut is evading my wrench.

I suspect I will have to do a partial engine drop. Is this correct?

thanks

makaio · 02-24-2002, 04:01 PM

You don't need to drop the engine at all. What I did is took a 10mm allen wrench, cut the L portion off and stuck the remainder in a 10mm 6 point socket. It's a PITA, but you can do it.

osidak · 02-24-2002, 04:07 PM

Mine has a 15mm nut on it. It doesn't have an allen key barrel nut. Any other ideas

Early_S_Man · 02-24-2002, 04:07 PM

Osidak,

The upper nut is a 10 mm barrel nut, requiring a 10 mm hex drive bit.

The easiest way to get at it is by putting the tail up on jack stands, and remove the left rear wheel. You can reach over the transaxle, and get to the barrel nut with a long extension to get the ratchet back past the body of the starter. Good luck!

makaio · 02-24-2002, 04:10 PM

I made this after I finished my starter install. I just took an old 1/2 drive socket that a 10mm allen wrench fit into. Welded a section of steel rod, and then welded the allen head to the rod. Total length is 8 " and is a perfect fit with a 1/2 " drive socket wrench, for the top barrel nut.

osidak · 02-24-2002, 05:40 PM

Mine is definitely a 15mm nut. I just went back and looked at photos that I took before a disassembled the engine. It must have been changed by a previous wrench as I marked where are the nuts came from and I have before photos. I will try using an extension and bringing the ratchet to the back side of the starter. Thanks for the help.

I have attached a before photo

jkeyzer · jkeyzer's Garage

You may be able to use vice grips (if all else fails!) if you work by feel and spend an hour or so hugging your transmission. And you thought you were intimate with your car already...

makaio · 02-24-2002, 06:31 PM

Your starter looks like it was part of the Titanic, (all the rust)

I pretty sure there's no vice grip that will fit in that area and break that nut loose.

Once you get that sucker off, i would replace it with barrel nut.

And the best way I have found to test your starter, is take it to the local discount auto parts store, and have them test it on their bench.

osidak · 02-24-2002, 06:53 PM

It actually cleaned up nicely with very little effort. I gave thought to having it rebuilt while the engine was out of the car but decided against as it was working just fine before. Oh well live and learn.

I will try using an extension tomorrow when I get home from work. the wife is wanting some face time. If that doesn't work maybe I will do a partial engine drop so I have a little more room to move the wrench.

Where can I find a barrel nut on short notice. I assume it is a m10 thread?

Again thanks

osidak · 02-25-2002, 08:12 PM

Well I pulled the starter tonight, will take it by autozone for them to test it tomorrow. I took some photos of the ring gear while I was under the car. I think all is well with the way I installed it but take a look and let me know.

The trick is to use an extension to bring the ratchet back behind the starter motor.

How do I test to make sure the starter is getting enough current. When I hooked up a test lead to the large red wire and the grounded against the transmission I got nothing. How should I hook up my test leads.

thanks again for all your help

orbmedia · 02-25-2002, 10:05 PM

Jump 12V from the big red lead to the solenoid (+) and it should fire the starter. Make sure the car is out of gear.

Early_S_Man · 02-27-2002, 09:20 AM

I can't really be certain if I see a slight bevel or not on those ring gear teeth ... because of the angle and lighting in the pictures.

If the bevel is there and visible in person, then don't worry about it! But, if the teetth are truly 'square cut' on that ring gear, then it is on backwards, and should be reversed.

If the solenoid is clicking, then I suggest some moly grease like Swepco 101 be applied to the starter shaft and work (pull out) the bendix back and forth a few times before reinstalling the starter and trying it again.

skinnerd · skinnerd's Garage

Just finished installing clutch and trans on my 73, so am familiar with starter ring. From what I remember, you can really only put it on one way and have all the holes align (the attachment bolt holes, as well as the offset holes that the ring alignment pins go on).... so if it's bolted up, it's pretty likely you've got the starter ring on the right way.

I learned a really tough lesson with weak batteries. There is so much voltage drop in line between the battery and starter, that your battery needs to be in tip top shape to be able to work correctly. Depending on the shape of the battery, you can get anything from just clicking to a really REALLY slow crank .... neither works well. I even had my PowerStroke jumping a bad battery .... same thing; it wouldn't turn over. Believe it or not, there's also a big voltage drop through a set of jumper cables. Try removing the battery, and jumping directly from a running car into the + battery connector in the Porsche (effectively bypassing the battery). You'll have too much voltage drop through the jumper cables/starter power line to crank the starter!?!?!? Had to see it to believe it. Upon purchase of a new battery, the starter spun like crazy and the car fired right up. This may or may not be the problem, but make sure your battery is fully charged and doesn't have a weak cell or two (local battery shop can check this).

Good luck, Doug

john walker's workshop · 02-27-2002, 01:32 PM

from the looks of that starter, it should be completely rebuilt, or exchanged. then you get a new solenoid with it as part of the deal.

rob911 · rob911's Garage

Don't forget about the battery terminals, esp if the battery has been out of the car.
These need to be clean and tight. Had a cracked battery terminal on an old Fiat, the nut was done up very tight. Still the crack was enough to produce the same symptoms.
Measure the voltage at the starter whilst cranking - if possible