Piston oil squirters question

El_Mecanico · 01-13-2012, 04:57 PM

After cleaning the case I noticed there are oil orifices that must squirt oil underside of the piston. How do you test them. I tried blowing air with no luck. I did notice they move in and spring back out. The ones closes to the flywheel moves way further than the rest. Some jam up and move very little. I think I may have screwed one up pushing down with a scribe but not sure. I don't want to put this baby back together and wipe out an engine after a fresh rebuilt because of my curiosity. The one that was stuck leaks by air when I inject air into it. I can hear it coming through the bolt case holes...none of the others do it. Is this something that should be renewed? Please help!

Walt Fricke · 01-13-2012, 06:48 PM

Go to the 911 engine rebuilding forum. Do a search. Guys have come up with a variety of ways of closing off the various passages so air (with carb cleaner or brake cleaner) can be blown through the squirters to make sure they all will squirt. Takes a certain amount of pressure to make them work - maybe somewhere around 30 psi?? - there is a spec somewhere.

Steve Stomski sells some tools to do this sealing off so you can use compressed air. I suspect his website has instructions on how to use his tools, which will give you an idea of what is going on even if you don't end up buying his good stuff.

The squirters are basically a tube with a disk with a hole on the end you see, but held into the tube. Then a spring. Then a small ball bearing. Then the other end of the tube pinched down so the ball bearing acts like a seal. Enough pressure, bearing pushes up against the spring, opens up some kind of passage way, and the fluid squirts out as intended. The spring pressure deal is to insure that oil pressure builds up properly in the engine bearings which need it, especially at start-up and idle, where pressure is lowest anyway.

The squirters are held in their bores by "staking" the metal around them with a punch. If their bore hole is a bit longer than it needs to be, you could push the whole thing down some. But that won't tell you a thing. The only thing that counts is are they opening as they should so they squirt.

El_Mecanico · 01-13-2012, 07:24 PM

well looks like im going down the slippery slope. Two open about a half inch 3 and 6 the others about 30 thousands of on inch. And of course messing with them I jammed 2 with a punch. Looks like I'm going to take it to a machine to have them all replaced. THX and I did find all the write ups on the squirters. Is this something I can tackel myself?

gregwils · gregwils's Garage

I squirted a little brake cleaner down the oil passage, then used some old conical shaped rubber washers that were designed for a faucet to cover the opening. The washer had a hole in the middle. I was able to fire compressed air in the hole and see the brake cleaner spray a nice pattern. Seeing the spray pattern under pressure of compressed air made me feel comfortable that they were working as designed.

boyt911sc · boyt911sc's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Mecanico

well looks like im going down the slippery slope. Two open about a half inch 3 and 6 the others about 30 thousands of on inch. And of course messing with them I jammed 2 with a punch. Looks like I'm going to take it to a machine to have them all replaced. THX and I did find all the write ups on the squirters. Is this something I can tackel myself?

Go visit the engine rebuilding forum. There are a few threads not too long ago including my inquiries about oil piston squirters. It is important that you test the piston squirters before sealing the case to make sure that all of these are working properly. It takes lest than a minute to remove one squirter. The hardest part is making good stake indentations on the case. Post some pictures.

Tony

El_Mecanico · 01-25-2012, 02:50 PM

Tony,

I dropped off my case at a reputable Porsche macanic but I don't feel to comfortable cause hes not a builder but expert as a Porsche Mech...I'm going to pick up the block tomorrow and try it myself. Hopefully I can find the thread that states it takes less than a minute. He doesn't know about the passages and they need to be blocked off. If he makes the repairs no doubt the filling will end up in the oil galleries. I received my oil squirter's today.

Andy

Peter Zimmermann · 01-25-2012, 03:38 PM

The squirters are designed to open between 42 and 56 psi...

fastfredracing · 01-25-2012, 03:41 PM

I just did all six myself, I don't know if I would say one minute to get one out, I worked carefully , as this was my first time, and I had most of an afternoon in replacing them. All in all, not too bad of a job. You just DO NOT want to break off a tap , or drill bit in them or you will have a mess on your hands
Anybody here ever replaced piston squirters?
Here is the thread I started on this subject. Hope it helps

El_Mecanico · 01-25-2012, 04:03 PM

Fastfredracing,

Simply drilling a 5 or 6 mm drill and run a tap will extract the squirter's? I have to replace three of them and hoping that dilling into the squirter it will center itself and not damage the case. Once drilled how hard were they to pull out? Did you have to heat the case to facilitate it. I rather do the work myself than having some one with no knowledge about them.

Andy

boyt911sc · boyt911sc's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Mecanico

Fastfredracing,

Simply drilling a 5 or 6 mm drill and run a tap will extract the squirter's? I have to replace three of them and hoping that dilling into the squirter it will center itself and not damage the case. Once drilled how hard were they to pull out? Did you have to heat the case to facilitate it. I rather do the work myself than having some one with no knowledge about them.

Andy

Andy,

Use the closest size drill bit to the bore. The squirters are made of very soft material (Al) that the drill bit would grab it (squirter) as you drill through it. It would take few seconds per squirter. See the drilled out squirter in the previous post.

Tony

El_Mecanico · 01-25-2012, 05:31 PM

Tony did you first remove the interference of the stamped aluminum then proceed to drill the top cap and remove the spring and ball? Then drill out the shell?

Andy

boyt911sc · boyt911sc's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Mecanico

Tony did you first remove the interference of the stamped aluminum then proceed to drill the top cap and remove the spring and ball? Then drill out the shell?

Andy

Andy,

Use a drill bit slightly smaller that the bore. Better to go smaller that big. You don't want to enlarge the existing bore (ID). The aluminum case (if you have aluminum) is pretty hard compared to the aluminum material used for the oil squirters. The outer section or edge of the bore would have a slight deformation or smaller ID due to the 'stake' indentations. You need to remove this tiny deformation so you could slide the squirter out easily. I replaced only three (3) defective squirters and all came off stucked to the drill bit.

Just make sure you have the correct size squirters that would slide through the bore with minimum clearance around the perimeter. I read some people use adhesive to keep it in place but I never used one. The most critical part of the project is making those 'stake marks' that could hold the squirter in place after a pressure test. I had one squirter flew out during the test!!!!! Use a hand drill instead of a bench drill press. You'll be OK.

Tony

El_Mecanico · 01-25-2012, 06:59 PM

THX Tony...

El_Mecanico · 01-29-2012, 07:11 AM

Tony,

I went ahead and got back the case and did it myself. First I learned and the second one came out in about 10 seconds. The third was a PITA...but came out. Had to drill through the cap and pull the spring and ball to have more surface to grab the squirter. It was a little nerve wrecking but it worked. Now I'm ready to install should I apply the adhesive or just peen it? I was thinking about freezing the squirter than inset, is that a good idea? and one last question will it stop at a point or will she keep going down? THX for your help.

Andy

Before

Grounded excess

Removed

The key is making sure there are no dimples to restrict the removal. I should had been a dentist. I also blog the one case with a hose to blow out any debris from the oil gallery.

El_Mecanico · 01-29-2012, 10:26 AM

Well findly I installed three of them...Peening is the hardest thing to do. Its not pretty but she will hold. I hope!!! Altough I did test them with oil and air pressure 80 PSI. The first one was a PITA. Aluminum kept flaking off so I made a blunt round chisel. I did not use the locktite just in case someone had to redo it.