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-   -   R-12 to R-134a parts. (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/756307-r-12-r-134a-parts.html)

SilberUrS6 06-22-2013 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak (Post 7511124)
Thank you.

Well, at least there's a reason. Of course, the premises are incorrect - but hey, par for the course. (Pun intended.)

wwest 06-22-2013 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuehl (Post 7511177)
Wwest,

The post was directed to the original party whom started the thread.
What my post states is concise:
1) The host has a product here, ask them if it meets the criteria.
2) The criteria was stated.

The reason to ask the host about their product is that sometimes pictures are used which may not be an an exact representation of the product. Products change over time.

Now Wwest, I hope you have learned something here about marketing.

Marketing..? No, simple referral, possibly misleading referral.

Marketing, actually, might be the correct term to apply to the actual product source entity.

"loss leader"....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_leader

kuehl 06-22-2013 09:16 AM

No Wwest.

"Marketing" is what ever it takes to narrow the gap between the producer and consumer. Marketing entails everything along the path, including defining a need to defining the product, clarifications of the same, advertising, distribution, customer service... on and on.

And, your comments here on the forum on occasion do help. Although they tend to be idiosyncratic, repetitive, abrasive, long winded, childish, befuddled, whimsical, off the beaten path, absurd, off topic, rhetorical, out of context, and contain many spelling errors. But, we get it.

Bob Kontak 06-22-2013 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilberUrS6 (Post 7511202)
Well, at least there's a reason. Of course, the premises are incorrect - but hey, par for the course. (Pun intended.)

The reason given is a manifestation of the root issue which is wwest did not feel accepted by Kuehl on one or more occasions.

wwest is a good thinker and seeks affirmation that he is a thinker. The bigger the player, the greater the satisfaction derived from the positive stroke or affirmation.

When rebuffed, the defense mechanism, formed sooooo early on, is to deep fry the one that he was hoping to make him feel good.

In short, despising Kuehl is routine given it's just one in a thousand similar circumstances in wwests time on planet earth.

Hoping wwest can drop some of the meanness out of the discussions point forward

I still offer to spring for the expansion valve to move towards getting to the bottom of the engine heat "discussion".

billybek - pm me your physical address and I will have a new one sent to your door. The el-cheapo one but what the hell. It will at least provide us a starting point.

Pay up, you dirty dogs (and have a great weekend)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1371931811.jpg

billybek 06-22-2013 01:05 PM

I'm in.
PM Sent.
I am almost out of my lab/shop for the summer (42 working days off... Yay!) so no big hurry. I was hoping that someone with an old valve lying around would be able to send me one, but a new one will work just as well!
Cheers,

wwest 06-22-2013 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybek (Post 7511519)
I'm in.
PM Sent.
I am almost out of my lab/shop for the summer (42 working days off... Yay!) so no big hurry. I was hoping that someone with an old valve lying around would be able to send me one, but a new one will work just as well!
Cheers,

The point. TXV closing or no, has become somewhat mute once the realization came that there might well be several ounces of LIQUID refrigerant still remaining within the R/D at the time of the system shutdown. The TXV will meter this liquid into the evaporator very s l o w l y since the evaporator is already fully CHILLED and with no real source of warm airflow to meet the superheat criteria.

So, basically, that liquid refrigerant will act as a dam against the expansion of the upstream gas as it heats due to engine/exhaust. Can't expand, guess what, PRESSURE rises.

What say you...?

wwest 06-22-2013 04:17 PM

Okay, color me dumb, or just slow on the uptake.

I went to reinstall the rear lid condensor fans today and came to the realization that they maybe weren't needed. My 88 Carrera already has a fan that can be used in that manner.

How many of you have read the Bob Tindel tech note I linked to....?

Like my 996, the 90's series of air-cooled Porsche's have an after-run engine cooling capability.

All I have to do now is hook the trinary switch, once it gets here, into a TDR circuit that will provide after-run capability just as Porsche did.

billybek 06-22-2013 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wwest (Post 7511682)
So, basically, that liquid refrigerant will act as a dam against the expansion of the upstream gas as it heats due to engine/exhaust. Can't expand, guess what, PRESSURE rises.
What say you...?

Will not act as a dam.
This was discussed on a previous thread.
Cheers.

wwest 06-23-2013 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybek (Post 7511962)
Will not act as a dam.
This was discussed on a previous thread.
Cheers.

Link?

Meanwhile I don't see how a few ounces of refrigerant left in the R/D could NOT prevent the refrigerant gas remaining in the condensors just as the compressor shuts down from expanding.

billybek 06-23-2013 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wwest (Post 7512266)
Link?

It was your thread, you should know....

wwest 06-23-2013 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybek (Post 7511962)

Will not act as a dam.

This is what I mean about being classed an a simple naysayer, statements that appear to be mere personal opinion since there is no real stated logic behind it nor an substantive factual support referenced.


This was discussed on a previous thread.
Cheers.

Try as I might, search with many keywords, I cannot find any statements that rebute my statement other than like yours above.

billybek 06-23-2013 07:31 PM

I guess searching through the drivel that you have posted here is too much for you.
Why don't you hang it up for a while?

Bob Kontak 06-24-2013 12:44 AM

If you want to land a point, suggest not employing "simple" to describe someone.

Not so good for traction

kuehl 06-24-2013 03:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wwest (Post 7511682)
The point. TXV closing or no, has become somewhat mute once the realization came that there might well be several ounces of LIQUID refrigerant still remaining within the R/D at the time of the system shutdown. The TXV will meter this liquid into the evaporator very s l o w l y since the evaporator is already fully CHILLED and with no real source of warm airflow to meet the superheat criteria.

So, basically, that liquid refrigerant will act as a dam against the expansion of the upstream gas as it heats due to engine/exhaust. Can't expand, guess what, PRESSURE rises.

What say you...?

That may read as theory to you but it won't happen, and it does not happen based on past observations; as well for the fact the manufacturer of the TEV/TXV in question has also stated the TEV/TXV never fully closes. However, if you wish to prove your theory is a fact you need to provide the trier-of-evidence (this forum), something more substantial, more corroborating evidence by rule.

What you have consistently presented is hearsay at best.

To corroborate your 'theory' you need demonstrative evidence or documentary evidence that is relevant to the context of the discussion; relevant means about a 911/930 and its TEV/TXV.

There are plenty of past posts and threads you can find on your own where this has been stipulated over and over.

brads911sc 06-24-2013 06:02 AM

Well now we are getting somewhere... after two years... LOL

Quote:

Originally Posted by wwest (Post 7511700)
I went to reinstall the rear lid condensor fans today and came to the realization that they maybe weren't needed..


brads911sc 06-24-2013 06:23 AM

Welcome to the Official Naysayers Club. Cheers!

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybek (Post 7513177)
I guess searching through the drivel that you have posted here is too much for you.
Why don't you hang it up for a while?


billybek 06-24-2013 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brads911sc (Post 7513526)
Welcome to the Official Naysayers Club. Cheers!

I am honored to be accepted into this N.C.of N.A. (Naysayers Club of North America)
We may have to change the name of the club to the W.W.N.C. (World Wide Naysayers Club) the longer this goes on.

You know I did have some long thoughtful posts typed up for WildWest over the last couple of years to explain some of the things he was trying to grasp. I realized that he isn't really interested in the information, only trying to create friction and distracting from the original posters need for decent information. So I simply didn't post a response to his issues as I new they wouldn't be appreciated and were too far away from the OP questions or problem.

There was another man that was contributing that is a mechanical engineer that specializes in refrigeration systems that no longer contributes most likely for the same reasons. Too bad, he was/is a valuable contributor.

There is someone on this forum that has the correct idea as to how to handle someone like WWest. His signature line is "Starve the Trolls". In reality that what WWest is, a troll.

I do believe that he (WWest) is on a quest for knowledge and that he isn't a stupid man.
There is another signature line on this forum somewhere that perhaps he should try to abide by.
"A wise man once said nothing, he listened."

wwest 06-24-2013 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuehl (Post 7513382)
That may read as theory to you but it won't happen, and it does not happen based on past observations; as well for the fact the manufacturer of the TEV/TXV in question has also stated the TEV/TXV never fully closes.

Simple. Just post a link to the manufacturer's statement and I'll go silent on the subject matter. PS: all the statements at GTI seem to leave the door open on ythis matter while a few even imply that it opens from a closed position.

However, if you wish to prove your theory is a fact you need to provide the trier-of-evidence (this forum), something more substantial, more orroborating evidence by rule. What you have consistently presented is hearsay at best.

To corroborate your 'theory' you need demonstrative evidence or documentary evidence that is relevant to the context of the discussion; relevant means about a 911/930 and its TEV/TXV.


Just what is that float ball in the R/D for if not to indicate there is a "reserve" of liquid refrigerant available? Liquid refrigerant, until exhausted will act as a dam against expansion of the upstream gas.

There are plenty of past posts and threads you can find on your own where this has been stipulated over and over.

....


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