This can't be right- front end height adjustment
 

I've been doing a good bit of searching, and think my issue might be with re-indexing my torsion bar adjustment levers.

From what I understand, the levers are currently maxed at their lowest setting. However, I have a significant gap between the tire and both front fenders.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...928_145637.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...928_145620.jpg

And here are the passenger's and driver's side torsion bar adjustment levers. From my understanding, this position is fully 'lowered':

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...928_145720.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...928_145825.jpg


No matter which direction I turn the adjustment bolt, the levers do no budge. I have soaked them both in PB blaster, and tried gently prying them with a pickle fork and no tension from the bolt. Nada.

Thoughts? Where would I find a spacer puck if the car had one?

What this is telling me is the front struts are bottoming out against the bumpers. Search "strut bump stop".

Are you absolutely sure that is the direction for lowering it? Seems to me (and I am ignorant on this issue) that if you add tension to the spring the car goes up.

Back them off a quarter inch and drive around the block.

Suspension settling is required when you make these adjustments.

Puck is on top of the shocks. About a half inch thick if your car has them. 3" diameter or so.

Lots of folks here who know this stuff. You will get an answer.

Lower ride is best done with corner balancing and alignment.

You can drop the puppy to the floor if you re-index the adjusters. BUT it ride and corner like Bob's truck.......Oi.....

Like that's a bad thing.

Gud fer throwing bodies out on a corner.....

Just support the car under both front torsion tube covers and unscrew your adjustment bolt,then pop off the caps and reinstall them with the threaded part facing down.Afterwards screw your adjusters back in and it should give you more range for your lowering task !

Cheers
Phil

Thanks all for the replies.

Phil- If it's as simple as just re-indexing the adjustment caps, then that's great. I wanted some positive reassurance before removing the caps, though. It also gave me some time in the afternoon to clean the car for the first time in 6 months. She had quite a nice layer of mold all over the paint from sitting under a tree.

Would this not mean the car's height from the ground would be lower, though?

Not arguing, just wanting to better understand. SmileWavy

No because your car is still supported at the torsion tube covers ... all you're doing is reindexing the caps to give you more range.You can reach all that by under the car,just jack it high enough for access and you can do everything with the wheels on .

Cheers
Phil

Sounds great. Any advice for getting the caps off if they're stuck on?

Been doing some more searching and reading. I came across this:


It appears that the adjustment bolt is meant to run through the arm of the TB cap, and I imagine the turning of the bolt in either direction will cause the cap to 'ride' up and down. If this is the case, should the adjustment bolt be in constant contact with the stop? On my car, the bolts don't even make contact with the stop. If I turn the bolts to run them through, they get extremely tight and don't budge.

I guess I'll have to get the caps off and try to run the bolt through them off the car. I have a sneaking suspicion the caps may need to be re-tapped due to cross-threading.

What year is your car? Some US models had a spacer (doughnut) to raise the car for bumper regulations around 1976.

Car is a '77. ROW (Japanese, specifically) vehicle.

Yes and yes.
To remove the "caps" you need to jack up the car, remove the adjustment bots, then pry off the caps. You can then re-index them on the end of the torsion bars.
While in there it is a good idea to pull out the torsion bars and check to make sure they are not rubbing. This is common on older cars when the front a-arm bushings wear.

Remove adjustment bolts, pry off caps, check threading on caps and bolts (see my comment above about cross threading), replace caps on end of TBs with the arm facing downward, screw in bolt until the caps have rotated to the point of positioning the front end at the proper height.

Seems simple enough. Of course, theoretical processes aren't ever as simple as actual processes...

Question: If the adjustment bolt it meant to stay 'stationary' and in constant contact with the stop above the cap, how is it held in place? Is it possible that the cap or TB on my car is seized, not allowing the cap to move?

When you jack up the car the tension on the adjustment screw will be released. The end of the screw is not held in place, it is only forced against the upper part of the "bracket" by the cars weight.
Jack up the car and you will notice the tension on the adjustment screw is released.
This should allow you to unscrew the adjusting screw which looks jammed in place now.

It looks like the adjustment bolt hex head on yours is not through the access port like in Tony's picture.

Something is wrong. Jammed like trackrash says, maybe? The torsion bar can't spin with the adjustment bolt head hitting the bottom of the bracket rather than going through the hole.

Is that what I am seeing? Maybe the head of the bolt can't bee seen because of the picture angle?

Sorry - I did not see this before I posted my comment.

I need to just step away. :-)

Carry on.

What is the recommended tool/angle/procedure for prying off these TB caps? Mine seem pretty happy sitting where they are, despite soaking in PB Blaster.

Did you manage to get the adjusting screws out?
I have used a large screwdriver to get mine off. However, I have a through the body sway bar, not sure if yours is in the way.
Using two screwdrivers, prying the cap back and forth should get it off. Unless the cap is rusted on to the end of the torsion bar.... then the torsion bar will come out with the cap.

The screws come out no problem. The threads are all in good shape but just to be safe I hit them lightly against the bench grinder's wire wheel to clean them up. They look prefect. I tried threading the one screw into the cap and it wouldn't bite at all.

I used the biggest flat head screw driver I have access to in order to pry the cap off. No joy. I'll try again when I have some light. I only gave it about fifteen minutes before dinner with my parents.

I'm afraid of the answer, but if the caps are rustedto the torsion bars, will I need to replace the bars?

If the caps are rusted to the torsion bars they are probably rusted inside the control arm. The torsion bar will come out with the cap with some swearing and depending on which sway bar you have you may have to drop the bar to get clearance to remove toward the rear of the car and clean it all up with your trusty wire wheel grease it good reinstall and adjust.

Something does not compute here, those caps may have rusted onto the ends of the torsion bars, and the torsion bars may be rusted into the A arm splines, but with the adjustment screws out and the weight off the A arms the end caps should rattle around in the cross member housing. Maybe there is still torsion bar pressure on the end caps, you might need to remove the sway bar to allow more A arm movement to free the cap. This might happen if you are simply jacking one side of the car rather than lifting both fronts off the ground, dropping the front back down on axle stands and removing both front wheels.

I was jacking the whole front end up, dead center of the car at the chassis brace in front of the fuel tank. The wheels were not off the ground, though. Would this be the issue?

Yes the wheels need to be off the ground, otherwise there could still be tension on the torsion bars.
Jack it up all the way and post anther picture.

Right, I'll give it a shot when I get back to the car later this week.

Ding ding ding! Jacked until the wheels were off the ground, the caps came right off. The driver's side didn't want to let go of its buddy the torsion bar, but it came off easily enough.

So I've gotten the caps re-indexed, and the adjustment screws successfully through the caps clear to the stops. Will I need to lower the car back on to the wheels to put tension on the screw to begin the lowering process? Which direction must the screw turn (say, from the perspective of underneath the car) to lower instead of lift?

Thanks to all who helped. This truly is a great community.

Update: Good ol' trial and error. Lower the car to put tension on the A-arms, then turn counter-clockwise (that's loosening the adjustment bolt) and you'll be scraping the street in no time.

I went to 24" from ground to fender lip, dead center of the wheel. It's definitely low, but I don't think obnoxiously low. It looks much more appropriate of s sports car now.

Thoughts?

Before:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...928_174113.jpg

After:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...002_152440.jpg

It might be a tad lower than I ultimately want, but for now it will do to get the car to the mechanic for electrical work tomorrow night.

Yes, the car needs to have the wheels on the ground.
Counter clockwise looking up from the ground will lower the car.
Do a "rough" adjustment of your intended ride height. Drive the car and fine tune it.
Then you will have to get your car corner balanced.

You beat me on my last post.
As far as ride height goes, the front, when measured from the fender lip to the ground should be about 1/2" higher than the rear. Usually that means about 25 1/2".
Much lower and you are just bouncing on the stops.

Keeps me awake when driving my truck. Nothing like bouncing around on some potholes (and it bounces a lot) while trying to turn a corner with a plow sticking out the front and a 158" wheelbase.

Is that US or Euro height? IIRC, Euro height was around 24" in front, no?

I believe "Euro" height is 25.5" front; 25" rear. Much lower than that you will be running out of suspension.
I would recommend that you measure your rear height and use that as a baseline. Then adjust your front to be about 1/2" higher as measured at the fender.
Drive it around and see how it behaves at that height.
Any lower, as in the 24" range requires stiffer torsions, and other mods to work properly.

New torsion bars are on my to-do list, along with mostly new rubber on the entire bottom side of the car. Any particular diameter bar you'd recommend with this current setting?

As I said, it's a tad lower than I ultimately want, but with the amount of driving this car will see in the very near future, I can't imagine any issues as it is.

No, that's not even close. There really wasn't that much difference in height between the two markets and it was only for a period of time. The cars were the same for quite a few years.

JR

I can at least be confident in knowing that where she had been sitting was far from correct, for either market.

Anyone know what the ROW cars were spec'd at? This one apparently started life in Japan.....

The measurements for a '77 ROW 911 are 108mm/front and 12mm/rear. A US 911 of that yea was 15mm higher in the front and 25mm higher in the rear.

JR

My car is 24"f and 23.5" in the rear. I'm running 22 and 30 mm torsions with Koni sport shocks and poly bushings. My front spindles have been raised 22mm and my rubber bump stops have been cut down. I have a bumpsteer kit to compensate for the raised spindles and raised the oil lines in the rear for more clearance.

My car is great on the track or a smooth road. There are bumpy roads around where I live that I definitely avoid and then there are those pesky driveways...

Be careful what you wish for. Drive your car as it is for a few weeks and see how it behaves before you go any further.