a/c is it worth keeping ? r12

[IS300]

Hey will some help me out??? ...... bought a 911 with a A/C r12 installed... owner threw in a r34 condenser and compressor too... R12 system, is it worth something or toss it?

[Arne2]

Details, please. Year of car, types of compressors, etc. If you don't know the types, pictures will help.

[Ronnie's.930]

I've never heard of a r134 specific condenser or compressor . . .

[Arne2]

Originally Posted by Ronnie's.930

I've never heard of a r134 specific condenser or compressor . . .

Neither have I, but I figured I'd let that slide to get the discussion started.

[IS300]

sorry I must have the number wrong....I have the" york "square in now and was given the round "sanden"

[targa80]

Several questions need to be asked before you can answer your question.

1. Are you doing the work yourself or going to an A/C guy?
2. Does the existing system work?
3. If it doesn't, do you know where the system failed and are you willing to spend the time and effort to isolate the fault?
4. If it does work, is the temp change cold enough to suite your needs.
5. If it doesn't work and you have isolated the fault would you prefer to switch to R-134A or stay with the R-12. To stay with the R-12 you will need a licensed A/C guy to recharge the system.
6. If you are switching to R-134 and using the spare parts that came with the car, How much additional $$$ do you want to invest into the system.

You can go bare minimum R-134A (low $$$), with the new spare parts, stay with original hoses (non-barrier). Flush the system and change the Drier. Changing the drier is a must since it absorbs moisture/dirt particles in the system and with a leak it saturates with moisture. Evacuate the system by pulling a vacuum with a pump and make sure it holds the vacuum for an extended period of time (24 hours).R-134A can be procured from local auto parts stores. The gauges and vacuum pump can be procured from Harbor Freight for a reasonable cost for the DIY'er.

You can go with a high end R-134A system (High $$$) and procure all new parts from vendors that have add-on's to increase the efficiency of the system. Reading reviews of owners that went to the upgraded system, They for the most part are very happy with the upgraded system and get very low temps in the car.

You will have to figure out your level of involvement and see where it take you. Recommend reading as many of the A/C threads on this site to get a solid perspective on how to move forward.


I am going bare minimum and converting to R-134A and won't know how well I have done until the engine is back in the car and running. This pic is of my old York factory system pulling a vacuum out of the car.
I had two issues:
Rear condenser leak right at the connector ( had brazed welded for $50).
Leak in hose between drier and evaporator (tried to procure from Host, no joy, went with local hose guy had it made in 15 minutes ($76).
New drier from Autozone ($21)

[Jesse16]

Definitely worth something, always keep and sell anything vs. tossing.
Keep if you live someplace hot, have a wife, drive for work and sweat. You get the gist.
Toss if you're into losing weight, track car, never sweat, love heat, live in canada, only drive on "nice"days, hate to "look at it" when you open the hood. A million opinions on this.
I kept and upgraded mine on the 87, I drive my car a lot !

[JTL]

I would drive my car a lot more often during the summer if the aircon was working. My plan is to work on it just as soon as it gets a bit cooler in another month or two.

[Jesse16]

FYI, you probably already know this. Technically, R12 vs R134 is mostly (or maybe all) a matter of changing the o-rings and seals at every junction. Change to the green viton seals I think. Also hoses are a big item of discussion. Then the small and slightly subjective matter of it "working" regardless of the frig type.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by JTL

I would drive my car a lot more often during the summer if the aircon was working. My plan is to work on it just as soon as it gets a bit cooler in another month or two.

That is the exact reason I upgraded my AC. In July and August I just did not want to drive my 911. Now I don't care what the outside temp is, I am cool inside.

As the the question from the OP. We need more info. I also have never heard of a refrigerant specific compressor or condenser. I am not saying they don't exist, but I have never heard of them.

[IS300]

thanks...

1.. I would do some of the work, I have a buddy who does a/c work, who will help too.
2.. We are going to charge the system first, it blows air, but not cold...
3.. When surfing the board, its seems most have said to covert to the newer round compressor ...
4.. Would I need to change all the parts, or just the compressor?
5.. The other option take it out and have no A/C...

I have read posts... looking for some answers....... keep in for resale , doesn't work well anyway, save on weight, looks better with it out of the car.....

[GH85Carrera]

How hot is it where you live?

In 2011 & 2012 for the first two weeks of August the average temp was 106. One day it was 113.

Many folks will say rip it out and save weight. Are you looking to make the fastest track car? If so rip it out if you are a really good driver. If you are the average driver you will never notice the difference in weight.

How often does it rain there? Can you drive in a car with the windows up and not fog up the car? There are many decisions only you can make.

If you have a buddy with the guages and vacuum pump and basic AC knowledge pull a vacuum and recharge with R-12 and be done. To change to 134 will take more work and some new fitting and new oil and some flushing.

Read the AC threads on Pelican. Ignore the bickering and read what others have done and why.

[Bleedsblue]

My 911 has been converted, but my M5 hasn't, and for me none of the above factors into my decision to convert the M5 to R134. The only factor that mattered to me is that R12 is simply not (legally) available anywhere near me.

There was one shop that every other shop/dealer sent R12 cars to, and that last bastion gave up when their R12 equipment broke last year.

The conversion at minimum requires O-rings/seals, a new receiver/dryer (at least for BMW), valve adapters, and for the compressor to be R134 compatible (many R12 compressors are already, not sure about Porsche ones).

[gptom]

Do R-12 hoses need to be replaced as well as the O-rings?

[Bleedsblue]

Ideally, R134 can leak from them.

[targa80]

The factory air in my 80SC has flare fittings and not "O" rings. So, depending on the year of your car will tell if it is flare or "O'" rings. The original non-barrier hoses were designed with miniscule pin holes the length of the hose to leak the R-12.The amount of leakage is minimal and the system will need to be charged periodically. The new barrier hoses are designed without the pin holes so they do not leak . Fortunately, R-134A is cheap and available compared to R-12. In my own case I cannot justify spending the $$$ on all new barrier hoses especially since there is nothing wrong with the factory hoses I have. Granted, one of them can blow at any time since they are at least 34 years old. I will deal with that situation when the time comes. Right now I just need to get the engine back in the car so I can charge and test the R-134A mod.

[T77911S]

when i get tot he AC on my 930 and i am sure the leaks are fixed, i plan on using R12.
unless i have to rpelace major parts, i may consider 134

[IS300]

Hey thanks..... looking at the old threads... I did not get the info you guys gave me

[dicklague]

there is another gas you can use that is very efficient. Look it up.