so how easy to fight a radar ticket in CA?

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

rat bastards...

2 lane highway (Kanaan-Dume for the locals), CHP going the opposite direction nabs me with radar (so he says) I saw him coming around a corner towards me (he had other cars in front and behind him), then in my rearview mirror I saw the light go on and knew he was going to turn around. I thought it was for my missing front plate, but lo and behold, he says his radar said I was going 69 in a 55 zone.

I asked him about when the radar was last calibrated and he said I could subpeona that information but he didn't know.

OK...I can do traffic school and erase the point, but is it worth fighting? Seems that being clocked by radar when the cop car is traveling at speed in the opposite direction should be shaky. Any experiences?

surflvr911sc · surflvr911sc's Garage

Doh! Pulled over twice in a week! It amazes me how 19 911s can fly up the mountains and have no trouble at all but this guy clocked you through a car, in traffic, doing 15 over.

I have only had one ticket in my life (knock on wood) and didn’t even try to fight it. I just figure the next one I get I’m due for. I’ll pay the fine, do traffic school and hope I can go at least another five years before the next one.

I am thinking about getting a detector though. Why go willingly?

RoninLB · 11-23-2002, 09:08 AM

Dear Doctor.
. "worth it" if it's your kind of action.. probably not. if it was you wouldn't ask.. I would start at the Nat'l Motorist Ass web.. not at my computer, so can't give more site info.. I think one of the first things to do is a "not guilty" immediately, some kind of time limit to be able to keep this dance in motion.. and they rent a book/info kit to present your case.. I think if you are a big PIA to the traffic collection agents that you could have it reduced to a non moving ticket.. but you have to move fast, I believe, to get this thing in motion.. If you kick a$$, you have better than a 50/50 chance to win.. in my world it's better than that.. so, I believe you need a few hours of research NOW........Ron

Fun911 · Fun911's Garage

Nostatic,
Sorry to hear about your ticket. I am a police officer in the Orange County area. The radar you are speaking of is very common with the CHP. The radar (constant on) can be selected to scan from the rear of the unit as cars pass (or approaching from the rear) or the front when they are approaching. The radar is directed towards oncoming traffic and away from vehicles in front of it. As vehicles approach and pass through the signal, the radar takes in account your speed and the actual speed the patrol unit. The onboard computer calibrates the two opposing speeds and an adjustment is made. The final product, your actual speed.

I am not a traffic officer but from experience these types of tickets are rarely lost. That doesn't mean it can’t be contested or won, but after wasting many hours waiting in line at the courthouse just to fight it, and later losing, it seems not to be worth it (my opinion). But if you feel you were not speeding and possibly a car traveling next to or near you were speeding, then by all means fight it.

The radars at my department are calibrated every three months. After being adjusted, they are usually no changes made with adjustments and documented as such. With that said, judges don't give that excuse much thought when it come to contesting it. The traffic officer will often times have that information with them at the time of court. These guys do their homework before arriving. But it doesn't mean they always win, but they do most of the time.

Nostatic if you want to get those RPMs up, come through my city. Worst case I would give you a warning over a cup of coffee. But as for the ricers, no love is there for them. I guess I am a sucker (bias) when it comes to stopping a Porsche

I wish you luck and take care !!!!!

stormcrow · stormcrow's Garage

There are a couple of questions you might ask.

Were there vehicles in front of him?

It is possible that he picked up a vehicle in front of him instead of you.

How far away was he when he picked you up on radar?

The farther away, the wider the beam so it is possible he picked up another vehicle and thought it was you.

Was it a four lane or two lane?

If it was four lane, you have a better chance of beating it because he could have either tagged the car in front of you or behind you, or any vehicles in his lane.

If it was two lane, then you would have to be his next vehicle when the radar was activated.
Cars close together cannot be distinguished unless they have the new radar system which could sort out two cars along side each
other.

If he was on a curve, was his radar beam pointing directly at you or at an angle?

Just some questions to ponder over.

Steve

"A Porsche does more then just go fast in a straight line"

78silversc · 11-23-2002, 11:34 AM

Question nostatic:
How fast where you going?

ronb · 11-23-2002, 12:07 PM

Fight it. Next time though, wait to ask about calibration until you're in a courtroom, at which time if you're going down that route ask when the calibration tuning rods themselves were calibrated, and can you see the documentation of that. However if you're on the calibration arguement, you're in a pretty bad place, because cops, judges, and attornies all understand that the calibration arguement is the last refuge of a desparate pedant (although it does work sometimes). Mostly the reason it DOES work is because you're showing that you will fight it. They want the $$ not necessarily to add points to your license and insurance. If they offer to let you pay the fine but for a parking violation, take it; you cannot offer this though. Try to say that you were in a pack of cars; never question the officer's integrity or training, just that things happened so quickly and there were so many other cars around, that it's possible another one might have been shot. Bring up reverse discrimination, it gets a laugh sometimes, ie I got pulled over because I was a porsche, but really the car is 23 years old, and it's more a nostagia trip for me, than a rocket...hell any 4 cylinder honda can whip right past me. Look as sincere and geeky as you can; get there ahead of time, so the officer can offer you a deal before going to trial; if all else fails you have the right to an appeal, if they are not budging, and you should take it because that is sometimes when they will offer you a deal, because they want to be done with you and move onto getting revenue from someone who is going to roll over more easily. Be polite and firm the whole time.

Doug Zielke · 11-23-2002, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ronb
............Look as sincere and geeky as you can..........

Get that, Todd?
Sincere and geeky.
(Pay the ticket. Buy a Valentine.)

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

geeky I can do all day. Sincere? That's another story. As far as how fast I was going, well I'm not really sure. I can say that I wasn't on it at all, and I wasn't on anyone's tail. The basic speed law in CA is that you don't go faster than safety allows. They can use that to pull you over for speeding even if you are going under the speed limit (bad conditions), but of course you can't use it as an excuse for going over the posted speed limit.

So if I was in fact speeding why fight it? Using the spirit of the CA speed law, I was totally in control of my vehicle, and was the least threat possible to anyone else. What is safer, me in my 911 going 65mph (no cell phone, no stereo on, well tuned, good tires, etc), or some bozo in an SUV doing 55mph while drinking a latte, talking to his/her buddy, and changing a CD? Of course in the end it doesn't matter...

I'll probably just pay the fine and do traffic school, because I'm not sure I want to spend what little free time I have navigating the court system. Plus I was technically over the speed limit, but I hate to burn traffic school and have to be extra good for a year.

Obviously I must get a V1 for xmas

Neilk · 11-23-2002, 01:06 PM

Todd,

In Texas you can get "ticket lawyers" that will take care of your tickets for about $75. My brother has had really good luck with them. I am not sure if that is a good option in California.

Otherwise, do whatever is necessary to avoid the points.

Jack Olsen · 01:17 PM

Online traffic school. God's gift to 911 owners (at least until 'Repeat Offenders Traffic School' enters the picture).

pbs911 · pbs911's Garage

Quote:

Bring up reverse discrimination, it gets a laugh sometimes, ie I got pulled over because I was a porsche

LOL. You need to move to Newport where you could ask with a straight face wether he was sure it was your Porsche he spoted or the 2-3 others.

It's not like you were going triple digits. Don't waist you time in court. You will not be able to tell a liberal LA judge that the cops radar misjudged your PORSCHE! Pay the fine, do the on-line traffic school, save yourself some grief and get a valentine one. Anyone in for a group buy on teh Valentine?

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by pbs911
Anyone in for a group buy on teh Valentine?

Wayne? How about a "930S wheel" equivalent deal for V1s. I'm in for one, possibly two (my wife has 300hp and a heavy foot).

Moses · 11-23-2002, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pbs911
Anyone in for a group buy on teh Valentine?

Count me in. My 300 HP SC is guaranteed to get me in some trouble. What I also need is a clever V1 stealth install. Any ideas?

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

Sam, that picture will get me a DUI to go with my speeding ticket.

BYantzer · BYantzer's Garage

http://www.helpigotaticket.com/index.html

Check it out, it has everything you need to know.

RoninLB · 11-23-2002, 03:36 PM

Quote:

[i]Originally posted by swbsam
. so I will show up the day after christmas and hope the cop doesn't. but if he is there... only if the cop doesn't show do I win. I'm crossing my fingers. [/B]

there's some paper work BS, or some technique.. that you call the court the day before and ask if the cop postponed.. you may be allowed 3 postponments.. If he didn't, then you do.. do it the max allowed.. not sure the reasons, but the info is out there...man, a speeding ticket is an insurance company's Merry Christmas.. better if you can find out when the PO goes on vacation.. I believe also that the court has a specific time allowed to bring you before a judge.. I heard that sometimes they fail to do that.. in some places you can ask for a jury trial. which makes the bureauracy nuts ..........Ron

yelcab1 · 11-24-2002, 05:38 AM

Fight it, there are many reasons to.

1. Cops may not show (CHP will, it is in their job description)
2. You may get the judge to believe you (highly unlikely)
3. The cops and the judge will make mistakes in law (very likely), in that case, you will lose but you have a very good chance of winning on appeal.

4. Finally, after tying up the 1 first judge, 3 appeals judge, 2 court clerks, the DA (must respond to an appeal), a bunch of bailiffs, and untold paperwork, the small amount of money they collected from you will pale in comparison to the $1000 it costs them. And if you win, so much better.

Dougster · 11-24-2002, 05:44 AM

Its well worth the effort! Do your homework. I have had some luck/skill against "the man" But odds are, its tough to win if you actually make it to court against them. Even if you have a good case...Its all about the MONEY! And they want YOURS!

Zeke · 11-24-2002, 06:40 AM

I've often wondered how a cop can not show up for a court session. It's part of his job to testify. Don't they get demerits?

Anyway, my wife beat her last ticket on just that, the cop didn't show. She was rolling the dice and she knew it. In Long Beach, if you lose, you lose the taffic school option. You pay and you get the point or two on your record.

I've had very few tickets in 40+years of driving. I've never done the school. I don't have time for that or fighting the ticket. I say pay it and move on.