Spark plug non fouler

[Tori]

I cringe at the responses i'll get with this, and am a bit embarrassed to ask this, but here goes.

Anyone else care to admit using a non fouler spark plug adapter in their p-car ? (it's okay if you want to say "you have a friend that did"

So here's my deal. 1987 3.2 105K. I know i have worn valve guides, i've just done a compression test (high 188#, low 150#) and a leak down test. (6% - 20% range. -20% on the low comp. cyl. #6)

I've looked in the cyls with a bore scope and can see streams of oil running down the cyl. walls in a few cylinders, and plug inspection shows 5 pretty decent plugs, and the #6 was oil fouled.



The car was running one step hotter plugs in all holes, and i'm considering running 5 correct heat range NGK coppers, and one of the old hotter plugs in the oily #6 hole to combat the oil.

QUESTION: I was considering using a non fouler in #6 to keep the car from running crappy after it's sat for a few days. It will always mis on #6 for the first 3-4 minutes until this plug cleans itself.
Is this a bad idea ?

I will eventually get around to properly dealing with this problem, but for the time being, thought i'd try this. The car is not a daily, or a track car, just a weekend warrior.

Okay.... flame suit on. GO!

[Avanti]

If the problem gets worse I would consider it to buy some time. If you didn't already check where the 20% leakage was from (rings or valves) find out. Big difference on how much engine repair you will need to correct the problem. About the plug fouler. If I remember, the boots on the spark plug wires should have a good seal on the engine cool tin. With a fouler installed the plug and plug wire will be higher and the plug wire boot won't seal. Others more experienced can comment on if a poor sealing spark plug boot will really increase the heat on that cylinder bank very much.

[RedCoupe]

If I recall, the non-foulers were nothing more than a gap that a spark had to jump before the energy finished the journey to the spark plug. This has the effect of increasing the voltage to that particular plug. Another way to get the same result is to widen the gap on the "problem" spark plug. As indicated, a hotter plug on the cylinder that is pumping oil can also reduce the fouling. But, as I'm sure you already know, all these fixes are only temporary. A top end overhaul is the permanent solution.

[Tori]

The 20% leakage was out the rings. I could hear the air escaping thru the oil tank.

I know the boot won't seal anymore at the head, but if that's a critical point I could fashion a temporary one I'm sure.

[Tori]

Originally Posted by RedCoupe

If I recall, the non-foulers were nothing more than a gap that a spark had to jump....n.

That's not what it is at all.

Basically it's a small precombustion chamber. It takes the exposed electrode out of the oily condition

[RedCoupe]

If it were me, I would be inclined to try adding a good additive to both the fuel and the oil and drive the snot out of it for a little while. Could be stuck rings on the problem cylinder. After driving it like you stole it for a while, re-do the leak test.

[Tori]

Yep, that's in the plan too. I work at a repair shop and we have a carbon clean machine that I planned to use on it. It'll hopefully have some degree of impact. I took pics of the carbon buildup on the piston tops and am anxious to see what it does.
I'm not holding out for a miracle, as I hope to drop the motor in the next month.

[ClickClickBoom]

Try driving it for a week straight, like a daily driver. Change to Brad Penn 20-50 and drive it like you stole it.
Porsche heal thy self!
That car cleaned up its act, sounds like you have gummed up rings on old #6.

[Tori]

You're post gives me hope. I like hope.

I think my car was driven like yours in its past life. I will give her a thorough flogging. Especially if i make the upcoming track day i have plans for.

Check out these shots from the bore-scope. A damn river flowing from the head. This after sitting for about 3 hours.

[wayne robson]

Tori, no problem, give it a go ,as long as you use the correct Fouler
size and type with crusher washer,also do it with cold engine with your
hand until stops, dont over tighten it.I used these years ago on old beat up old
Buicks ,and also a xje Jaguar that had burt valves in one cylinder, in sacramento photos
of couple of types i still own, regards .love your Grand National,i can import one
after next year our crazy thirty year left hand drive rule.

[Tori]

Thanks Wayne for the vote. I actually just came in from the garage after installing it. Didn't hear any argument for not doing it, so i gave it a go. Of course it's raining today, 1st time in about 9 months so i cannot road test.
Anyway, i used the correct one, and it was a real PIA to install. It puts the plug high enough in the well that the socket fouls on something under the cover. The took kit socket which works fantastic in the normal install wouldn't work, and a typical 13/16" plug socket gets bound up once tight. I had to reach in with small needlenose pliars to pull it out.

It's running, and seems to idle smooth, so we'll see if this has enough impact to matter one way or the other.
Can't believe i have a non fouler in my $40K 911

[zedsn]

Let us know how it works out.

[ClickClickBoom]

Originally Posted by Tori

Of course it's raining today, 1st time in about 9 months so i cannot road test. [/URL]

You won't drive in the rain? These are all weather cars and they do their best when all the other cars roll over and stay home.
I do commend you for keeping my next car nice and low miles though!!!!!

[Tori]

Originally Posted by ClickClickBoom

You won't drive in the rain? These are all weather cars and they do their best when all the other cars roll over and stay home.
I do commend you for keeping my next car nice and low miles though!!!!!

Yep, that's right. I'm not interested in driving it in the rain. There's not a spec of rust on this car, and i prefer to keep it that way. I have other cars for that duty. Happy to keep it cherry for you though, just be prepared to pay up for it.

[T77911S]

what about a valve stem seal. could that be the problem?

[Tori]

Wanted to share an update on this... After about 850 miles i pulled the #6 plug and non fouler out for inspection. It has definitely helped my random misfire on cold start up (after sitting for a few days) That problem is pretty much non existent now. In fact i'd forgotten about it until tonite when thinking back on the symptoms i was experiencing.

Here's a pic showing how the plug is burning.

[Tori]

Originally Posted by Avanti

.......If I remember, the boots on the spark plug wires should have a good seal on the engine cool tin. With a fouler installed the plug and plug wire will be higher and the plug wire boot won't seal.

Also wanted to respond to this. This is not an issue. The upper seal on the plug boot can be pushed down the boot till it reaches the valve cover. Works like this just as it did in the stock configuration.

[lpsalsaman]

Originally Posted by Tori

Wanted to share an update on this... After about 850 miles i pulled the #6 plug and non fouler out for inspection. It has definitely helped my random misfire on cold start up (after sitting for a few days) That problem is pretty much non existent now. In fact i'd forgotten about it until tonite when thinking back on the symptoms i was experiencing.

Here's a pic showing how the plug is burning.

Tori, the plug seems to be burning clean given the circumstances. I have the same problem with my #3 and like you I added a fouler but for some reason I was still getting some hesitation. So I took it out, widen the gap on the new plugs and it's a bit better but not much. Maybe I need to redo all of the plugs again as far the gap is concern and add the fouler again(?), did you left yours at 28 or did you gap them up?

[Tori]

LP, i kept the gap on all the plugs at .028"

BTW, part number for the non fouler HELP # 42004

[lpsalsaman]

Originally Posted by Tori

LP, i kept the gap on all the plugs at .028"

BTW, part number for the non fouler HELP # 42004

Tori,
Thanks for the reply Bro! I got the fouler part right, and I did had my gaps at 28 like is supposed to but for whatever reason I still had some hesitation with mine. Anyway I did took the fouler out and re-gap my plugs with a wider gap, it is okay now but I'm sure the hesitation will come back once the #6 gets a bit more oily. Got to save more $ to get that top end done!