Engine de-carbon

[Tori]

Wanted to share a positive experience i had with my car that i strongly recommend after feeling the difference it made, and backing up the results via leak down test.

My car has worn valve guides, this i know for sure. I recently did a compression and leak down test with 10% and 12% leakage on two cylinders.

I work at an auto repair shop and we have a machine that runs a chemical thru the injectors which not only cleans them, but will remove carbon build-up on valves, pistons, and rings. It's called a POWER CLEAN 2000 and should be a fairly common tool at many shops.


The machine has it's own fuel pump, so the cars fuel pump gets disabled and then you hook into the supply and return lines at and near the fuel filter.

I did this service about 500 miles ago and have actually felt the difference in acceleration since. The improvement has been very noticeable. I redid the leak-down test a couple days ago and verified it also helped with cylinder leakage.

Here are the before and after numbers. ( 1st number is the before % followed by the after % )

CYL. #3 2% .... 1%-------- CYL #6 12% .... 7%
CYL. #2 2% .... 1/2%----- CYL #5 2% .... 2%
CYL #1 10% ....2%-------- CYL #4 2% .... 2%

Now, having the machine to myself i did perform the service twice. Takes about 1.5 hours each time so it took awhile but was certainly worth it. I believe it cleaned up the spray pattern of the injectors, along with helping those two cylinders seal better. My car is AFAIK still an original 105K motor, so this may not be as big a benefit on a motor that has already been gone thru. But for the rest of us still running untouched engines i would definitely recommend finding a shop that has this machine and giving it a try.

[DRACO A5OG]

Wow, I guess you now how to get me up there eh?

But seriously, please keep us posted in 6 months to a year if this cleaning holds up. Love to see the year after numbers :-)

J

[Tori]

You know i'm down to do this for you, but with a pending engine overhaul in your future i don't think you'll see the same results as me... but i guess that just depends on the condition of your injectors.
This cleaning has done wonders for vehicles before. Cars that appear to have a burned valve/valve problems thru other tests have been cured with it before.

[zippy_gg]

Tori, I like your Binford 2000!

[Tori]

Originally Posted by zippy_gg

Tori, I like your Binford 2000!

I know right. LOL I felt silly typing that.

[DRACO A5OG]

Well with my high numbers, I definitely have carbon build up on 1, 2, 3 & 6 ( 170-174 PSI )

Spec is 10.3:1 so if my calculations are correct, 10.3 x 14.7 (atmospheric pressure) x 1 = 151.41 PSI

#5 is 160 PSI within 10% of spec?

[Bill Douglas]

I wish there was one around here. I'd use it.

I'm a firm believer in getting carbon off valves and valve seats. I always do an Italian Tune on my SC before I do the valve clearances so none get adjusted incorrectly tight.

[Tori]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

I wish there was one around here. I'd use it.

I bet there is... it's not an uncommon tool for a shop to have. Especially now with all the Direct Injection engines coming out now. Some shops may call it a fuel injection flush/cleaning machine. Just ask what they have and if they have a dedicated machine for cleaning injectors, and how it does what it does.

[michael lang]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

I wish there was one around here. I'd use it.

I'm sure there is also. Just look for the BG sign out front of any shop, they undoubtedly will be able to do it for you.

[tirwin]

How does this machine work? Is it pressure or chemicals?

You hook it up just past the fuel pump and then it recovers on the tank return line?

Would this still work on CIS cars or would it only work on Motronic and later?

[Tori]

Originally Posted by michael lang

I'm sure there is also. Just look for the BG sign out front of any shop, they undoubtedly will be able to do it for you.

This isn't a BG service. We also do BG products, and the BG service would be good to perform also but it cleans a different way and area. It would introduce the chemicals thru the throttle body and clean the throttle body, intake, valves, pistons and rings.

[michael lang]

Tori, I'm not going to split hairs with you about this. You just described what BG's induction service does. I've been selling that process for years at the dealership I work for. It's okay, those maintenance services do have value and offer the benefit of all the things that you experienced. Unfortunately there are too many people that claim those maintenance services to be a waste of money and falsely accuse the shop for offering such a maintenance service as being crooked and selling "snake oil". I usually find those folks to be very uneducated about gas, heat, ignition and lubricants.

[Tori]

I know that's what I was describing. That was my point. I think you missed it. ��

One thing i dont understand is why you included the "unfortunately......." part. Doesn't seem like it applies to the thread. Only now adds confusion.

Do you guys have an injection flush machine?

[uwanna]

Originally Posted by Tori

I bet there is... it's not an uncommon tool for a shop to have. Especially now with all the Direct Injection engines coming out now. Some shops may call it a fuel injection flush/cleaning machine. Just ask what they have and if they have a dedicated machine for cleaning injectors, and how it does what it does.

I don't quite understand how this machine works. Being hooked to the fuel pump and return, does the "special solution" used, burn like fuel in a running engine or is it just recirculated thru the fuel system. If not used in a running engine, how does it clean up carbon? I know how the BG system works with a running engine, but this sounds like
different procedure.

[Tori]

As mentioned in the initial post, the machine has its own fuel pump. You dial in the pressure needed to idle the engine, pour the cleaning chemical into the machine along with gasoline then start the engine. Idle till solution is used up. It's approx. 4oz. Of the chemical and half a gallon of gas.

It can be used on any engine, you just have to hook into the fuel supply line.

[DRACO A5OG]

I and others are Jelly

[michael lang]

Tori, what I meant by unfortunately there are too many people... was that they make it that much harder for guys like you and me to help people with the problems with their cars so people come into our shops with extra thick walls up.
Good for you though, the results that you received are exactly what that induction service was intended for. It bought you some time so that you could prepare for the the actual repair. I think based on the numbers you saw, you could actually take your time doing all your research on what you wanted to do and collecting all your parts first before you did your rebuild. Good for you!!

[RSTarga]

I bet this is the equivalent of a couple of cans of Techron and a good 100 mile run.

Without the fun.

[Tori]

Originally Posted by michael lang

Tori, what I meant by unfortunately there are too many people... was that they make it that much harder for guys like you and me to help people with the problems with their cars so people come into our shops with extra thick walls up.
Good for you though, the results that you received are exactly what that induction service was intended for. It bought you some time so that you could prepare for the the actual repair. I think based on the numbers you saw, you could actually take your time doing all your research on what you wanted to do and collecting all your parts first before you did your rebuild. Good for you!!

Tell me about it, as a service advisor i deal with breaking down that wall all day long. Luckily, most of the guys here are not like that.

I knew this wasn't going to fix my problem of worn guides, but hopeful that it would make some impact, and curious to see just that.

My tear down may be coming soon though.... the Buick goes to paint and body in the next week or so and that'll free up the needed space in the garage for an "engine out" experience as they'll have the car for a couple months.

[Tori]

Originally Posted by RSTarga

I bet this is the equivalent of a couple of cans of Techron and a good 100 mile run.

Without the fun.

Techron is good no doubt. We for sure see internal differences with customers who use Chevron gas primarily. It's good for maintaining, but no where near the strength of a commercial grade cleaner.

Hey Mike, i suppose that's what you were talking about. LMAO