Center mount oil cooler/ radiator ducting ideas/ suggestions

[jarrodblake]

I need a some advice on my Center mount radiator ducting for my back date restomod project. I'm looking to mount the third radiator out of a 996 it's about 29Wx7.5Tx2.5D Though I may just have a custom one built. That aside I have been collecting ideas for a center mount setup for years. I have made a rough mock up of what I am planing on doing. Thought I don't know if it will flow well enough. For the size of the radiator. My plan is to make some sheet metal ducting on each side on the inner nose of the car. My main concerns are there will be a flat panel behind the radiator about 3 inch behind it. There will be two 6x6 square holes to the ducts on each side if the panel. The exit will also be 6x6 and will exit into the wheel well pretty much inline to the brakes.

The flat panel, The holes are not cut in it yet.







This area can be opened up a bit more.

[Elombard]

What motor?

I think that will work.

Have you considered going out the hood

[jarrodblake]

At the moment I have a boxster 2.7 engine for it but I don't know if i'm going to use it. Going through the hood is a no go. I thought about it as if done right it "could" also provide some downforce at high speed maybe over 120 but I don't really see me utilizing it. I know its a clearer path but I also plan on installing an Air jack behind the panel.

[Tremelune]

I think you have a lot more research to do if your plan is to install a water-cooled Porsche engine in an air-cooled chassis. From all I've read it is a significantly involved swap. There isn't really a way to adapt one to a 915 or G50 transmission, and there is no room for a later transmission without a ton of cutting.

An LS swap would be much simpler (as there are sorted kits available), and you'd wind up with over 400 cheap horsepower. An air-cooled 3.6 swap would have a much higher parts cost, but is almost drop-in simple in comparison to any water-cooled swap.

Cooling is low on your list of concerns for a swap like this, so I would spend more time getting the drivetrain sorted 100%. With the number of monster air-cooled race motors in some of these cars, and the existence of a well-regard kit for water-cooled motors...this is pretty much a solved problem without having to do all the customization you're proposing.

If you're still goin'...:

Most ducting I've seen goes into the frunk area then down out of the floor in front of the gas tank. For what it's worth, my '84 with a '95 3.6 had a center-mounted oil cooler with no ducting, no hole behind it, and nowhere for the air to reeeally go and was raced in this configuration (fanless Carrera cooler in the right fender and a center cooler) by the previous owner and he said he had no trouble with excess heat. The bumper/valance was a '73 RS style:





Here is a thread for a car with a Renegade Hybrids setup for a Chevy LS that has substantial ducting for a radiator up front:

RSR LS Conversion

[Trackrash]

I think you are on the right track as far as the ducting goes. You might want to look at what a Boxster S has up front. I believe those have a center coolant radiator and two oil coolers, one on each side.
The air cooled 911s with a center mount oil cooler typically had a center duct that dumped down under the gas tank.

[Elombard]

TRE sells the sheet metal duct that Gordon is talking about. Have a look at the pics. If you have not seen the duct it might give you ideas.

I think the Box S has 3 radiators. The only oil cooler is the one on the filter console (I think).

[jarrodblake]

Originally Posted by Tremelune

I think you have a lot more research to do if your plan is to install a water-cooled Porsche engine in an air-cooled chassis. From all I've read it is a significantly involved swap. There isn't really a way to adapt one to a 915 or G50 transmission, and there is no room for a later transmission without a ton of cutting.

An LS swap would be much simpler (as there are sorted kits available), and you'd wind up with over 400 cheap horsepower. An air-cooled 3.6 swap would have a much higher parts cost, but is almost drop-in simple in comparison to any water-cooled swap.

Cooling is low on your list of concerns for a swap like this, so I would spend more time getting the drivetrain sorted 100%. With the number of monster air-cooled race motors in some of these cars, and the existence of a well-regard kit for water-cooled motors...this is pretty much a solved problem without having to do all the customization you're proposing.

If you're still goin'...:

Most ducting I've seen goes into the frunk area then down out of the floor in front of the gas tank. For what it's worth, my '84 with a '95 3.6 had a center-mounted oil cooler with no ducting, no hole behind it, and nowhere for the air to reeeally go and was raced in this configuration (fanless Carrera cooler in the right fender and a center cooler) by the previous owner and he said he had no trouble with excess heat. The bumper/valance was a '73 RS style:


Here is a thread for a car with a Renegade Hybrids setup for a Chevy LS that has substantial ducting for a radiator up front:

RSR LS Conversion

I really don't like the idea of running the ducting underneath of the car or running one large radiator. I'm trying to keep it porsche, I looked through the thread I just can't talk myself into doing it. Though I would love to have that ls swapped 996. With that said, I'm undecided if I want to turbo the 2.7 or just swap in a 3.4 or 3.6. The 3.4 would only cost just a little bit more than turboing the 2.7 as I would need the boxster S transmission. That said it would only be about 10HP difference between the turbo 2.7 and a stock 3.4. I am way past the point of no return, did i mention I converted my 911 to mid engine? If I run the 2.7 My drivetrain is 90% complete. I'm down to the small stuff like my radiators brake pedal placement, Sheet metal work, roll cage and coupe conversion. Super wide fender flares to fit the 996 suspension and bit of body work.

Originally Posted by Trackrash

I think you are on the right track as far as the ducting goes. You might want to look at what a Boxster S has up front. I believe those have a center coolant radiator and two oil coolers, one on each side.
The air cooled 911s with a center mount oil cooler typically had a center duct that dumped down under the gas tank.

That is pretty much the plan. The third radiator out of the 996 is the same one used in the boxster S.

This is the third radiator I plan on using installed on a RWB 964 with a turbo 3.6 996 engine. He has the radiator installed upside down which I think is a bad idea as it probably has a huge air pocket in it. But he also has a custom made set of side mount radiators like I plan on doing.

Originally Posted by Elombard

TRE sells the sheet metal duct that Gordon is talking about. Have a look at the pics. If you have not seen the duct it might give you ideas.

I think the Box S has 3 radiators. The only oil cooler is the one on the filter console (I think).

You are correct it. I really don't want to duct air to the underside of the car.

With all that said since there are no real big complaints about my ducting plan I went ahead and started on the upper ducts. I bought a new die for my bead roller so I tried my hand a some cross hashing. I think they turned out ok. They could be better but they will be painted.

[Tremelune]

Do you have a thread going for this car? A mid-engined G-body would be quite ideal.

For the amount of work you have and will put into this car, I think the cost difference between motors is negligible, no? Throw a 991.2 3.8 in there...You must have hundreds of hours into this thing!

[aston@ultrasw.c]

Excellent work!!

All great fabrication projects start with the plywood and cardboard phase

Through-the-hood cooling scheme!

[jarrodblake]

Originally Posted by Tremelune

Do you have a thread going for this car? A mid-engined G-body would be quite ideal.

For the amount of work you have and will put into this car, I think the cost difference between motors is negligible, no? Throw a 991.2 3.8 in there...You must have hundreds of hours into this thing!

The build

1970 911E yard find.

The way I see it I can do a 3.4 swap for 4k after I sell the 2.7 and trans. Or 4k to turbo the 2.7. A 991 3.8 to do it right would cost over 20k to do.

Originally Posted by aston@ultrasw.c

Excellent work!!

All great fabrication projects start with the plywood and cardboard phase

Through-the-hood cooling scheme!

Thanks! I don't know what I would do without my Chipboard. It makes making templates so easy.

[aston@ultrasw.c]

Every Pelican shipment comes with free template material!!!!

[3rd_gear_Ted]

FYI
The 964 nose has more room behind it than an IROC nose for the center cooler.

[Cook&Dunning]

I have been following this project since the start - amazing skills and imagination!