Questions about a 912E

[msort81]

Hello
Rennlister and lurker here, this is my first post at PP.
I have been looking for a 2.0 Porsche for a while. Background my dad used to have an old 2.0 911 which I loved. I really like the momentum car feel the combo of lighter with the 2.0 means you have to drive fairly hard and close to the edge but that is not just about outright brute power. I can not afford a really nice 2.0 911 and live on the East coast so have been seriously considering a 76 912 and have looked at and driven a couple of decent examples, neither of which were right.
I do like the look of the blue car currently listed on the Samba TheSamba.com :: VW Classifieds - Best 1976 Porsche 912e Ever. I have read a bit of its history, and while the price is high it does seem like a really nice example. What i am curious about is the frequency with which this car seems to be changing hands. I have read a couple of threads on the car and I know the magazine guy described it as the best ever. Hyperbole aside what does bother me is that for a low production number model it seems odd that a truly good 912e comes up for sale this often. I was interested two years ago when the original owner offered the car but he had it listed at north of 21k, before it sold for the article on buying a 912.

I've been over to the 912bbs. Not to be rude but I don't want to get into it over there. There is quite a lot of admiration for the car and the original builder (who looks to have done a great job) and the Mens Journal writer seems a bit like the site poster boy, so i'm not sure id get an objective opinion. The original owner who built the car apparently eventually sold it for low teens and the magazine guy flipped it on a few months later for somewhere around $20k after his article came out, having done little or nothing with the car.
Now its listed on the Samba for $20,500. I have emailed the current owner about its condition and whats been done. I am considering going down there to see it but its quite a distance so really just wondering has anyone actually looked at it or if anyone has a recent objective opinion on the car. I have an idea of what I think its worth but welcome objective thoughts on the car.
Thanks

[Dave L.]

Well, the deal with the guy writing the article was that he was a Rolling Stone journo, and the story was going to be published in that mag, but presumably he didn't pitch well enough to make ink - and ended up publishing in a far less prestigious rag after all was said and done. From what he wrote, and his prolific posting while searching for a car, he made it sound like he was extremely keen to buy a nice example, but had a limited budget. I take it he convinced the guy in Texas to let the car go for a lower price than it might honestly have justified. After the story appeared and soon thereafter the journo type threw up his hands and declared he was broke (or some such thing) and as you rightly say, he flipped the car for what appeared to be near its original advertised price. From everything I've seen, the car appears sound and was a true preservation candidate in a rare color.

Although the prices of 912E model Porsches have been all over the place in the last several years I own several, and have tracked them since about 1995 when I moved over from my only previous 4-cylinder Porsche, an early series 912. I paid $16K, $12K and $15K for mine, which are pretty nice cars two with especially prized mechanical rebuilds by a famous engine builder. I didn't pay more for my really nice 911! I'd probably expect realistically to get around $15K or so for any of them today.

In contrast to my cars, some examples- in 1995 a super-lo mile original E in near concourse shape was touching $16K, Some years later a super preserved original car with just a few thousand miles from new in Talbot Yellow went for nearly $20K (still in delivery wax under), and later in about 2002, a super low miles bright red car in TX (if I recall) was sold for about $20K and flipped a couple of times around that price before disappearing. The only prototype I know of was sold by Mr. Bergk in Stuttgart to a local dealer and then went for $26K to the prototype museum in Hamburg (despite my trying to buy it.)

Cheap and worn cars are numerous and may go for a few thousand dollars (even if they only made 2099 examples) and excellent quality preserved cars are tough to find and tend to be more than a comparable 911SC these days. Many Porsche fans on various bulletin boards see this as a particularly lousy deal. The early 912s, especially soft wiindow targas and outstanding original cars have hiked from the around the lo to mid-20s to over $50K in the last two years.

Opinions are cheap! Here's mine: I believe the blue E is a deal at around $17K, but because of its particularly rare color and generally excellent condition it may credibly go for more. I would have bought it if I could have had the deal that journo guy got! I recommend you look carefully. These cars are not generally much sought after unless someone has a particular taste for them. "Lots of thrash, but no grunt..." I love 'em anyway.

Good luck! Keep us posted if you examine the car, and post pics for a better evaluation.

R/Dave L. Charter 912 Registry, PCA, lotsa cars, etc.

[msort81]

Thanks for the feedback. I agree that premium examples can and should command a high price. The 65-69 cars are climbing to really strong $ numbers, and not just for the 911 longhood cache. I do think the type 923 will always be a specialty Porsche and that there are not that many really good ones that come up very often. I was too late on this one when it was for sale in Texas. I did contact the PO Brian about it but I really didn't think he would let the car would go for low teens.
Sorry to hear he got stiffed by that journalist. Really ironic considering how the guy was trashing one of the sellers in his article about money and then he turns around and flips the car for a big profit..

Overall I think I am always just a bit wary when a good car keeps coming up for sale. However now my curiosity is piqued so I will try to see the car this week.
Thanks for the feedback.

[deathpunk dan]

I know the following bc the writer is my neighbor and I know who did the work on the car (no connection). I'm not posting this on his or anyone else's behalf - haven't seen the man in some time.

How someone who paid 15k for the car and spent another 4k plus on it after getting it home, then later selling for less than that total (sales tax not included)is 'flipping' it is beyond me. He also spent a few grand on PPIs on other Porsches as well.

The car was here in RI in august 2010, the article was written in the fall of 2010 and was newstands in dec/jan 2011. I know bc I bought a copy of the magazine in San Juan PR and got a kick out of reading the story while I was there on vacation. The car was sold in what, may 2011?

And if you think the present sale price is out of line, it was advertised @ 26k in 2010.

[sm70911]

If you expect to make the money you spend back on Porsches I think you would be pretty disappointed. Sales tax and PPIs are the price of entry. Besides he did himself a favor getting PPI's after his night time 2002 purchase.
Its moot but your neighbor used people. Just reading his posts at 912bbs its pretty clear he fluffs the PO and presumably makes out he's getting the story in Rolling Stone. He takes on the mantle of keeper of the 912e flame, but then blows it out very quickly after his story comes out. Maybe he didn't make a lot but he made enough and tried to make more by putting it on ebay and saying the article increased its value.
I think he is a pretender. He knew exactly what he was doing. I think the PO got dazzled, he was pretty effusive about what good guy the Journo was, and how he had turned down more money for the car to give the car to the guy.

If he the journo could afford $4k presumably he had more money than he said. That must make the PO feel like a fool. The thing is $4k on a 912e that's supposedly worth $26k and the best one ever ... Not sure what the 4k could be for, maybe Transmission rebuild ? Heater boxes ? rare OEM muffler ?
I know he bought some steelie's with the wrong offset, and re built the pedal cluster. Pedal cluster rebuild is not 4k on a 912e ... is it ? even with a shop doing it. He knocked up a bad roof rack, that looked like about $5 worth of alu tube.
If there was something up with the car why not share it. That would be useful to Msort. I'm curious if it was the original owner who while asking 26k was selling a car needing work.

Gotta say I think Msort81 called it : Its the irony of it all : What did the Mens Journal guy say to that guy who get a better offer on one of the 912s he wanted " Its only money" or something. The way he presents it I'm surprised he didn't give the Best Ever 912e away to someone judged to be worthy. But no he didn't, in fact he stuck it on ebay, welcomed overseas buyers and pimped out his article.

Over the years in my business, and met plenty of people like him. Trying their damnedest to charm whilst being earnest with heart on their sleeve, they always turn the self deprecation up to 11 ... but underneath they're always pretty slippery folks.