VR6 conversion...it has begun :)

[mike mueller]

well, okay, so all I've done is buy the motor

Should be fun in a 914......

Specs of the motor:

6 cylinder, 2.8 liters
175HP w/175 ftlbs of torque (bone stock as of now)
6500 redline (easily 7k with minor work)

not too sure of the wieght of the motor, aluminum head, iron block

overall length of the engine is 21"
the widest part of the block/head assembly is about 9"

with the intake and exhaust, the width of the motor is 20"

from the crank centerline to the top of the motor: 18"
from the crank centerline to the bottom of the pan:8.5"
I half-measured my /4 and from the crank to bottom of the motor mount bar, it looked to be about 8" or so.

it looks like it'll be tight at the top/rear of the engine, it might possibly hit the trunk in the same spot the Chevy V8's distributor hits, luckly, I should have room to move the engine/transmission forward an inch or so if need be.....

1st picture is the "front" of the motor (in a 914)

2nd picture is the drivers side

and finally, the rear of the motor

[Alfred1]

Neuspeed has a $200 chip upgrade that they say will get you a 5 - 7hp increase at the wheels.

Here's some more engine parts that they offer.

[mike mueller]

I'm not going to use the stock ECU..... megasquirt for fuel and EDIS crankfire for ignition....

[Alfred1]

The VR-6 has been on Ward's ten best engines list. Should be fun in a 914.

[mike95125]

Mike,
How do you change the timing on th EDIS. I have a ford 6cyl that I would like to use, but as I recall the timing is stationary without the other engine computer. Are you coupling it to your MS?
Thanks,
Mike

[lapuwali]

EDIS requires some computer control to have any advance curve at all. It's fixed at 10dBTDC otherwise, which is only useful for limp-home or idling.

There are several code revisions for the MegaSquirt that will allow control of the EDIS along with (or in lieu of) fuel control. EDIS does so much of the work that the ECU really doesn't have to do much at all (intercept the PIP signal from the EDIS control box, look up the advance from a table based on RPM and MAP, and send back a SAW signal based on that advance value). There's also one or two EDIS only non-MS boxes available that completely decouple the fuel and ignition control. Google on MegaIgnite for a link page holding all of the various MS and MS-like options. If you're doing carbs and EDIS, the MegaJoltLight Jr. setup from Brent Picasso looks like a good system.

[mike mueller]

one version of the MS that will control the EDIS that I plan on using uses the fast idle circut to control the EDIS....the fast idle circut is for warm up in cold climates(aux air valve), I don't think it's that big of deal to remove it for my application...I'm not using one currently on my 1.8 and the car starts right up.

[Porschekid962]

oooh this sounds very interesting, how much did the motor cost you btw?? vr6 engines are a blast, my godfather has an original mini cooper with a turbo VR6 and it flies.

i can just imagine the fun with that motor in a 914 though. please post up pics as it goes in if you can

[lapuwali]

Good god, how did he get it to fit? Did he lengthen the nose?

[Dougs914]

I like this. How are you going to do the
motor mount for it?

[Porschekid962]

lapuwali, im not too sure how they got it in there. my godfather lives in europe and test drives cars for audi. as a little present to him ferdinand piech, an old friend of his from racing porsche's had the factory put that engine in the car for him along with 4wd, its a beast.

how is the install going?? im very anxious as i am about to buy my first porsche, a 914 and am considering all cost effective engine transplants for more power.

[mike mueller]

I like this. How are you going to do the motor mount??

The VR6 engine has bosses cast into the case near the "front" of the engine on both sides, you can see the factory mount on the 1st picture, it's on the lower left hand side of the engine.

In the 2nd picture, under the alternator, I'll remove the aluminum bracket for the a/c or power steering pump.

I still have to remove the oil pan and see if how far down the crank swings and see if I can move the location for the oil pickup tube. If I can safely modify the oil pan and there is enough room under it, I'll use the factory /4 mount bar with new brackets.

I'm also toying with the idea of doing something similar to the bulkhead /6 mounts and using the bosses on the side of the block.

Not too sure how "cost effective" the swap will be so far, the costs are:

$500 for the motor
$600 for new flywheel, adaptor plate and Stage II pressure plate (9")
$400+ for the new radiator/fan and ducting

the making of the motor mount and any little brackets will just be my time and cost of the material

[Jason Porter]

Sounds like a pretty inexpensive option to me. Can't wait to hear how it runs. I think the coolest part is that there are turbo kits and such galore for those engines, so future upgrades are possible.

[Alfred1]

Check out this Golf with a turbocharged VR6 that they claim makes 640 hp at the wheels. Also, HPA Motorsports offers a twin turbo kit for the 12V VR6 that "will boost your cars horsepower to an astounding 400hp at the crank" .

[mike mueller]

there is no shortage of hop-up parts for these motors...I've been talking to a fellow back East that is running a mid-engine Corrado that has been twin-turbo'd.......the car is simply amazing

[Alfred1]

How expensive are the VW parts necessary to rebuild the VR6? Just for comparison, Redline Weber sells an aftermarket f/i system for flat-fours for $3200 but HPA wants only $2800 to install a twin turbo on a VR6. I'm not crazy about drilling holes in my car for the cooling system etc. but if I can get a 400hp motor for about the same price as building a 2270, I might consider it.

-----

Edit: Looks like the $2800 is just the cost for them to install the twin turbo package.

[Alfred1]

So do these things fit in a 914 or not? I'm considering diving in without looking first. It's only money, right?

[yousaidpoo]

Just raising a few questions because i had been thinking about doing this swap for a while, but not knowing of anybody thats done it, i figured i would wait.

1) What are you planning on doing for clutch and accelerator(sp) linkages?
2) Shift linkage?
3) Exhaust?

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

I don't think he's gonna use the whole drive train. Probably just the engine. Clutch linkage and shift linkage would be stock--the shift linkage might need to be modified to go around the sump of the motor, or maybe not.

Throttle linkage is likely going to be stock, or a trivial modification. The VR-6 engines use a single throttle-body setup just like ours, so no complicated monkey-motion (e.g., dual carbs) is required. Just fab a bracket for the cable, and go!

Exhaust will pretty definitely have to be completely custom. You might be able to get some headers, but they'll be facing the wrong way (to the side in a 914 application) so you will have to do some modification at the very least. A full-on custom-fab system is not the worst way to go...

--DD

[yousaidpoo]

the exhaust was my biggest worry. fortunately the parent company of where i work has a moderately sized machine shop where i could probably fab an exhaust. assuming i get to tackle this project too