914-6 a/c

[Turboman]

Hi, I am in the process to install an original 914 VPC system in my 914-6.
Like all my projects, I work on a budget.
First I bought all the parts about 5 years ago, then I refurbished all parts, (professional cleaning, expansion valve) installed the condenser in the front trunk as designed, temporary installed the evaporator console under the dash, and start the preparation process for the compressor installation.
I want the installation to be as close as possible to a factory one.
For me, is not an option a compressor under the engine, a serpentine belt or similar. I prefer to work extra time, and reach a perfect end product.
I used a double pulley from a 74 911, in order to install the pulley and have space for the dual belts, I have to shave a bit the original engine support and the engine cover (see photo).
I fit a 2.2 or 2.4 bracket. So far no problems, the end result looks very nice
Now I need to choose the compressor.
The York is out of question, due to size and efficiency. My options are a Sanden, a Denso or a Panasonic. Any one fitted with a one groove pulley
Not being familiar with the air conditioner compressors, and the way you need to calculate cooling capacity vs cabin volume, I would like to ask help form all of you.
1. Which compressor will suit my needs the best?
2. Which compressor is the smallest one?
3. The best compromise?
I will keep all of you posted of the progress on the installation and the need or not of a firewall modification.
Thanks
Francisco

[fetus]

Do a search on 914world.com. I have seen allot of articles in the past on this subject.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

First, you do understand that there was no such thing as an "original 914-6 air conditioning setup"? So anything you do will not be "original".

Second, the Sanden 505 is, as far as I can tell, more than good enough for a 911 or a 914. Plus it's common and not that expensive, I believe. I haven't heard anything positive or negative about the other brands you mention.

--DD

[fetus]

The biggest issue is finding away not to have to cut the firewall. I have seen some creative threads on world, but I don't know how reliable they are.

[Turboman]

Thanks to all.
Dave I know 914-6s never had A/C. But I want to reach an installation as close as possible to "original look".
I feel that the modification of the firewall can be minimal (less than 2 inches) if I install a "short nose" compressor.
New ideas welcome please.
Thanks
Francisco

[kuehl]

I have a few 2 groove pulley's hanging around, as well as a 914 knee pad vent panel and front condenser.

Possibly, you'd have to check the fit, an SC AC bracket system could be
modified to to bolt up.

For the compressor, a Kuehl 507, V belt will work just fine.

Common 944 type drier.

PM if you need some ideas.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

I think the options to make the compressor fit are:
- Under the engine shelf on the right side (914 orientation)
- On the left side of the engine with a jack-shaft (as seen in your thread on 914world)
- On the left side of the engine with the firewall hammered out or cut (as the Peter Gregg 916 did)

There may be other solutions available, but those are the most obvious ones--and the ones that have been done that I know of.

The Sanden 505 still seems to be a good choice of compressor.

--DD

[Turboman]

Hi,
thanks to all of you that share your ideas with me.
I follow Vectror advice on 914world and got in touch with Michael at Mittelmotor in Germany.
Michael and his team successfully installed a Cool VPC system from a 914-4 into a 914-6, without any modification at firewall level.
Michael sent me some photos of the compressor, and the bracket they build.
Now I will buy the same compressor Michael and his team used and keep all of you posted with as many photos as possible. Hopping my experience will help other owners wishing to ride cool.
Again thanks
Francisco

[Turboman]

Hi, as mentioned I got in touch with Michael at Mittelmotor GmbH in Germany. Mittelmotor made a 914-6 for a French customer with A/C and no modification on the firewall.
Michael, share with me (and authorize me to share with you) this photos.

[Turboman]

I liked the way they modified the engine support and the engine front cover. Also note that you may loose one heather connection
Photos courtesy of Mittelmotor

[Turboman]

Next week I will start the work on my compressor bracket. Will keep every one of you posted with as many photos as possible.
Thanks to Mittelmotor for the photos
Francisco

[kuehl]

Well engineered job, however there are a dozen or more compressors available that can work.

[Turboman]

The DELPHI compressor seems difficult to locate, at least on the south east of USA, Miami is the closest shipping location to Costa Rica.
I need to look at options. Griffiths offer a nice priced compressor, I need to look at the size.

Another detail to look is the crankshaft pulley. I have a double pulley, from a 1974 or 1975 Porsche 911. This pulley have the turbine side bigger than the A/C compressor side. Mittelmotor uses a dual pulley with the same diameter on both tracks. This means the compressor will spin faster and produce better work.

Will keep all of you posted

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

I can't quite tell--did they move the front piece of engine tin downward? (I know it's now fiberglass, but I still call it "engine tin".) Unless the compressor is lower than I think it is, it looks like there would still be some interference.

Very neat if I'm wrong about that, though! (And if the guys at Mittelmotor say it doesn't interfere, I will believe them.)

--DD

[kuehl]

Could you fit the compressor, such as a 507, if you simply used an SC type mount.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

Shoot, that's right--it was a 507 (not a 505!) that we got from you! Thanks again, it works well keeping my wife's SC cool. Even in the middle of the desert, in fact.

--DD

[Turboman]

On our first try, we fit a normal A/C bracket from a 2.7 liter 911, and a small Sanden compressor. This combo, did interfere with the firewall, due to the fact that the compressor is located high on the right hand side of the engine.
The Mittelmotor solution fit the compressor lower and more to the outside of the engine.
During my exchange of info with Michael he expressed his concern about the size of the belt, he consider it to be much longer than desired, but fund no problems with the operation once the system was on daily use.

I am busy with the fabrication of the bracket, will keep all of you posted.

Francisco

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

I really like the turnbuckle-style tensioner on that. Beats the heck out of the 911's oval mounting holes and one hard-to-access nut.

--DD

[Turboman]

Hi all:
The progress on the 914-6 A/C is temporary on hold due to a massive oil leak on my 964 engine. By next week I hope, all the problems on my 964, will be solved, and the work on the 914-6 can start again.
I got a DELPHI compressor, from a supplier in Florida, and a second hand "turnbuckle-style tensioner" out of a 951, parts car.
Will keep you posted.
Francisco

[larrym]

i've wished for years that this could be done -

i'll be eagerly watching for your parts list & build sheet

- I acquired a 911 2.7 bracket some yrs back but never went on with the idea after reading other posts that were not encouraging

i'm now upgrading to a 3.2 that has an oem AC bracket

one concern about the above picture - - (& based on Clay Perrine's experience) 914-6 A/C compressor bracket

- that compressor bracket attached to few 6mm bolts & the cam cover studs looks like it could easily break the timing case or more ???

most oem AC brackets of all brands are hell-for-stout and bolted up with 3/8 or larger bolts - or at least MANY smaller ones

the modified motor mount is another point of concern for me - I can't see how an oem mount can be clearanced to allow a second pulley - seems that would move the engine back about an inch or 2 and upset all the other mounting points in the process

????

.