Any illegally obtained evidence is no evidence at all. At least according to my neighbor who is a prosecutor for the state of Oregon. He told me their was some federal case back in the '60's that decided that.

Anyway, I am not a criminal. I never do/posses drugs, or drink. They were just harassing me becuase I had long hair, and was driving the beater car, out of a bad neighbor hood.

Like I said, cops like that are uncle fu#ker$. You know, like from south park.

-Tabor

Well....if you are talking about Viginia...you are misinformed. The only thing that can repleal and ammendment is something passed by the supreme court and legislator in the USA. They CANNOT!!!!! search your car. If you are in the USA it is illigal. NO matter what. YOu've been sickly missinformed. That like saying some state took away your right for free speach (also an ammendment). It just CAN'T happen without a major change to the consitution of the USA. And if you have drugs, guns, anything illigal in your car and they do an illigal search....they CANNOT hold it against you in court. It is automatically thrown out in court and cannot be held against you. You guys need to study your rights better. You have no clue. You never let anyone search no matter what. It's a waste of time if you are not a crook. And they have NO right..no matter what state

so...... If i am at school they can search my car as they please? but on a public road they cant unless they see or smell weed? like.. would playing a radio to loud be enough reason... cuz i really dont like cop screwin around with my time....

At school..sorry to say..you forfit most of your rights. But on a public road you have them. Pumping yer sterio gives them no right to SEARCH your car. They can pull you over for violating the sound code or something..but they have to have something to search for and probable cause for something illigal (sterios are not illigal). So if they ask "can i search your car" just say NO it is NOT an admission of guilt

Goku, you need to do some studying before you go busting on people (namely me) on what I do and do not know. I do know the laws (Constitution, amendments, court cases, laws) and I do know that evidence obtained illegally can NOT be used in a court. What I SAID was that the damage is already done at that point. The newspaper reports you had drugs, it spreads in the community, people at work are talking about it. So what if you don't go to jail then, the damage is DONE.

Secondly, yes, in Virginia, they did pass a law to allow cops to search a car without probably cause.

Go read my post and ask for clarification before you bash me, and read Virginia law before you bash me.

Or better yet, come to Virginia, and resist a cop when he says "Step out of the car because I'm going to search it", and watch how he canes the hell out of you 'til you're out of the car.

Well..sorry if you felt I 'bashed' you. I wasn't. I just believe you are missinformed. I don't think I said you were an 'idiot' or 'stupid'. Thats bashing. I just don't think that most ppl even know about it. You MIGHT be right about VA...but thats very hard to believe. I didn't mean to bash you man. Just saying what I know alright. It was nothing personal. I agree about you 'damage is already done' thing. It just wasn't clear that was your point. It sounded like if they found drugs you are screwed cause they already found it. Don't take it personally man. It wasn't meant that way

My use of the term "Bashing" was probably overboard. But I can vouch for the state of the law in Virginia on many subjects, this being one of them. It is something that I believe is being fought (not sure on that). Just remember, circumstances abound. There are plenty of things that DO HAPPEN, condoned by law enforcement that ARE LEGAL, and sometimes even LOOSE in court. My general action here in VA is to get out of the car when the officer starts to search it. I personally do not drive around with an ounce of marijuana in my car, but I do know people who do, and what worries me a little bit is I do know that these people can carry it on them when riding with me. It's my choice to give them rides anyway, and as long as they keep it on them, I have no problems.

At high speeds, objects in windshield are closer than they appear...

Like I said before: I will get in your face about racing as long as you keep racing on the public streets/roads. Especially when you try to justify it!

I'll back off Prerydog: unfortunately, this thread won't change anything. We should agree to disagree, and life goes on.

Be safe people.
-Z.

Hey Z- I think that it is an age thing whereby if they survive and don't "naturally select" themselves from the gene pool, then they age enough to procreate. I did it some too at that age. I just hope they don't kill themselves or anyone else in the learning process. My teenagers had dual enrollment last semester and the driving school to school tales I heard would curl a parent's hair. Suffice it to say, there were several totals, some with injury. I live in a rural environment and a deer will do a car almost as good as a tree or embankment. Some object lessons just don't seem to sink in. $.02 worth.

Dave951M

Dave951M: Your points are well taken. I don't have teenagers, so it is more difficult for me to understand their point of view.

Prerydog: I am sorry that I got on your case so much. Take make it up to ya: how about a race? There's a nice stretch of highway by my house.... (Just kidding!) Acutally, if there's an autocross by your place, and you haven't tried it yet, then I'd like for you to try it, and I'll pay the entry fee! I am 100% serious about this. Just let me know...
-Zoltan.

There are auto-crosses by me. I do plan on taking them, I just have to fork out the cash to get my CAR and GEAR first (by gear I mean helmet), and I need SOMEWHERE to find out what the rules are.

They say if you've modified your car beyond a point you need a roll bar or cage, well, WHAT IS THAT POINT? I can't find a single shred of information on that.

Personally, I think PCA needs to get their act together and let people KNOW what the hell they expect from us.
Do I need a bar or a cage? What parts of my car have to pass inspection?

The rules just really turn me off to the whole thing.

I don't know why you'd need a bar/cage for autoX... unless possibly it's a third gear event..

Prery:
I know you're far away from NJ, but here's a link to PCA NJ's autox page: towards the bottom, there's link to their rules/regulations. At least it will give you an idea of what the rules are like. Here's the link:
PCA NJ runs three types of classes: Stock, Improved (primarily improved suspensions, handling), and Modified (engine improvements as well as suspension upgrades).

http://www.pca.org/nnj/Autox.html

The rules are for two main reasons:
1. Safety / liability
2. Classification: cars running stock are no competition to modified cars, so the rules basically separate the two (in NJ PCA's case three) classes.

BTW: Roll bars/cages aren't required for any autox events in my area, only track events. For DE, it's only required if you have a cabrio.

Hope this helps! Let me know when you go!
-Zoltan.

I like the idea of more autox, de and tt. When I was actively competing in SCCA autox, most of the aggressivenes was left on the course. It could also be used to teach less experienced drivers the limits of the cars. The flip side is some would take it that they know it all now and can drive fast anywhere.

The bottom line is we all have driven in an insane manner at some point in our lives, just some never grow out of it. My $.02.

Dave951M