OT: HELP calling all Mechanics?

scottmandue · 03:01 PM

Sorry guys but I need help fast and I know a few of you are professional mechanics.

Okay I'll make this quick, girlfriend takes her POS 1997 Pontiac Grand am to the mechanic for overheating first they change the thermostat, still over heating. Then they do the water pump still overheating.
She just got a call, they put in a new radiator WITHOUT her approval. This is California... that's illegal right?

I am tempted to let her drive my 944... but we are not bedroom buddies... yet

Needless to say if anyone knows anything about these cars or their cooling system and the legality of installing a radiator with out permision please comment.

TIA

londel · 08-15-2003, 02:08 PM

Which engine is in the Grand Am? and did they say if the radiator fixed the problem?

BlueQuestTSi · 08-15-2003, 02:13 PM

Engine is a biggie. If it's running a 2.4l TC engine, a bad head gasket can make them run hot. If the fans aren't running right, it'll make it run hot. Pretty much anything that can make a 944 run hot would apply.

SoCal Driver · SoCal Driver's Garage

You need to go to the lawyer forum.

I would go for a system flush and a radiator.

BlueQuestTSi · 08-15-2003, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SoCal Driver
You need to go to the lawyer forum.

I would go for a system flush and a radiator.

New radiator though, on a 6 year old car? Even in the harshest conditions a flush should suffice, and if not, then a rodding would.

scottmandue · 08-15-2003, 02:48 PM

It's a four banger, so the 2.4
She just heard from the mechanic so we don't know if the radiator helped, he didn't say if she was being charged for the radiator.

Hugh, what lawyer form?

She very pissed right now... don't want to mention the head gasket.

Thanks a bunch guys!

scottmandue · 08-15-2003, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlueQuestTSi
Engine is a biggie. If it's running a 2.4l TC engine, a bad head gasket can make them run hot. If the fans aren't running right, it'll make it run hot. Pretty much anything that can make a 944 run hot would apply.

I should note that coolant was leaking also.

BlueQuestTSi · 08-15-2003, 03:17 PM

The 2.4TC is based on the older Old's racing Quad 4 2.3l engine. The older quad's were notorious for blowing head gaskets, and cracking heads(was more or less an owner issue, but a flaw).

One of the tell-tale signs of a cracked head, or bad gasket was overheating issues. Have them do a compression and leak down test. That should show any problems in the head.

scottmandue · 08-15-2003, 03:58 PM

You guys are great...
I called the mechanic and they are not charging her for the radiator... on the other hand she paid $600 for a water pump and thermostat.
I should have got involved earlier but she never said anything to me untill it was too late... at that point nothing I said was right, just made her more pissed off (aint it great being a man!)
Oh well, live and learn.
I hope it not the head gasket because I'm lobbying for her to dump it and get something more reliable but she's working part time and can't afford to spend any more money.

I'm going to check autotrader and see what her poopmobile is worth and if she could get anything more reliable for the same money (dream on) any suggestions?

Thanks again!

Roger Hall · 08-15-2003, 04:37 PM

Its been awhile since I lived in California and the consumer protection laws have changed. I belive two basic things still apply.

All the old parts must be provided to the customer.

Any work thats costs more than 10% of the original estimate must be approved by the customer before the work is done.

So technicaly replacing the radiator with out first getting her approval is illeagle. However it is more likely that the customer ends up paying in these cases. You can allways file a complaint and the shop may be fined but I have never heard of anyone getting a refund that way. Sounds like it was pretty stand up of them not to charge for the radiator. If you want to get something reliable I would probably recomend a Toyota Camry.

SoCal Driver · SoCal Driver's Garage

Lawyer Forum: California Department of Automotive Affairs (or something close)

A BS state org to collect "fees" (read: taxes) and make the public at large think the state is on their side. Most of the time the bad mechs get away with over charges.

Hardly worth the trouble as your only recourse is small claims.

Fortunately this board has members that have worked on more than 944's. I'm kind of stuck as my 83 944 has been my only car for almost 19 years. Before that 55 through 60's chevy's and VW's.

So hat's off to Jack!

SoCal Driver · SoCal Driver's Garage

Oh! And another BS tax; the plastic cola bottle tax. Less than 20 percent are returned in California. Where do you think the 5 cents per container goes for the missing 80 percent????

Why don't electric cars pay road taxes? We do with every gallon of gas. Seems to me that they and the LPG powered cars should be charged by the mile. They use the same roads and weigh the same.

TCMdocs944 · 08-15-2003, 04:43 PM

One thing to note from my friends in the city of gainesville that moonlight in other garages......

100% markup is considered quite normal and conservative in the average garage.

I paid $425 (and was very pissed off) for a rodeo ac compressor that I could have bought from napa for $210.

scottmandue · 08-16-2003, 07:37 AM

YEP!

I was a A/C serviceman so I know all about parts markup.

I think everyone came out okay, the mechanic put too much time and parts into the repair but he over charged a bit so he probably broke even or even made a few bucks.

And she got her car fixed (crossing fingers... and toes)

And most importantly I hopefully made points with her! Maybe she will come up with some creative way to reward me for all my effort (dream on).

Thanks again for the help... I tend to poo poo of the idea of the internet being a "community" thing but you guys saved my a$$... or at least got me a little closer to her... uh... well you know!

Thanks also to Z-man and 1.2 for not blowing me to the OT form immediately, although I did mention letting her borrow the 944... and then I would have room for that 944S2/951/968 I have been thinking of, hee hee.

Anyway past a Toyota for sale on the way home from work yesterday, hmmmmmmmmm

BlueQuestTSi · 08-16-2003, 08:53 AM

That $600 for the water pump, was probably mostly labor. If I recall correctly, that's roughly an 8 hour job. So he probably ate it somewhat in the labor of that job.

What did they say the problem was?

scottmandue · 08-16-2003, 09:02 AM

They said it was the radiator (they think) car didn't overheat today.

She wants to buy me lunch (whoopee)

Honestly wasn't expecting anything... whatever

Thanks again