Car keeps leaving me stranded!!! battery related

jkrustchinsky · 06-24-2007, 06:22 PM

To start off, i have already pulled the alternator off and had it tested, and it tested fine.

here it goes...,

On friday i started the car up and everything is great, i get about 4-5 miles and turn it off. When i try to restart the car, it hardly turns over, the voltage was reading about halfway between 10 and 12. I waited a moment and it had enough of a crank to start up.

I start driving home and it starts dying on me, i go from 50mph to 40, and then to 30, and so on. eventually i pull into a trailer park and the car is parked and its just barely running,

i try to keep it running for a little while by giving it a lttle gas but it just has no power, the battery voltage is now less than 10.

THEN i start smelling smoke like somthing is burning so i shut off the car. and open the hood and smoke is steadily streaming from back of the motor directly under the plug for the oxygen sensor that next tothe manifold.

eventually a nice guy stops and has a jump box and followed behind me jumping me every 200-300 feet so i could make it home.

Can somone please help? i have no clue whats going on, since the alternator is good i have no clue where i stand? josh

legion · 06-24-2007, 06:27 PM

Some kind of short?

Charge your battery, and hook up a multimeter between your battery and one of the leads. Turn your ignition to the first click and turn it back. You should be pulling less than 30 milliamps. If you are pulling more, start pulling fuses until the number goes down. Take note of what fuse causes the number to drop, and you know which circuit has a short.

blown 944 · 06-24-2007, 06:32 PM

sounds like you may have a short between the starter and the alternator.

Does your battery liht come on when you turn the key on befoer it fires then goes off?

If it doesn't come on you either have a bad bulb in the dash or the mentioned short.

The smoke you smell is it electrical? that is very distinctive?

The smoke may be unrelated it could be from the hose from the AOS or the heater shutoff valve leaking coolant. Or something else.

Check the idiot light first then track the wire between the alt and starteran dmake sure its not shorting out.

If it is shorting you will have to run new wire

if the bulb is out the alt will not turn on as it is initiated when the voltage overcomes the battery voltage and then the light turns off then initiating the alternator.

jkrustchinsky · 06-24-2007, 06:40 PM

so it could b a bulb in my intrument panel? or it could be a shorted wire? i will have to check tomorrow because the battery is on the charger and its to dark to put my alterntor back on. josh

Icey1174 · 06-25-2007, 06:46 AM

Josh,

How old is the battery? Even if you did have a bad battery the car should still run with a good alt. Could it be a problem with some bad/dirty grounds?

bazar01 · bazar01's Garage

There is an alternator wire (+12V) that runs under the intake manifold to the bellhousing right beside the speed and ref sensors that terminates to the starter positive post. Check that wire and I bet the wire insulation is damaged and wire is shorting to ground thru the bellhousing.
There should be a wire clamp to keep it from moving around and damaging the insulation. The clamp could be missing.
Do not drive the car until you check that.

Icey1174 · 06-25-2007, 07:23 AM

+1^

Sounds like a good place to start.

jkrustchinsky · 06-25-2007, 10:13 AM

will do, thanks, that gives me a good place to start

onZedge · 06-25-2007, 03:08 PM

Of course, it could be as simple as a chaffed wire shorting as others (and the smoking condition) have suggested. Also, have the battery load tested first. Any auto parts store will do this for free. If you have a shorted cell internal to the battery, excess charging current will be dissipated as heat. Do you get a rotten egg smell or a melting wire smell? In any case, you will still have to replace the damaged wire from the alternator to the battery if it was chaffed or cooked.

jkrustchinsky · 06-25-2007, 05:10 PM

ok guys, ive beenplaying with it all day and i assume that it works now but im not sure.

i checked the wires you told me to check and the insulation was melted off just as you said BUT, the wires inside appeared fine, anyway i wrapped it with electricaltape and ziptied it to a location away from the bellhousing. i cleaned off every contact and wire connector i could find.

The battery bulb in the cluster does come on, however upon taking the cluster out i notced that someone had removed the big red "!!!!!!" light, so i put one in and of course after i bolt it all back together and start the car, THE BIG RED LIGHT IS ON.

anyway my voltag started out a little under 12, i ran the car for probably 20 minutes and hen drove it 3 or 4 miles with the radio turned up. It just hovers halfway between 10 and 12 and goes down occasinally and then slowly back up.

im afraid to drive it anywhere fearing it might break down on my again.

so im a little cueless right now, any suggestions, the only thing i can thik of is my battery might be a piece of ****, its nly about 6 months old but the car drained it 8 or 9 times and ive had to recharge it. josh

Icey1174 · 06-25-2007, 05:21 PM

The battery prob needs a good charge. If it's only 6 months old and it was only drained 8 or 9 times it "should" be ok. I have seen much worse happen to new batteries. So either drive it for a good half hour with minimal electric on and keeping decent RPMs, like on an expressway, not stop and go traffic, or just put it on a trickle charger over night if you have one.

How much electrical tape did you use? I am guessing the insulation on that wire to be pretty thick. There has to be a reason why it metled in the first place too. Always try to find the root cause of your problems and they will go away forever.

Does that "!" light stay on all the time? Check your brake fluid in the master cylinder. If that's low that light will come on. It will come on if the oil is low, if the parking brake is on, and a handful of other reasons. Now you need to find out why that is on.

jkrustchinsky · 06-25-2007, 05:25 PM

i know, ive checked everything, it just stays on, i dont even know where to begin, there is a bunch of stuff that needs to be replaced and it will be soon, just cant replace it right now.

ill put the trickle charger on it and see what happens in the morning

onZedge · 06-25-2007, 11:59 PM

Troubleshooting electrical problems is difficult enough having the car in front of you with a multimeter in one hand and a wiring diagram in the other hand. Please tell us exactly which wire had melted insulation.

11 Volts after 20 mins is not good enough. Should be between 13.75 and 14.25 Volts. You are not charging the battery. Check and write down these things with the car running using a hand-held multimeter: (not easy, but be careful)

a) the votage at the alternator output
b) the voltage at the starter
c) the voltage at the battery positive cable (not the battery post)
d) the voltage at the battery positive post (not the battery cable)

Report back and we'll go from there.

SolReaver · 06-26-2007, 12:32 AM

Take pics so we can see what you are up against. Before hooking it up to juice give the harness a once over twice for any other shorts. consider splicing in new wires to replace the toasted ones. Cheap inline fuses can also be spliced into sections that are in question to further isolate excessive draw or to give further protection.

Trace the toasty wires back to thier source and destination and ohm them out to check 4 shorts. Good luck there, take your time and have an extinguisher handy

blown 944 · 06-26-2007, 06:46 AM

I second on Zedge you should have much more voltage while running even if the battery is bad.

Now that the bulb is glowing at least you've established that the connection loop is closed for the alternator switch. If there were no bulb your alternator was not turning on. I would also check for some kind of jerry rigging of an external bulb.

After thinking I am wondering if the alternator did check out ok truly b/c it shoudl go off if the voltage coming out of the alternator exceeds 12v.

A quick test to rule out some things would be to run a direct wire (10gauge, alligator clamps work great for this) between the alt post and battery. If that fixes it (light goes off and you have at least 13v) then the wiring between the alternator,starter,ign switch and battery has a problem. If not the alternator is most likely bad.

I'm wondering if we are talking about the same bulb. I am talking about the battery bulb and not a check engine bulb??

I am used to my 83 at this point and can't quite remember what the 86 has going on in the way of idiot lights. I'll have to look when my wife gets here today.

legion · 06-26-2007, 06:55 AM

I was having similar issues last year. I took my car to a shop and they measured the voltage at 12.5 while running, and told me it was fine.

That may be fine for a GM or Ford, but it caused all sorts of weird problems in my 951. 944s need exactly 13 volts to runs properly. I had the alternator rebuilt last year and replaced the main ground, and all of the problems went away.

bazar01 · bazar01's Garage

quote: I start driving home and it starts dying on me, i go from 50mph to 40, and then to 30, and so on. eventually i pull into a trailer park and the car is parked and its just barely running,

Also, be aware that low battery voltage will not be able to power up the DME computer electronic components.
That is why the engine is cutting out. Ask me how I knew.
It was scary, driving 70 mph with other cars and trucks on the highway, and engine cutting out on me.
In my case, it was a dirty and loose alternator to starter cable.
I saw it when my battery voltage meter dropped to 11V.
(altermator voltage regulator and battery were new)

jkrustchinsky · 06-26-2007, 10:52 AM

i ill do all of those things today and report back with the results,

it is the battery bulb that comes on. thanks josh

jkrustchinsky · 01:30 PM

it started raining while i was working onthe car, basically,

the alternator is getting POWER, 4.8 ohms , i tested the big black cable that goes to the alternator

The little blue wire was giving it power .8 volts was the reading.

the battery connector was getting 12.84 volts

ive been pulling wires trying to find the source of the problem. will let you guys know

i just drove it like another 30 minutes and it rns and drives but the battery meter reads in btween 10 and 12, im clueless, cause i cannot find any shorts or bad wires, ive tested everything.

I even ran a 12guage wire from th battery to the alternator and it gave the meter just a little over the 12.

I DONT KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON cause its running. It just reads btwen 10 and 12 somtimes a little higher somtimes a little lower than 11

blown 944 · 06-26-2007, 03:12 PM

OK here is an absolute testing that will determine the alternator is bad or good.

1) put a little bulb (dome bulbs work good) in between the blue wire post from the alt and 12 v the other end of bulb.

2) run your jumper wire from alt lg post to + side of battery

3) the bulb should be lit before starting, start (light should go out) and check voltage it should be over 13 v and less than 14.5 or so. If it still shows 12v or less or even slightly over the alternator is bad.

Basically what you are doing is eliminating the ign switch and wiring between alt, starter and battery and getting to just the alternator to verify it is truly working.

If it works out that you get the proper voltage then I wouldl look at the wire between the idiot light and the alternator as the culprit since you have already tested a direct wire to the battery. If this wire is shrted out it will cause teh idiot light to stay on and is not allowing the alternator to turn on since the connection is compromised.