KKK Turbochargers

[Endat]

I was wondering what the differences were in the turbochargers... There's a K26, a K27, a K29, and some weird K27-6

Can someone clear this up for me? Also, which ones work well on a 16v 944?

[running_cold924]

k26-6 stock on 944 turbos
k26-8 stock on turbo S cars
k27-6 or k27-8 - hybrid, stock hotside(S and non-S)
k29......not sure

as for working on a 944 S...that is a road less traveled, try searching in the 944 section instead of the turbo section, may get more hits there

[Endat]

Thanks for the info... does anyone know the actual difference between the K26-6 and the K26-8? What kind of boost are they capable of? What are their drawbacks? and why does the S have a different turbo, its the same displacement.... im guessing it has something to do with DAS BOOST, right?

[porsche na-t]

was actually in the middle of doing a 16V turbo project. its quite simple. change to 951 pistons but from what i heard get them notched alittle to make sure for valve clearance. pretty much rest is bolt on except for modifying the exhaust and intake manifold and running some type of fuel controller to compensate. i was going to run the k27 turbo on mine. i think the k26 would run out of power because of the higher rpm of the 16v. i think its interesting setup and wish more people would try it.

[running_cold924]

k26-6 and k26-8, the same turbo really, just different hotsides. the 8 will hold its boost a little longer through the rpm range(mostly the end) but they say the drawback is turbo-lag...

[Techno Duck]

Originally Posted by Endat

Thanks for the info... does anyone know the actual difference between the K26-6 and the K26-8? What kind of boost are they capable of? What are their drawbacks? and why does the S have a different turbo, its the same displacement.... im guessing it has something to do with DAS BOOST, right?

The difference between the two is the hotside, the cold side is exactly the same. The #6 obviously being smaller than the #8. The #6 runs out of steam at about 16-17psi and you are simply pushing hot air through it. Torque will continue to rise but your EGT's go through the roof. In my experience this turbo will support about 270-280whp on a well setup car. My 26/6 with typical mods including MAF made 264/264 at 14psi. The #6 hotside also typically will cause boost to drop off at high RPM also, most will not hold more than 13-14psi to redline even with a good dual port wastegate. You can probably hold 15psi or slightly more with a electronic. 1-bar by about 2700rpm roughly.

The 26/8 will run out of steam around 17-18psi. It will make in the 300whp range at 16-17psi and maxes out around there. Typically these will hold 15-16psi all the way to redline. 1-bar by about 3k rpm.

The 27/6 is essentially a larger cold side with the smaller hotside. This can support 300whp at 16psi while keeping the same spool up essentially as the 26/6 (slightly slower, but not by much). Can run all the way to 19-20psi for about 350ish whp with proper tune and fuel support. This turbo should not be run with higher than 17-18psi for long periods as there is too much back pressure from the tiny hotside and will cause some mega high EGT's. There are many different versions of the coldside K27, you want the 7200 compressor. My friend data logged 1-bar before 2900rpm.

The K27/6 is a GREAT turbo for the money. A very cheap upgrade that will get you 300+whp pretty easily with minor mods. I originally had one of these for my car but decided against using it because my car primarily sees more track (50 / 50 split between track and street now). I did not want to be running such a tiny hotside at high RPM for long periods and opted for a 60-1 HiFi with a #8 hotside.. still pretty decent spool up with 1-bar by 3200rpm and will support right around 350whp at ~18psi and not too much to worry about with high back pressure in the crossover. The K27/6 is a probably one of the best 300whp street turbos for the money... the spool up is very fast..tough to beat it. But its cap reliably on the street i think is basically 300whp at 15-16psi. Anymore than that and you need to run high boost and higher octane.

[Endat]

I assume the power will be a little more for the 16v setup, is that right? the idea of a K27/6 scares me because I'll most certainly be under boost for extended periods of time and heat is never good. I want to mostly stay at about 0,9 bar for fuel efficiency, but have the ability to safely push even 2 bar if I wanted (given proper internals).

Taken into account I do mostly interstate travel and it will be at least 3,500rpm for extended periods of time, and I will be using Turbo S hardware.. would you say the K27 is the best application for what I'm asking out of this car, or are my goals a little far fetched?

Thanks for all the info so far... Ich werde ein turbomotor bauen!!!

[Techno Duck]

Cruising at 3500 and you will probably not even be on boost unless your going up an incline.

What do you mean Turbo S hardware?

28psi reliably on these engines... Not happening on pump and probably not happening on high octane either... Certainly not with a #6 hotside, I wouldn't even try it with a #8.

I think you need to research more on the basics. For what you want i wouldn't even bother with a triple-K. Call a builder and talk about options with them.

[Endat]

Manifolds and piping... not sure if its different than regular turbo. Around what rpm would I be getting boost from a 27? Maybe a K26 would be better for me? Whats the highest boost I can do with pump gas? maybe 20psi?

Thanks for the info

[Techno Duck]

The plumbing is all the same, slight difference in the intake manifold (extra vacuum port) but that's a moot point.

Highest safe boost on pump with some margin for error, I would not push 17psi.

Like I said a 27/6 will get you 1bar in the sub 3k range.

I don't mean to be rude but are you familiar with how the turbo works and reacts? I am getting the vibe that you don't fully understand it. There is more to it than what boost at what rpm and what is safest to run for big power. And the turbo is not always on boost depending on rpm, wheter it's on boost depends on the load placed on the engine. This is why I suggest calling an engine builder about adding a turbo to your 16v. It's not as simple as just slapping one on and adding the plumbing.

[Endat]

No, I'm just learning about the dynamics of turbocharging.. which is why I'm trying to be as specific as possible. I guess I will ask my workshop for some more info after I get the plumbing. What exactly is that extra vacuum port for?

[nize]

this should get you started;
86 944 turbo conversion

about once a year we get someone new to the forums asking about turbocharging their n/a 944 and after getting all the info and learning about the associated costs, complexity, and work involved, they disappear never to be heard from again. it seems this year it's your turn.

in the meanwhile, we're all waiting for that properly converted 944 n/a-to-turbo conversion success story.

no offense but i will bet money that in the end, you will not add a turbocharger to your 16v944.

if you do, please post up all details and work involved so that others may learn from your experience.

[Endat]

The only problem I see with the conversion is the ECU, which I will be asking about later.. If I get a good chip programmed I dont see any problem sharing its data with the world.

[trivgar]

Not going to be able to run much boost safely with compression that high. Nearly 11:1. I wouldn't boost more than like 7 psi. Gonna scatter that engine.

[porsche na-t]

its actually not that hard to turbo a n/a its just time and money. and stock parts are simple to find and are pretty cheap right now. you could easily build a na/turbo for the cost of a cheap turbo. but you dont get all the goodies. i was talking to a guy over on rennlist who turboed his 16v. he also made it that there were 2 camshaft to delete the cam chain problem. but for a turbo 16v just get turbo pistons i would get some valve releifs cut into the pistons for the valves because i beleive they come awfuly close. next you have to modify the exhaust manifold to bolt up to the stock cross over pipe and next is the intake manifold. get a 951 intake manifold cut off the runners and match them up to the 951 intake. everything else is just bolt up and configuring the computer and tuning. thats just my .02 for the research i did. its a project and a long one in that but you take your time and do it right finish project will be something most people will never see.

[porsche na-t]

http://www.dia-team.no/porsche/968csturboconvertion.htm

good build just on a 3.0l 968 motor but same concept.

[333pg333]

I currently have an n/a block and head in my 951. Does that qualify? lol

[ArthurPE]

K26/6 does any one have the compressor map?
I've searched and found some, but not sure if they are the correct one, I think they were for an Audi?

Techno duck:
would 15 psi be sustainable/good practice on the following set-up:
86 stock engine, other than below:
93 octane
Lindsay chips
BE
3 bar regul
2 shims
oem Bosch Super+ Cu
Dansk exhaust
deleted timing/cycling relay/valve
good state of tune, low mileage ~55k

road use, no track, intermitent hard running...not sustained

I'm at ~13 now

[wild man]

Originally Posted by Techno Duck

The 27/6 is essentially a larger cold side with the smaller hotside. This can support 300whp at 16psi while keeping the same spool up essentially as the 26/6 (slightly slower, but not by much). Can run all the way to 19-20psi for about 350ish whp with proper tune and fuel support. This turbo should not be run with higher than 17-18psi for long periods as there is too much back pressure from the tiny hotside and will cause some mega high EGT's. There are many different versions of the coldside K27, you want the 7200 compressor. My friend data logged 1-bar before 2900rpm.

The K27/6 is a GREAT turbo for the money. A very cheap upgrade that will get you 300+whp pretty easily with minor mods. I originally had one of these for my car but decided against using it because my car primarily sees more track (50 / 50 split between track and street now). I did not want to be running such a tiny hotside at high RPM for long periods and opted for a 60-1 HiFi with a #8 hotside.. still pretty decent spool up with 1-bar by 3200rpm and will support right around 350whp at ~18psi and not too much to worry about with high back pressure in the crossover. The K27/6 is a probably one of the best 300whp street turbos for the money... the spool up is very fast..tough to beat it. But its cap reliably on the street i think is basically 300whp at 15-16psi. Anymore than that and you need to run high boost and higher octane.

Does anyone know if if K27/6 or K27/8 turbochargers are available with water cooling? I have yet to see one.

[Techno Duck]

I was under the impression most are water cooled because you use the hotside from the 26/6 or 26/8. I had a 27/6 that was water cooled. I think the oil cooled only are from a 911T which uses a different hotside anyhow.