value of 1991 C4 - daily driver condition

[notfarnow]

I'm likely selling my car in a couple months, so Ive been watching 964 C4 prices. All I see are pristine low mile cars, so I can't get a sense of what my car would be worth.

1991 964 C4
-Black/Black
-Bought 3 years ago with 60k miles, currently has 110k miles (and counting)
-Has been my daily driver for 3 years, especially in the winter, and has its share of dings, scuffs etc.
-Last year it popped out of gear in the driveway, and I had to replace front & rear bumpers, muffler, underbody panels. Insurance company DID NOT alter the title, because despite initial impressions, there was NO metal damage whatsoever.
-everything works... AC, awd, abs... fully sorted and used every day.

Since purchase 3 years ago:
- new clutch
- new AC compressor
- almost all oil lines replaced

In past 4 months:
- pads/rotors/bearings all around
- full awd system flush (works flawlessly incl differental locks)
- fuel pump

What's a car like this worth, and where should I sell it? Here or Ebay?

[CountD]

Three years ago this was a $17K car. Now it's a $27K car. I would add $10K now. I've seen cleaner ones for $35k, and they are cleaner with no stories. Don't know if they sold for that though. But with the amount of posts you have, I'm sure you've been on the market, and have a pretty good idea. Sell it on eBay - and don't post pics of it in the snow.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by CountD

Three years ago this was a $17K car. Now it's a $27K car. I would add $10K now. I've seen cleaner ones for $35k, and they are cleaner with no stories. Don't know if they sold for that though. But with the amount of posts you have, I'm sure you've been on the market, and have a pretty good idea. Sell it on eBay - and don't post pics of it in the snow.

Thanks.. I agree that 3 years ago this would have been a 17k ish car... back then there were several in similar condition that I considered. I just don't seem to see any like this anymore... so having a hard time finding good "comps". Also trying to avoid my own bias towards optimism.

Trying to decide whether to sell it like it is, or if there's value in having it resprayed... clean up the interior, carpets etc.

[black_falcon]

Nice looking 964.

Clean it up a bit, list it for $32k, then run with the best offer. In this market, no reason to sell yourself short. Nice, original 964 coupes are fairly hard to come by plus black is a desirable color. With the recent work performed, it should sell quick either way.

[Matt Monson]

Take a look at BAT auctions. Good feedback from members. With EBay you might have to sell the car several times before a buyer actually pays for it.

[KNS]

Great time to sell, I wouldn't get is resprayed, you may not recover all of your money out of it. Have it professionally detailed (or spend a good weekend on it yourself), you'll certainly make more than what you purchased it for.

[notfarnow]

Thanks for the feedback folks. Helps a lot.. it can be hard to look at objectively when it's your car.

I really love this car and hate the idea of selling it, but it's hard to justify using it as a DD when the prices are where they are... takes some of the enjoyment out of it. A 996 c4 might make more sense, with the SC as a summer toy.

[KNS]

Originally Posted by notfarnow

I really love this car and hate the idea of selling it, but it's hard to justify using it as a DD when the prices are where they are... takes some of the enjoyment out of it.

That's the unfortunate reality of the escalating values. I drive my 993 to work quite a bit, it's great using it on a regular basis with practical purpose. But, my parking situation at work may be changing leaving it vulnerable to theft or vandals (I work evening shifts and often have to leave it overnight - not in the greatest of neighborhoods). Skyrocketing prices are not always a good thing unless you're a simply an investor looking to make a buck.

[CountD]

Originally Posted by KNS

That's the unfortunate reality of the escalating values. I drive my 993 to work quite a bit, it's great using it on a regular basis with practical purpose. But, my parking situation at work may be changing leaving it vulnerable to theft or vandals (I work evening shifts and often have to leave it overnight - not in the greatest of neighborhoods). Skyrocketing prices are not always a good thing unless you're a simply an investor looking to make a buck.

I don't know why everyone worries about this. Insure, insure, and insure. And drive, drive, drive. I always have my stuff appraised on a regular basis, well insured for every situation and keep on top of this. It gives a piece of mind and it's being a responsible owner.

[KNS]

Originally Posted by CountD

I don't know why everyone worries about this. Insure, insure, and insure. And drive, drive, drive. I always have my stuff appraised on a regular basis, well insured for every situation and keep on top of this. It gives a piece of mind and it's being a responsible owner.

Naturally I'm insured, one would be crazy not to be. But if the car is actually stolen, totaled, etc., finding a replacement in today's climate would be unenviable. For some, the car may have family history or huge sentimental value and those things can't be replaced with a check.

[black_falcon]

Originally Posted by KNS

Naturally I'm insured, one would be crazy not to be. But if the car is actually stolen, totaled, etc., finding a replacement in today's climate would be unenviable. For some, the car may have family history or huge sentimental value and those things can't be replaced with a check.

And that's after the long battle to be paid enough money to actually replace it (if you don't have agreed value). KBB still values my 964 at something like $15k. Ridiculous.

[CountD]

I dunno guys. I read about this fear all the time posted on here. I don't know where this fear comes from if you're driving a 993. Or really any impact-bumper car. Or really anything outside a special early S or RS.

We're not talking 250 GTOs here.

Obviously there is always risk. You cannot discount risk - no matter what you drive. But to live in fear of some market value or some such thing as fear of loss takes a lot of specialness and enjoyment away for me. Everything goes away eventually. To live in fear by driving or not driving some production car they made tens of thousands of makes no sense. A new Lexus SUV costs more. So does come cheesy Range Rover. Sorry guys I can't have hang-ups over what some market tells me or some fear that may or may not be realized.

[notfarnow]

It's simpler than that for me...it was a lot easier for me to enjoy the car when its value was roughly that of a good used Subaru. But once it starts pushing beyond what I know I would have ever paid for it, it's hard to not consided what else I'd do with the money. I guess the fact that I'm undergoing a "marital adjustment" makes me more acutely aware of that reality. I don't need, or even want to sell it, but it causes me angst to know I wouldn't BUY it right now if I had the cash.

[pnut_lee]

With the damage history, regardless of no branded title I would say the car will always be 15% below that of a comparable no stories car. Seems 964 cars have long been priced lower than 993 and 3.2 cars. Right now, you can pick up a nice similar mileage 3.2 G50 no stories car for slightly over 30k. That would put me at about $25k for this one. Then again, ebay really does open up the market and buyers love to get into bidding wars. You never know.........

[CountD]

Originally Posted by notfarnow

It's simpler than that for me...it was a lot easier for me to enjoy the car when its value was roughly that of a good used Subaru. But once it starts pushing beyond what I know I would have ever paid for it, it's hard to not consided what else I'd do with the money.

Yes, this is very true. I agree this becomes a serious conundrum when faced with the reality that you could have $30K in your pocket when you didn't know you could or did have it wrapped up in your old 911, and that $30K could be applied to something else in your life.

I agree with you on this one, amazing to think about an object that you enjoyed so much (and still do) when it's worth more, but the actual idea of the car changes when it becomes worth 2X the amount of money. Interesting thoughts on interesting times of 911 ownership.

[KNS]

Originally Posted by CountD

I dunno guys. I read about this fear all the time posted on here. I don't know where this fear comes from if you're driving a 993. Or really any impact-bumper car. Or really anything outside a special early S or RS.

I'm not sure if you're ever over on Rennlist (much more active 993 community over there), quite a few 993s have been stolen over the last 24 months. Replacements are not easy to find (manual coupes, that is).

[fryardds]

Originally Posted by CountD

I dunno guys. I read about this fear all the time posted on here. I don't know where this fear comes from if you're driving a 993. Or really any impact-bumper car. Or really anything outside a special early S or RS.

The 'fear' is real for me so this is exactly why I bought a 964 C4 coupe several years ago. As the market has gone crazy for classic Porsches I have struggled with keeping or selling the S and/or RS many times. I sympathize with the sentiments expressed by Jake. My .02 is to list the C4 between $30-35K this Spring and see what the responses are.

[notfarnow]

I really appreciate the input, thanks guys. The dropping Canadian dollar is also a considerable factor. I bought the car when the dollar was at 96 cents US, and now it's around 80 cents. That has quite an impact

[creaturecat]

Sell it to someone in the USA. Might as well make another 25%, while you are at it.
I believe that is where you bought it?
Easy import for our American friends.
Most P-car guys no likee bumps and bruises.
Best of luck with your sale ......

[NYNick]

The fear can only be about money. Money gained, money lost.

If your enjoyment driving your 911 outweighs the fear of losing some dough, don't sell. But make no mistake, you're not losing ALL your money if it gets totaled or stolen. And if you're well insured, you may not lose any money. So why the fear?

I just don't see it. Then again, I'm upside right on my air cooled. The water cooled Turbo on the other hand....