Time to sell my car...but it's in a transitional state
 

I'm currently living in Big Bear with no garage, with a 911 parked outside (soon to be two), and no firm timeframe as to when I'll move to a place with a garage in Los Angeles.

I don't have room in my fleet for two air-cooled 911s, so it's time to sell my '84. Here's the thing: though it is a factory M491, it's not an all-original creampuff that I can throw on BaT in a week—it's a unique hotrod; a re-civilized track car with (at least) 160k miles, a swapped engine, an unfinished interior, a fiberglass fender, slightly mismatched paint on the hood, inoperable sunroof, inoperable fog lights...a buncha little stuff.

It has it where it counts (a sorted '95 3.6 that consumes no oil, refreshed close-ratio 915, fresh suspension bits) and the damn thing drives beautifully, but I fear that potential buyers will view it as a neglected Frankenporsche instead of the meticulously documented, all-consuming labor of love that it has been to me for the last 3-4 years.

I see a few options:

1) Keep it. I can't keep it. I just can't keep it. It's being displaced by a similar car that can serve as more of a daily driver for me, and that was my ongoing goal for this car in the first place.

2) Keep it until I have a garage, fix some of the little things, list it. This probably makes the most financial sense, but it could be months before I have a garage, and then it might be more months of me messing with it to get it to...some state that I predict buyers will like. It's not nearly as fun to work on a car when you won't get to enjoy the fruits of your labor. I...I just have a very full plate for the foreseeable future.

3) Bring it to a shop, have them fix a few things, list it (while living an hour from most of civilization, trying to keep it clean). I dunno. When I buy a car, I like to go to the owner's house and size up the owner's meticulously clean garage and Ferraris, etc...I'm definitely not in that living situation at the moment, and nobody wants to casually swing by Big Bear (also, at 7,000 feet, the car is down over 50hp).

4) Do some kind of consignment deal with a shop where they do what they think will help get top dollar and cut them a slice. I feel like I've heard of people doing this, but I may have just made it up. This would be convenient for me, which has value at the moment, but might not net me as much as just selling it in its current state, depending on what buyers are looking for, and I'd rather an enthusiast get the lost value over some shop.

5) List it on Pelican as-is, see what sticks.

6) Maybe I can keep it.

I hate selling cars, and I'm having a real hard time pricing this thing, now and even work gets done. What would the pros do? :SmileWavy:

http://ensaster.com/pics/vehicles/sm...-breakdown.jpg

cool car. find a storage place and pay $150 a month to keep it in, with your kayak and the other stuff she's making you get rid of...... ;)

then look for a sales option that is not hurried and the car gets in of doors...

I wish I would have bought that car! I'm stripping mine down right now to get it closer to what yours was :-).

I can relate, too many cars. Not enough time, space to store or work on them. Hang on to it, I reckon you will miss it

+1.

That's a really cool car looking for pretty specific buyer. It's not really an M491 anymore, but it has the VIN which will add a premium (big, small? I don't know).

The car does need to be cleaned up and once ready to market will be an all consuming pain in the ass to sell, so I think option 3 consignment is really the only option. I would not fire sale it for convienience; the buyer is out there for the car.....they just need to be located and hand held.

Two things that are absolute necessities before selling it:

1. Get rid of the fiberglass fenders (why the hell does it have fiberglass fenders??!!)

2. Eliminate all trace the car may have had a cage in it. You'll want to disclose that, but having it clean takes away from the track rat fear factor.

Otherwise, I'm super jealous of that car. It's the turbo equivalent power NA Carrera that guys like me (that hate turbo and all the lag/cheap power they stand for) would relish in a clean street "factory" hot rod.

I have no idea on price. I honestly think it could bring anywhere from $40-70k.

First off, I watched you win the '89 yesterday so congrats on that, looks like a great car. Now onto your '84, since you have no less than six paths forward with that car I would suggest option 7; find suitable storage until you are prepared to sell or restore the '84.

Who knows, by way of your initial post keep an eye on your pelican inbox, i bet the pm's will be flying in already...any way you slice it this is a pretty awesome problem to have!

You can sell it.

There are plenty of us out here that will see the value of the components in that chassis. Will you break the bank.... no. Will you be satisfied probably...... I would say you can sell between $45,000 and $50,000 depending on how sorted the car's mechanicals are.


M491 w/ 3.6 is a perfect combo, time for someone else to complete...... flyhawn loves this combo of circumstance.

Sell it. Your heart is not in it and you'd be way better off passing it on. Put all your attention on the new car.

Seems like your old car was an adventure - and now it's time to send it down the road. It's going to take way too much time to get it to where you want it to be to then sell - and time is very valuable - and when your heart isn't in it it's going to drag on and on and take up more time and money.

Sell Sell Sell. You'll probably be surprised what you can get for it.

If it's even too much to sell it (I'd post it here first use those pics) - call BHCC and see what they would give you for it.:D

Oh my lord that's a cool car. Hot rods are hot and this fits the bill. Why are there fiberglass fenders? Weight, I'm sure.

The little things might matter to nit pickers, but those aren't the people that are looking for a car that has "it where it counts". The 3.6 does it for me, but the M491 option code is just the cherry on top.

I love it. I'm thinking in excess of $50 as is, depending on how restorable to original it is. Not that anyone who buys it will be doing that, but it's nice to have that option in your pocket.

Throw it on Pelican, warts and all. It'll sell.

Too funny.... I use this tactic when buying a used car myself (without being nosey of course...). However, when I sell one (or anything else for that matter), I use a work location, friends garage, whatever to prevent anyone from sizing up my stash. All it took was one nosey Mf'er... never again.

My ideal 911 man... Thing sits so pretty. Don't sell it.

Buy it. You could finish it up and flip it...SmileWavy

How much time do you have and how skilled are you? Even though you are talking about “little things quote, the cost of new fender, paint, interior, at Cetera could easily be $10,000.
Do you think the value of the car would increase by that amount if you were to finish all of those items?
Although the M491 cars are desirable, as you have correctly adduced, your car would never be able to be returned sufficiently to original to be able to capture that market.

If you can get over 50 for it, my inclination would be to sell it as is. It has enough desirable bits on it that there should be a very good market for it in its current condition.

Very cool car. If you have to sell it, give yourself a couple weekends and attack the low-hanging fruit - Fix the interior, fog lights, and sunroof as those are all fairly cheap and easy, and you can fix them while parked on the street or in a parking lot somewhere. Then, detail it as best you can, take it to a scenic locale and shoot some glamour shots. If you can, find a spare OEM fender to sell with the car. Then, list on BAT.

Getting a shop to address your punch-sheet is going to add up pretty quickly. If you can get all the parts you need ahead of time and get a shop to agree to knock out just what you want, that might work out. But shops don't like people bring in their own parts.

Or.. cut out all the work - Just detail as best you can, glamour shots and BaT. Explain the car and your situation honestly in the comments and let it ride. You might take a slight hit in final price, but what's your time worth?

Edit - Just realized the car you picked up. Good buy! Congrats.

If I could I would.

Let's just say eyes get very big from the people around me when I mention I'm spending $20k + on an older Porsche so assuming the value mentioned on this ad is correct I couldn't hang yet.

Even my old 912 I got for a great deal and had ZERO support from anyone I knew besides my bro who actually trusts my judgement.

Those who are clueless about the market think all these cars are worth $10k max no matter what is it Lol

Make an offer on the '75 yellow one "just out of storage" and put the rest of your available monies into making it roadworthy as a starting point

Yup. Yup yup yup, all good sentiments that echo my thoughts. This was helpful. I think I could get $40k in a few hours as-is, but $70 seems unrealistic as you could get a stock garage queen for that if you're willing to wait.

When I bought it, the whole car was fiberglass (lightness!). I spent most time getting the look back to stock with working heat and a streetable suspension (fun fact: it's way harder to find left fenders than right fenders due to the way people commonly crash).

Seems like a decent plan is to list it for maybe $60-65k, gauge the real-world interest, lower the price over time, and see what things I can fix in the interim. If I have a proper garage in a month, I can change the equation.

Part of me wants to grab the 3.6 out of it, swap in a different motor...and it's at this moment that I realize I'm losing my mind and I should just have a fun car to drive instead of live under...

If anyone knows of any consignmenty shops in California, it might be worth a phone call for me.

Is it sick that I ran the numbers on this thing in my head?? No garage, driveway bursting at the seems, painful sale in the works, and still trying to figure out the final product or upside on a smogless coupe with swapped motor and a widebody backdate...All it needs is a year of work and it's a six-digit car!

Sheesh I just looked it over. Total engine overhaul, body completely shot in some places and as everyone knows it only gets worse.

That's a huge project that I'm not equipped with. Rather spend 10k more for a runner. Passed on a few similar cars since one of my main concerns is one that is rotting..

Thanks though.

If I were you I wouldn't do anything until the black '89 has arrived and you can assess the viability of swapping the 3.6 into that car to complete the hotrod backdate and stuff the 3.2 in the '84. Is the original motor around for the '84? Assuming not...

Tremelune
One mans junk is another mans treasure! And wow, that car is a treasure!
No idea what your 89 is like, but if it's usurped this, then you are a very lucky man!

Sorry I can't help you on price, but if you ever need a kidney :) (jk)

Like others have said, $40k would see this sold in minutes (to me please) but think it's got to be a good bit more. I can't really comment about how much more as my budget tunes out for higher priced cars!

I do think the fact you are a generous and knowledgeable contributor here (thanks for the advice you have given me), people will add value to the car for that reason - if you decide to sell it here.

Yes, it is sick.

Why can't you list it on BAT ? I've seen them sell project cars that are in pieces. This is hardly that.

You want this car out of your life. It is causing more annoyance than pleasure?

List it As Is on BAT and Pelican and eBay. You've already decided your reserve. If all 3 fail, then make a plan B.

Nothing to lose unless you're actually not ready to sell. You need to be honest with yourself right now. There is a reason you bought the '89 when you already had this.

The problem you're having is that you've sunk years of your time into this car. Sunk cost of emotions.

If your heart is not in the car, you’re not going to want to put in the time and effort to prep it for sale. So, I would put it on Pelican. There would be fewer demands on your time, less need to respond to questions from insincere buyers, and a higher population of real enthusiast familiar with the car and able to relate to your specific situation.

You seem like an honest and straightforward guy. We all appreciate that when we see it. There are simply too many deceitful characters around these days.

A posting here with all the pertinent details simply and accurately explained would likely find you a genuine buyer with the know-how and experience to get a fair deal made.

@Muny King Ha, thanks—I think that's overly flattering. Like most everyone else, I kind of just hang out here, read the words of the truly knowledgeable, then regurgitate it with a few personal anecdotes from when I gave it a whirl myself...

@sugarwood You make good points. I sold my '87 on BaT and got a lot of flak for a non-functioning window and a small oil leak. I set too low a reserve and I was bummed when it actually sold for that minimum. All my fault, but I'm a bit gunshy with this car and its incomplete nature. I fear someone buying because they didn't read or ask questions and finding they didn't get the screaming deal on a creampuff M491 coupe that they thought they did. Maybe it doesn't hit reserve and future buyers take it as "the market speaking" on this example without many having driven it. BaT buyers seem to prefer examples that have little to question. I dunno, I'm not opposed to it—knowledgeable buyers and sellers understand the peanut gallery.

I also didn't like not being able to choose the buyer with BaT on my other cars. My all-original E30 M3 went to a 15-year-old that planned to take it apart. Nice kid, and nice father, buuut...My mint-perfect, rare-colored, PASM-equipped Cayman S that searched a year for went to someone who wanted a track car. This car should go to someone who knows air-cooled Porsches and is looking for something they can drive now and tinker with over time. They bought 'em, they can do what they want with 'em, but dang...I still remember the guy who parted out the 944 that I slaved over for years and years in my youth...

I think I'm getting a bit dramatic. If it doesn't snow this weekend (gotta love the mountains!) I'll try and take some glamor shots, some revealing shots, and drum up an ad.

It's not only about the money for you. I also would hate to sell a good car to a buyer who hacks it up

However investing to fix it is all about maximizing profit.

One mistake you might be making is assuming that the car is unsellable in its current state. That is false because you're projecting your own buying habits onto this sale. Yes most buyers prefer a hundred percent complete car but there is an alternative Market where people do buy incomplete cars.

So you need to decide what it is you really want. I suppose if you invested to fix it you could have Best of Both Worlds. The higher sale price and control over who buys it via private sale and not BAT.

Why not put up the ad on eBay and Pelican with your current Reserve? There is zero risk in this approach and minimal investment. 1 hour total.

In the meantime why don't you get a quote for getting all the work done? This may satisfy a bit of your unknown... And help to decide if it's worth pursuing.

If it were mine I would rip the band aid off and put it on BaT. I get attached. Once I commit I just want it to go away and not think about it. But here’s the rub, they will trash on the car even if it is very openly described as a work in progress. And you just need to ignore it.

There’s two ways to play it. Let a proxy field all legitimate questions without personally wading through the thrashers. Or, just let the ad speak for the car and neither read nor reply. If you can’t appriach it objectively don’t go BaT. It is only the simplest means of disposal, but not the only one by a long shot.

Love that thing even in GR. The fact it ain’t perfect makes it perfect. Thrash with impunity, get it dirty, add rock chips, destroy tires, bounce it off the limiter. I had a snarly 300 hp 3L with the same body and chassis and it was crazy fun with short gears and 15s. I’d be a playa if it weren’t for blah blah blah, yadda yadda.

Where is the line drawn between a SingerRestoMod vs. a Frankenporsche ?

Paralysis by analysis. If you want to somewhat control who you sell it to, BaT isn't the answer; Pelican or your local PCA is.

We can't make this decision for you. One thing I do agree with however. Wait until you get your other car before you sell this one.

I'm telling you; this car will sell in pretty short order right here in the classifieds, but I think 60-65 is ALL the money, like, too much. Mid 50's maybe.

GLWS.

Great ad for sale, the dogs are awesome.

What Nick said.

MattR

Very thorough ad....... aggressive pricing ....

list it with a reserve. don't lose money on it. i have a 75 911restomod i think of selling every once in a while but its hard to see something you've spent time and money on go away like that.

By all accounts the car will go for 50s. The question is whether it's high 50s or low 50s. I figure pricing it high weeds out the riffraff and rewards buyers who do their research. I suspect that will lead to a more pleasant transaction for all involved.

I do not enjoy the game. I wish all cars had accurate price tags without the need for knowledge and scrutiny. Nobody's gonna steal my car, but I'm not looking to fleece anyone.

Totally agree with your approach and it's an honest car and ad. GLWS.

I respectfully disagree with your approach. Since you don't enjoy the game, perhaps you should price the car closer what you're willing to take? Pricing it at $65 is silly, especially since you think you could get (and even take) low $50's.

A smarter, no frills, no game approach would be to realistically price it close to what you're willing to accept. IMO, that would be $10k less than you're current asking price.

Over priced cars sit. Correctly priced cars sell. I hope I'm wrong, for your sake.

That is only true if you aren't negotiable. He links this thread in his ad. He's being transparent about it. People who are genuinely interested will reach out, and after some foreplay a serious buyer can make an offer without fear that $55k will be seen as an insulting low ball.

Just sell it already.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/suppo...leys/king2.gif