Roll bar install decrease "driver" level cars value?

[Charlienofun]

I'm curious what this forums opinions are on the effects of installing a bolt in roll bar to my '87 930. My car is what I call a "driver" def. not a pampered collector car. The paint is good but it has a decent scratch on the drivers fender that was "fixed" with touch up paint before we bought the car. The body and paint otherwise are original. The engine does have usual power mods 964 cams and Kokelin turbo B&B intercooler euro fuel head.

I love the car and its been owned by my father and now myself for 12+ years. I have started doing track days again and want to run a harness + fixed back seat and roll bar. Prior to the 930 we had a 3.2 with autopower roll bar and sparco seat. That was a great setup for DE’s but with the 930 values going up I’m a little hesitant to drill the body for the roll bar. Am I concerned over nothing? It looks like most of the insanity is with the early cars..

[jwasbury]

I'd expect putting in a roll bar would be a negative from a valuation stand point. If you've owned for 12 years, you're probably sitting on a "built in gain" now anyway, so is a bolt in roll bat going to erase that entirely? I'd think not but who knows really. It's your car, so do as you wish .

If it does worry you, why not just install a harness bar? Easily reversible and no holes to drill. Doesn't have rollover protection level of the roll bar I suppose, but in my opinion, if you're "going for broke" on the track, best to get a purpose built track vehicle, full welded in cage, HANS device, etc.

[Charlienofun]

Originally Posted by jwasbury

I'd expect putting in a roll bar would be a negative from a valuation stand point. If you've owned for 12 years, you're probably sitting on a "built in gain" now anyway, so is a bolt in roll bat going to erase that entirely? I'd think not but who knows really. It's your car, so do as you wish .

If it does worry you, why not just install a harness bar? Easily reversible and no holes to drill. Doesn't have rollover protection level of the roll bar I suppose, but in my opinion, if you're "going for broke" on the track, best to get a purpose built track vehicle, full welded in cage, HANS device, etc.

Good points. I currently have a BK harness truss bar now but the clubs I am doing events with this year (Not PCA) require I use OEM setup or racing seat + bar + harness. I do have a HANS brace and full gear I use for crap can racing that I would be wearing if I were to go this route. The bottom line tho is I don't compete in any way with this car I just enjoy it I'm not in a hurry to figure this out just working on long term plans for the car. I have some leaks I have to finish tackling before it can see a track day.

[saxen]

Weld one in- if you want to sell the car cut/grind it out and it's like it never happened- no holes to fill either

[Ferraripete]

Originally Posted by saxen

Weld one in- if you want to sell the car cut/grind it out and it's like it never happened- no holes to fill either

interesting point...I like your thinking!!

[onboost]

You need to consider a different bar.. I've never liked the autopower bar as it mounts to the floor an requires drilling.

Check a DAS rollbar, it requires not modifications and bolts to the rear seat hinge points and down on the sills at the seat belt anchors.

[infraredcalvin]

Originally Posted by saxen

Weld one in- if you want to sell the car cut/grind it out and it's like it never happened- no holes to fill either

Already welding on car, gotta paint over grind marks, seems to me that bolt in would be less of an impact... drill and weld up holes grind down weld is still going to be less impact...

Quick story... Bruce Meyer (west coast collector) buys a speedster rumored to have been owned by Steve McQueen for big bucks at the time - no real proof it was Steve's old car. Car was pretty beat receives a major reconditioning where needed (not a full resto). Steve and Bruce are at the same event, Bruce is showcasing the car, Steve says, no way is that my car, I had a cage welded and a patch panel due to an off track excursion, he pulls back the floor mat to check, plates from cage still there, patch panel welds still visible...

Not saying you're Steve, but what do you think happened to the value of that car... Now it was confirmed 1st hand...

If you are that concerned about value, and drilling hole or welding plates, why are you putting it on track? Although at some point these cars will reach a value (this number is probably cheaper than you think) that no matter how thrashed they get they'll be worth putting back together about $50K and a donor 911 tub is about what it would cost a skilled rebuilder.

[T77911S]

i would not put one in.

even though the paint is rough, it is still original.
when i was looking at 930's everything had been painted. made me wonder what had been done. i happened to find one with original paint.

find something else to track. JMO.

[IMR-Merlin]

Here's my opinion.

It's your car, if you like driving it and want to increase your driving experience. make it the car YOU want and not worry about what might happen later.

Here is my car.

[Charlienofun]

Originally Posted by onboost

You need to consider a different bar.. I've never liked the autopower bar as it mounts to the floor an requires drilling.

Check a DAS rollbar, it requires not modifications and bolts to the rear seat hinge points and down on the sills at the seat belt anchors.

DAS bar looks really good. Sent pics and links to the safety folks at the main club I run with thanks for the post!!

[Charlienofun]

Originally Posted by T77911S

i would not put one in.

even though the paint is rough, it is still original.
when i was looking at 930's everything had been painted. made me wonder what had been done. i happened to find one with original paint.

find something else to track. JMO.

I hear you but I'm not talking about but doing any irreversible modifications hence my concern about drilling the floor pan. I feel like its a shame just to keep the car for Sunday drives. I wouldn't run the car in any timed events. I imagine I would only run it a few times a year in groups that require points for passing. I have seen a lot of carnage at track days and I know the risk but I feel like most of the time I face more potential danger driving it through city traffic to the track than I do actually in sessions.

I do appreciate your opinion I have oscillated back and fourth a lot.

[Charlienofun]

Originally Posted by IMR-Merlin

Here's my opinion.

It's your car, if you like driving it and want to increase your driving experience. make it the car YOU want and not worry about what might happen later.

Here is my car.

Wow that looks great any info on the bar? looks custom

[IMR-Merlin]

Originally Posted by Charlienofun

Wow that looks great any info on the bar? looks custom

Thanks! It's about as custom as you can get in my little shop.

.120 wall main hoops with .120 wall door bars and .083 cross bracing.

[speednme1]

Or you can just install a Hiego Roll bar. Modular with very easy install and easy removal. Purchase at FVD. Speak with Rhonda...she'll take care of you.

[T77911S]

you asked if it would bring the value down. as someone that just bought one 2yrs ago yes i think it will. when i looked at cars, and i looked at a LOT, i put a lower value on ones that had been modified and especially depending on the mods.
dont set the value low on your car just because of a scratch or its a daily driver. the choice is your as to what you do with it.

[Miguel Antonett]

I'd say YES, unless there's lots of pedigree with the car.

[Uncle]

Did you buy the car for you or the next guy?

[Jeff NJ]

I would think that any car with a rollcage installed would be considered to be thrashed more than an all original car. Racing on a track certainly shortens the life of many components, and any car with a rollcage would properly be assumed by a potential buyer to have been on track quite a bit. You see the ads stating "never tracked" for this reason.
I would think that anyone here looking at 930s and having two choices for the same price, would pick the car without the rollcage, if everything else was equal, (unless they wanted a track car) so by definition, a roll cage diminishes value.

Of course, that has nothing to do with whether you should enjoy your car unless your primary concern is resale value and if it were, you probably wouldn't be tracking it.

[Menmojo]

I'm not saving my 930 for the next guy.
Roll bars rock. They also stiffen up the chassis which helps improve the handling.
If I ever sell my car and someone doesn't like it because it's modified then too bad.
There has been was too much chatter about valuations lately in my opinion. I personally never bought any of my Porsches because I was looking for an investment.......

[jwasbury]

I've tracked my '79 a decent amount, so I've definitely enjoyed my car. I've modded the car somewhat extensively too, to improve performance. When I got to the point where I decided to go deeper into the "track thing" I decided the 930 was too nice to gut the interior and weld in a roll cage. I also just got the A/C working well, so I was loathe to rip it all out again. For anyone who goes down the path of track driving, you come to a point where you have to decide if your car is street car or a track car. I made the decision that my car is a street car. I have this for the track now (and soon will have a spec Miata in the fleet):