The GOAT- Basketball

[stevej37]

Bill Laimbeer

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by pwd72s

Yep..Jerry West. I tried to tell you boyz...

Also keep in mind USA with him the star of the team, won Olympic Gold before NBA pros were allowed to compete. Back then it was our college kids against other national (de facto) pros.

If they had a three point line back then, as an outstanding perimeter shooter, he could have been the highest scorer of all time or close to it.




The reason they call him "the logo"? his silhouette is used as the official NBA deal:

[Sooner or later]

Probably Jordan.

Dr. J was my favorite. I even played with an RWB ABA ball.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Dr. J was my favorite.

Hakeem was mine.

I vote Jordan.

[Seahawk]

West was my favorite player...we lived near LA growing up and even then it was apparent I would need a jump shot and smarts if I was going to play HS basketball in Southern California.

My moves to the rack could be timed with a sun dial...but I never stopped moving.

Bird is next since I am white and played against anyone anywhere and could shoot and pass.

I have played with, and I emphasize the "with", a lot of college and pro players when I was young in college gyms....later in the Navy. The delta between them and the rest of us is hard to fathom if you haven't done it.

GOAT?

I have a top five that has nothing to do with championships (Jordan without Pippen, Bird without McHale, Magic without everybody, etc.) because it is a team game.

[drcoastline]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

West was my favorite player...we lived near LA growing up and even then it was apparent I would need a jump shot and smarts if I was going to play HS basketball in Southern California.

My moves to the rack could be timed with a sun dial...but I never stopped moving.

Bird is next since I am white and played against anyone anywhere and could shoot and pass.

I have played with, and I emphasize the "with", a lot of college and pro players when I was young in college gyms....later in the Navy. The delta between them and the rest of us is hard to fathom if you haven't done it.

GOAT?

I have a top five that has nothing to do with championships (Jordan without Pippen, Bird without McHale, Magic without everybody, etc.) because it is a team game.

Which is why I like Maravich. He never had a team behind him, he never had a a Pipen, Mcahale or anyone. He never won a championship because he never had support. His stats are all him. What if he had a Jabar, Shaq, Barkley a three point line or a time clock? Everyone of the other players had support.

[gregpark]

Larry Bird was a pure shooter, unbelievable
passer and the fiercest competitor ever. And if trash talking skills are factored in then you gotta go with Bird

[pwd72s]

Navy Basketball tale for Seahawk. Remember when Navy was in the final 4 with Robinson at center? One of his team mates was from this small town...Kyler Whittaker.
Kyler's dad told me a tale from after when Kyler graduated. Kyler got stationed on a carrier fleet support ship. His Captain got a call...the admiral wanted Kyler to come to lunch aboard the carrier.

Poor kyler...scared he was in trouble, trying to figure out what he'd done...

Turned out there was going to be a challenge basketball game on the carrier deck...Marines vs. Navy. The admiral wanted Navy to win...

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

The delta between them and the rest of us is hard to fathom if you haven't done it.

+1

You played ball with guys that made it to the pros. How many layers of ability before you get to a Maravich? How many guys? 20 that are way up there?

Genetically gifted freaks, I tell ya. We can't fathom.

For fun:

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

GOAT?

I have a top five that has nothing to do with championships (Jordan without Pippen, Bird without McHale, Magic without everybody, etc.) because it is a team game.

That brings up a whole 'nuther measure of GOAT.

Lots of individual superstars, Kobe is one of em but he was NOT a team player in any sense. It was all 'bout him. He even threatened to punch Rick Fox for taking a shot when Kobe thought it was his turn. Ball hog who shot 30% on a good day. He had Shaq chased off so he didn't have to share the spotlight.


IMO no NBA player was a greater team player than Magic. He made everyone else on the team better, the opposite of kobe.
A decent player would turn into an all star when magic was calling the shots.
He wasn't the best shooter, or best moover, but he was the best team player. And they loved him for it.
Worthy once said that when Magic was on the court, you could never take your eyes off him. The second you do he'll hit you in the side of the face with a no-look pass
Magic loved getting assists, he loved setting up his teammates to score.

Bird did a lot of that too.

Same could be said about the GOAT in fooseball, Tom Brady.
Not the best passer ever, not the best scrambler, but he makes the rest of the team better just by his presence and influence. He demands greatness and it ain't all about him.

MJ was just as demanding but too often he rubbed the other players the wrong way, got their best through intimidation.
Not many of them really liked MJ and he was just fine with that.

[rusnak]

Magic and the "Baby Skyhook". He made it a positive thing to be a fan. I think a part of the GOAT criteria should consider how they influenced their sport's positive image beyond basketball. In other words, would you take your kid to a game to watch them? Kids inevitably look to their heroes as some sort of role model whether we like it or not.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

IMO no NBA player was a greater team player than Magic.

Could not agree more. He is in my top five, which I don’t rank from one to five, just a lump of five.

Magic changed the game like few others.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Hard to question the greatness of Bird and Magic. But with regards to Jordan, it’s hard to argue that he ever had much more than role players as his supporting cast. What did Pippen or Grant ever accomplish without Jordan? They were mediocre at best. Magic had Kareem, Bird had McHale and Parish. Jordan didn’t play with any hall of famers.

[Nostril Cheese]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

Could not agree more. He is in my top five, which I don’t rank from one to five, just a lump of five.

Magic changed the game like few others.

Getting to see a Showtime playoff game at the Forum was a childhood highlight.

[3rd_gear_Ted]

Wilt Chamberlin

10,000 girlfriends.

His home is a legendary place in certain circles.

Kobe & his Mamba mentality made trash talking old school.

[rusnak]

Originally Posted by Nostril Cheese

Getting to see a Showtime playoff game at the Forum was a childhood highlight.

Damn skippy! That would be a lifetime highlight.

[Tobra]

It is a question of who is second best, behind Chamberlain. He was probably the greatest athlete who ever lived. They changed the rules to make it easier for Jordan, they changed them to make Chamberlain less dominant.

I happen to have a patient who played at Kansas with Wilt. He laughed when I asked him if Jordan in his prime was better than Wilt in his. People think of Chamberlain as this giant, but they forget he was world class athlete who happened to be tall. He also was afraid of hurting other guys, so he did not play as aggressively as he might have.

I had a new patient last week who was on the USA Volleyball team in the 1970's. He met Wilt on the beach, when he was rehabbing his knee, post NBA retirement. He was a college kid, and ended up playing a lot of V-ball with the Big Dipper, even went to some parties at the million dollar mansion.

Larry Brown tells a story about Wilt playing with four of his kids from UCLA against Magic and 4 hall of fame NBA players. Wilt retired 10 years dominates 5 high level NBA players.

I have always been a fan of Pistol Pete. If you are a fan of Magic, you can see where his game comes from if you watch old films from LSU and before he tore his knees up in the pro game.

[gsxrken]

“ Chamberlain holds 72 NBA records, 68 by himself.[8] Among his records are several that are considered unbreakable, such as averaging 22.9 rebounds for a career or 50.4 points per game in a season, scoring 100 points or 55 rebounds in a single game, scoring 65 or more points 15 times, 50 or more points 118 times.[7][9] During Chamberlain's time, defensive statistics like blocks and steals had not been recorded yet. However, according to Jack Ramsay, "Harvey [Pollack] said he used to tell one of his statisticians to keep track of Wilt's blocks in big games ... One night, they got up to 25."[10]

NBA record – Most 50-point games in a season (45 in 1961–62)
Chamberlain holds the next most with 30 in 1962–63. No other player has had more than 10.

[ckissick]

Originally Posted by gsxrken

“ Chamberlain holds 72 NBA records, 68 by himself.[8] Among his records are several that are considered unbreakable, such as averaging 22.9 rebounds for a career or 50.4 points per game in a season, scoring 100 points or 55 rebounds in a single game, scoring 65 or more points 15 times, 50 or more points 118 times.[7][9] During Chamberlain's time, defensive statistics like blocks and steals had not been recorded yet. However, according to Jack Ramsay, "Harvey [Pollack] said he used to tell one of his statisticians to keep track of Wilt's blocks in big games ... One night, they got up to 25."[10]

NBA record – Most 50-point games in a season (45 in 1961–62)
Chamberlain holds the next most with 30 in 1962–63. No other player has had more than 10.

Yet most say MJ was the GOAT? I don't know about that.

[mattdavis11]

Wilt was good. Bird would have made him look like a fool.

https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/larry_bird_vs_wilt_chamberlain.htm