Statute Of Limitations for Murder?

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by masraum

Your beef is primarily with the justice system. The justice system thought that this guy had paid his debt and released him. You can't blame the guy for not committing suicide or refusing to leave prison.

Could/should the guy have done more? I have no idea. I don't know what he's done and not done.

I have beefs with:

A justice system that allows minimal punishment for serious crimes.

People that commit heinous crimes (murder).

People that seem to personally benefit (really not pay) for their crimes.

People that make excuses for people that do the inexcusable.

I do not expect him to do anything but what is best for him. Get out of jail as soon as he can and make the best life he can. I simply do not want to hear what a Samaritan he is for telling us he is a murderer and him profiting from it. If he had quietly done acts of good to atone, I would respect that. Writing a book that glorifies his life, not so much.

[greglepore]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I have beefs with:

A justice system that allows minimal punishment for serious crimes.

People that commit heinous crimes (murder).

People that seem to personally benefit (really not pay) for their crimes.

People that make excuses for people that do the inexcusable.

I do not expect him to do anything but what is best for him. Get out of jail as soon as he can and make the best life he can. I simply do not want to hear what a Samaritan he is for telling us he is a murderer and him profiting from it. If he had quietly done acts of good to atone, I would respect that. Writing a book that glorifies his life, not so much.

Neither of us have read the book, which comes out in early 2022. It doesn't sound from the SI article like it glorifies his life, rather that he is haunted by his past. FWIW

[gordner]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I have beefs with:

A justice system that allows minimal punishment for serious crimes.

People that commit heinous crimes (murder).

People that seem to personally benefit (really not pay) for their crimes.

People that make excuses for people that do the inexcusable.

I do not expect him to do anything but what is best for him. Get out of jail as soon as he can and make the best life he can. I simply do not want to hear what a Samaritan he is for telling us he is a murderer and him profiting from it. If he had quietly done acts of good to atone, I would respect that. Writing a book that glorifies his life, not so much.

The justice system you have so many issues with would, in this example, seem to have worked quite well. He was punished for the crime he committed, and it seems reformed at the same time. Is that not the intent of the system?

Not that I do not agree with much of your chastising of the system, just seems it would be better added to a thread that does not demonstrate the successes possible under the system as it stands. This guy is like a poster book for what incarceration is supposed to achieve.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by greglepore

Neither of us have read the book, which comes out in early 2022. It doesn't sound from the SI article like it glorifies his life, rather that he is haunted by his past. FWIW

I have certainly read how they are selling the book. It sure sounds like they are glorifying his life to me. This is the description on Amazon:

One of the most successful Black businessmen in the country, who has led Nike’s Jordan Brand from a $200M sneaker company to a $4B global apparel juggernaut, tells the remarkable story of his rise from gangland violence to the pinnacles of international business.

About the Author
Larry Miller was appointed the first chairman of the Jordan Brand Advisory Board in January 2019. Under his leadership, Jordan Brand has grown from a $200-million basketball-shoe company to a $4-billion athletic footwear and apparel firm. Miller helped found the Jordan Brand at Nike in 1999 before becoming president of the Portland Trailblazers from 2007 to 2012, after which he returned to Jordan Brand. Miller graduated with honors from Temple University in 1980 and earned an MBA from LaSalle University. He has served on the boards of directors of Self Enhancement, Inc. A passionate advocate for education and mentorship, he’s taken leadership roles with the Urban League and Junior Achievement in the past. Born in Philadelphia, he lives in Portland, OR.

[Sooner or later]

Good for him.

He took a dark time in his life and actually used the time to better himself by getting a degree. An actual success story

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by gordner

The justice system you have so many issues with would, in this example, seem to have worked quite well. He was punished for the crime he committed, and it seems reformed at the same time. Is that not the intent of the system?

Not that I do not agree with much of your chastising of the system, just seems it would be better added to a thread that does not demonstrate the successes possible under the system as it stands. This guy is like a poster book for what incarceration is supposed to achieve.

It worked quite well for him, not so much for his victim or dissuading others to follow in his path.

If you are making a case for rehabilitation, you could probably use this as an example...but incarceration should have multiple goals. They are often referred to as:
retribution, incapacitation, deterrence and rehabilitation. These involve, IMHO...keeping criminals off the street, punishing criminals sufficiently that they do not repeat, setting an example with enough severity that others do not commit similar crimes, stigmatizing violent criminals (not celebrating them) enough to act as a deterrent for others. I am not certain that this case meets all those requirements. The book seems less an act of contrition than a jump start to the writing career of a close relative. Society would have benefitted more from his silence.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Good for him.

He took a dark time in his life and actually used the time to better himself by getting a degree. An actual success story

Too bad his victim was never allowed the same.

One could easily say the same for someone who killed a bank employee in a robbery...and was never caught. Living as a king on the money he stole. An actual success story.

[greglepore]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I have certainly read how they are selling the book. It sure sounds like they are glorifying his life to me. This is the description on Amazon:

One of the most successful Black businessmen in the country, who has led Nike’s Jordan Brand from a $200M sneaker company to a $4B global apparel juggernaut, tells the remarkable story of his rise from gangland violence to the pinnacles of international business.

About the Author
Larry Miller was appointed the first chairman of the Jordan Brand Advisory Board in January 2019. Under his leadership, Jordan Brand has grown from a $200-million basketball-shoe company to a $4-billion athletic footwear and apparel firm. Miller helped found the Jordan Brand at Nike in 1999 before becoming president of the Portland Trailblazers from 2007 to 2012, after which he returned to Jordan Brand. Miller graduated with honors from Temple University in 1980 and earned an MBA from LaSalle University. He has served on the boards of directors of Self Enhancement, Inc. A passionate advocate for education and mentorship, he’s taken leadership roles with the Urban League and Junior Achievement in the past. Born in Philadelphia, he lives in Portland, OR.

They may be marketing it that way, but read the quotes in the SI piece linked above.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by greglepore

They may be marketing it that way, but read the quotes in the SI piece linked above.

One must assume that they are marketing the product....so one would expect the contents to match the flyleaf/cover.

I read the SI article. I do not recall any quotes from the book.

I do recall this quote (regarding the book) from his interview: “It’s freed me,” he says. “I feel the freedom now to be me.”

Sounds a bit selfish to me. Like he is glad his secret is out so he does not have to suffer any longer for his misdeeds. It does not seem to have a lot of concern for others that he made suffer. I would have preferred him asking forgiveness of his victim's family. The fact that he was mildly punished does not change what he did or mitigate the effect in any way. A bit more remorse/contrition would go a long way.

[Sooner or later]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Too bad his victim was never allowed the same.

One could easily say the same for someone who killed a bank employee in a robbery...and was never caught. Living as a king on the money he stole. An actual success story.

He was caught and served his time.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

He was caught and served his time.

We know.

He is still a cold blooded murderer. Bundy, Manson, and Rudolf Hess did the same. None are role models.

[Sooner or later]

Rehabilitated. What we want from our system.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Rehabilitated. What we want from our system.

Your standards are quite low. We want retribution, incapacitation, deterrence and rehabilitation. Rehabilitation is the last and least.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by fintstone

It worked quite well for him, not so much for his victim or dissuading others to follow in his path.

You're right. The cops should have put one behind is ear when they got him. That would have been much better. And while we're at it, when a 4 year old grabs a candy bar in the check out line and wanders out with it, they should lose a hand. That'll teach 'em!

[masraum]

Originally Posted by fintstone

One must assume that they are marketing the product....so one would expect the contents to match the flyleaf/cover.

I read the SI article. I do not recall any quotes from the book.

I do recall this quote (regarding the book) from his interview: “It’s freed me,” he says. “I feel the freedom now to be me.”

Sounds a bit selfish to me. Like he is glad his secret is out so he does not have to suffer any longer for his misdeeds. It does not seem to have a lot of concern for others that he made suffer. I would have preferred him asking forgiveness of his victim's family. The fact that he was mildly punished does not change what he did or mitigate the effect in any way. A bit more remorse/contrition would go a long way.

Do we actually know that he hasn't dealt with the victim's family or is that just an assumption?

[oldE]

Flint, I may be judging from a different standard, but I seems as all four goals were met.
I have no idea what retribution should look like, but he was arrested convicted and incarcerated, giving up his freedom for 15 years. I believe you stated in another post he should have got a life sentence. That likely would have negated the chance of the fourth goal.
Incapacitation was achieved, as he was no longer able to take part in criminal activity.
Deterrence seems to have been achieved. He did not murder again.
He seems to be a model for rehabilitation.
In an imperfect world, could much more have been achieved?
Perhaps if he gave his money to the White family it would temper some of the outrage.
Nothing will return their son..

Best
Les

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by oldE

Flint, I may be judging from a different standard, but I seems as all four goals were met.
I have no idea what retribution should look like, but he was arrested convicted and incarcerated, giving up his freedom for 15 years. I believe you stated in another post he should have got a life sentence. That likely would have negated the chance of the fourth goal.
Incapacitation was achieved, as he was no longer able to take part in criminal activity.
Deterrence seems to have been achieved. He did not murder again.
He seems to be a model for rehabilitation.
In an imperfect world, could much more have been achieved?
Perhaps if he gave his money to the White family it would temper some of the outrage.
Nothing will return their son..

Best
Les

I agree with some of that...but I see deterrence a bit wider than you. To me, I want the punishment severe enough to deter both the perp and others. The sentence should be long enough to make others think twice about that type behavior and generally, the scorn and suffering after prison is part of that. I also see retribution as very mild at less than 15 years (with a free college degree and sealed records). I had to spend longer that that in the military to earn my education and it still cost me a great deal out of pocket). Many that joined for the GI Bill never returned or used it. He was actually better off than many who were drafted (he was protected and could not be) and died/were maimed.

It is not so much about money...but how he is portrayed. The attitude that this guy is all that...when in fact, he is a cold blooded murderer who took the life of another for no reason. Serving time in prison does not change what he did. He does not get a clean scoresheet.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by masraum

You're right. The cops should have put one behind is ear when they got him. That would have been much better. And while we're at it, when a 4 year old grabs a candy bar in the check out line and wanders out with it, they should lose a hand. That'll teach 'em!

Yep...cold blooded murder and a child stealing a candy bar are sooo similar. Making such comparisons are a part of the problem we have today with crime.

If a 4 year old is stealing, that is the parent's responsibility (parent should be punished). If they take young children to the store and allow them enough freedom to steal something and wander out with it, that is child abuse.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by masraum

Do we actually know that he hasn't dealt with the victim's family or is that just an assumption?

"According to Sports Illustrated, Miller plans to reach out to White's family, though there has been no public apology yet."

One would assume that Edward White's parents and grandparents are likely long dead and he didn't live long enough to have children...so pretty inconvenient at this point. He really does not have to face them.

Just another black on white crime...so not really a big deal?

[matthewb0051]

Originally Posted by oldE

It seems to me if this guy had got out prison after 15 years for a capital crime committed as a teenager

Unless I missed something, this was not a Capital offense. At least in Texas, Capital requires murder of a police officer, child under 16, commission of another felony at time of murder, or multiple murders at same time.

Originally Posted by greglepore

No. It has nothing to do with wealth. It has to do with circumstance. He was sucked into a corrupt culture as a young teen. There's a reason for a juvenile justice system.
?

I've worked with juvenile defendants in the past. When I returned to criminal defense last year, I swore never again with the juveniles. There are some that for me were intolerable. There is also the possibility to treat juveniles as adults when the crime is particularly heinous. Seems to be more common in the South though.

Originally Posted by A930Rocket

^^^ Making great money over the years and this book, how much is he sharing with the family of the murdered victim? I’ll bet none and never did.

That is a great question and could really shed light on his rehabilitation. Not that it is required.