Wiring - house

[Alan A]

Have no lights in the garage. It’s finished so nothing is accessible.

The two 3 way switches both have 120, and I’ve changed them both for new so it’s not that.

There’s 1-2v at the light terminations. Yes. One volt, not zero or (better) 120.

I’m guessing - and I have nfc how - a wires burned out. When I finish recovering from this surgery and can do stuff I’ll be able to actually trace from the switches and see if there’s an interruption in something, but until then I’m lightless.

My question - has anyone used that plastic surface conduit for this application?
Is there a better option?
I can’t face ripping out drywall to rerun lines.

[stevej37]

I have used the plastic surface conduit in an older home that had plaster/lath strip walls. I used it for extra outlets along the baseboard. It's easy to use and blends in with the right wall paint.

Other than that....I have no answer.

[908/930]

Possibly buy a cheap wire tracer and track down the problem.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by 908/930

Possibly buy a cheap wire tracer and track down the problem.

If it's all in one room an extension cord or length of wire can test continuity. First find what switch has the hot feed. That's a must or all else is wasted time.

If you have a hot lead in one box, come back and we'll sort this. BTW, if the light is wired between the switches, it's a different wiring; needs 4, not 3. If the hot is at the light box, again wiring is a bit different.

So first things first. And the hot should be unswitched except for the breaker. So a non-contact voltage detector is all you need.

[Alan A]

Originally Posted by Zeke

If it's all in one room an extension cord or length of wire can test continuity. First find what switch has the hot feed. That's a must or all else is wasted time.

If you have a hot lead in one box, come back and we'll sort this. BTW, if the light is wired between the switches, it's a different wiring; needs 4, not 3. If the hot is at the light box, again wiring is a bit different.

So first things first. And the hot should be unswitched except for the breaker. So a non-contact voltage detector is all you need.

I already said - it’s a 3 way switched light set.
Two switches, multiple holes in the ceiling.
All in ceiling at 1V, black to white (and red). Switches otoh both at 120v.

I need to hook up longer wires to the multimeter to go from switch to light boxes to test continuity but I’m not fit to climb r/n.

My question was - if a wire is meth’d up can I redo all of it with surface conduit or is there a better option?

[MBAtarga]

I've used the surface mount products. That is definitely a solution for you if you find you've got an open in your wiring.

In my case, I moved a light switch in our laundry room to be closer to the door frame so that it's easily reachable when you walk into the room. I thought I could just run the wiring closer to the frame within the wall - but then found there's an AC metal ductwork that is within the wall - which is why the switch was installed further from the door frame than normal. My solution was using the surface mount products to route the wiring from the original switch box over to the newly installed switch box.

[look 171]

A better question is, how long ago did they go bad. Wires just don't go bad. When was the last time they worked. I think you must have done something during your rewire. I would remove the switch, and find out which is the hot leg like Milt said. Then jsut jump the wire to see if the light goes on. If so, then hot up the traveler and see if anything happens at the other end. Depending how it is wired, no need to get fancy just a simple test light will almost do. Its a process of elimination. 3 ways wiring isn't too bad to trace once you have an understanding where the power is coming from.

[Alan A]

Originally Posted by look 171

A better question is, how long ago did they go bad. Wires just don't go bad. When was the last time they worked. I think you must have done something during your rewire. I would remove the switch, and find out which is the hot leg like Milt said. Then jsut jump the wire to see if the light goes on. If so, then hot up the traveler and see if anything happens at the other end. Depending how it is wired, no need to get fancy just a simple test light will almost do. Its a process of elimination. 3 ways wiring isn't too bad to trace once you have an understanding where the power is coming from.

They worked for 15 years +
Then one day they didn’t.

And FFS I already said I changed BOTH switches for known good 3-ways.
Please stop with the voltmeter 101.

[Zeke]

Sorry I didn't respond the way you wanted, Alan. I did miss the part about having voltage in both boxes but you still have to know which is fed from the circuit if you want any chance of repairing what you have.

The reason I said what I said is 9 times out of 10 the wiring is not done correctly and that's why the lights don't work. If you know you have a break (you don't by the terminology you used), then obviously you need to rewire. Since all wires to any fixture have to be in the same cable or conduit, then WireMold is the way to do it.

In case you are able to fish any part of it, WM does make fittings for a cable (what many refer to as Romex) to exit the WM and run behind the drywall as far is it will go. Of course any corners and blocking will foul that plan.

So to please you and give you the straight answer, yes I have used approved surface mount conduit in plastic and metal. You can run cable in WM but it was designed for individual wires. If the WM makes a hard angle at the ceiling you cannot use cable as the code won't allow a bend where the radius is less than 7 times the overall diameter of the cable. You can see by this that individual wires can make that bend within the code.

[Alan A]

It has to be a short in one of the wires unless it rubbed or separated up inside the one ceiling box I haven’t pulled the fixture to get to yet.

God knows why it randomly did this - I thought initially perhaps a switch went bad. 17 years in this place and I didn’t even know it was a 3-way until this happened - the switch by the garage doors was covered with shelves.

Beams are perpendicular to the wires so I’m not pulling a damn thing and NFW am I hacking drywall. If I have to run cable, this will need to be outside.

I can go and buy metal conduit or armored cable, but I’d rather use plastic since it’s cheap and so am I. I have a ton of Romex lying around. I’m still hoping for a short in that last ceiling box, but I’m not banking on it.

[fintstone]

I would bet it is the fixture or a connection in the light box. The only time I have seen otherwise is when a nail or screw has been driven through a wire. Sometimes that does not show up immediately. I had one house where they did this apparently when installing cable. The installed cable/outlet shielding was hot (at 110V). I found out when disconnecting the cable and was shocked. They managed to put a screw right through a live wire when they mounted the cable box outside.

I had another house where the previous owner put a large nail in the finished wall of the garage to hang something on. He drove it into a plastic drainpipe from a rarely used bathroom upstairs. The pipe was not under pressure and the nail largely filled the hole, so it only showed up now and then occasionally and looked like the roof leaked. Patch the roof and it seemed to go away...but always came back. Had to open the wall to find out the problem.

[Zeke]

^^^ Yeah, I've never known of a wire nut coming loose. It's always something real complicated like the flux capacitor.

[craigster59]

Wiremold is a good product...

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Legrand-Wiremold-700-Series-10-ft-Metal-Surface-Raceway-Channel-in-White-700WH/100144606

[Alan A]

Originally Posted by Zeke

^^^ Yeah, I've never known of a wire nut coming loose. It's always something real complicated like the flux capacitor.

I’ve pulled all the fixtures bar one and that I’ve removed the wire nuts that are visible - its all track fluorescent with a feed hole that goes over the ceiling box.

I’m taking voltage off wires inside each of the ceiling boxes bar that last.

4 more weeks before I can actually pull that last fixture and see the box under it. I really hope it’s something stupid in there because I’ve no desire to rewrite it all.

[red 928]

Originally Posted by Alan A

They worked for 15 years +
Then one day they didn’t.

And FFS I already said I changed BOTH switches for known good 3-ways.
Please stop with the voltmeter 101.

Have you tried changing the switches?
j/k

my bet is a traveler wire.