Any information about the Pacific Palisades Fire

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by Tobra

I guarantee this is worse in California than any other state

No doubt ... but it has been happening for years here and everywhere, and CA is just more widespread and WAY more expensive. But other "areas" are ob$cene here too....

[onewhippedpuppy]

Basic supply and demand is going to make construction costs go crazy. The people with cash will be throwing it at builders trying to be first in line, pushing the normal folks years into the queue. I could see that fact alone leading people to look elsewhere for a new start.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by Tobra

People from here unhappy what people come here and do to the place are not really California haters

There it is.

Paradise Lost.

Now, back to the fire, and the fire only...I know, I know.

[group911@aol.co]

This. It's California- the home of the 4th or 5th highest GDP of any country in the world. They are net positive payers to the US Treasury. People actually want to live there. As Noah pointed out, the Palisades folks are out shopping for houses as we speak and likely with boatloads of cash.
Their vast population of immigrants are scrappers and will figure it all out along with everybody else. A few heads will roll and it's not likely that the water infrastructure will change much. All you naysayers put your collective heads together and try to conger up a system that will deliver a million GPM of water and then dream up those firehouses that house 30 pumpers- at the top of every canyon.

Originally Posted by speeder

How much do you California haters want to bet right here and now that every square inch that was burned in the Palisades gets rebuilt? As always, you seem to have a basic misunderstanding of this place and think that it's just Phoenix or Cincinnati near the ocean.

Where would some super-successful people who lived in the Palisades move to, in your imagination? People live here BY CHOICE, not because it's where they were hatched and they never had the wherewithal to move anywhere else. It's a special place. Yes, it's more expensive in every way than most other places in the U.S. but the benefits in terms of recreation, natural beauty, the local economy, jobs, institutes of higher learning, restaurants, etc., make the possible replacement locations close to non-existent.

Also, people have lived in the area for generations and have deep community and professional ties, not to mention extended family. One good friend who grew up in Santa Monica Canyon, (between Pacific Palisades and Santa Monica), owns a house now in the canyon and his 85 year old father and stepmother live close by. Both houses were spared or missed by the fire, thank god. The father is one of 10 children, all very accomplished and most relocated to the Santa Monica or Palisades area decades ago from New York and raised families here.

They are just one example of a very large family full of high achievers in the area. There are thousands of others. Do people like this exist in other parts of the country and the world? Of course they do but I'm talking about people who choose to live in Southern California in places so beautiful that I could not have closed my eyes and imagined them as a child before I saw them. The thought of people like this relocating to somewhere in the middle of the country because of a fire is absurd. Maybe there is some young tech-scrote or influencer living off of credit cards who lived in the area and will now get spit-out back to Kansas but I view that as a positive for L.A. I hope that lots of weaklings leave, we'll be better for it.

[Seahawk]

The fire only, FTLOG. There is a thread in PARF for the politics and I move a lot there.

I don't need any support or advice, BTW...I have lived the dream with fires in California and would prefer not being lectured to. Friends of mine, from HS and college, have lost their houses...relatives as well. Try and be civil. I have, but that may not last.

I know, I know.

Best.

[Danimal16]

Originally Posted by KC911

I don't want to sound facetious, but the design of systems is easy enough... gettting it done logistically and paid for? That's where reality happens .... and usually doesn't happen.

Because it cost too much to do it 100%.... and even then Mother Nature will prevail and people will lose... everything.

But I defer to your expertise ... that's not my arena... at all.

Best to you all going forward...

It sounds expensive, but it depends on what and how it is done. The biggest problem that I have seen is small minded politicians raiding reserve funds.

For example, I would argue that the public, the end user, is more than willing to pay for reasonable and beneficial improvements; take a look at the large bond measures that California Citizens have repeatedly voted for. Then you get the politicians and their friends raiding those funds at taxpayer expense with absolutely nothing to show for it. So funding can not be the show stopper folks claim it is.

It is really sad and aggravating to have a bunch of politicians raid a well engineered system.

And don't get me started on the environmental industrial complex, those bastards cause far more damage than good.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

This. It's California- the home of the 4th or 5th highest GDP of any country in the world. They are net positive payers to the US Treasury. People actually want to live there. As Noah pointed out, the Palisades folks are out shopping for houses as we speak and likely with boatloads of cash.
Their vast population of immigrants are scrappers and will figure it all out along with everybody else. A few heads will roll and it's not likely that the water infrastructure will change much. All you naysayers put your collective heads together and try to conger up a system that will deliver a million GPM of water and then dream up those firehouses that house 30 pumpers- at the top of every canyon.

I am pretty sure that our communities do not have problems managing fires...but if we needed 30 pumpers at the top of every canyon and a million GPM of water, I am pretty sure that we would come up with a solution. Either to not build there, remove the undergrowth, or some other more reasonable design. Maybe just better detection, reporting and shorter response time (just one pumper at the head of the canyon). There was a point where just one pumper could have put out the blaze...if it had arrived before the fire grew.

The "net positive payers" line is really nonsense...as all states contribute more in taxes than they get back in direct services specifically for that state. The only way to arrive at that would be to try to make a case that money the government spends in a state on social security, military bases, civil service, and military/civil service pensions, or to buy goods/materials like military weapons, oil, etc. was somehow a gift to a state. On the contrary, people don't retire to CA and the military does not buy a lot of goods there simply because it is so expensive, and other states compete better/cost less.

It is good that Californians have "boatloads of cash" and will not need any Federal funds after this to restore the state. I was under the impression that was not the case...and the Governor was already asking the President-elect for assistance.

[RANDY P]

Is hanging with the Kardashians and the other shiny people worth overpaying and suffering with administrative incompetence and huge fees?

We're about to find out!

rjp

[varmint]

Early on it was explained to me, Beverly Hills is a machine designed by realtors and plastic surgeons to suck money out of nouveau riche idiots. These people will be running the palisades soon.

[jyl]

1991 (?) Oakland Hills fire aka Tunnel Fire, a nightmare scenario, burning tightly packed houses surrounded by dense landscaping and trees with roads too tight for fire engines. 3,300 homes destroyed, 25 killed. Today hardly anyone under 50 even knows about it, and it’s all lovely houses and mature vegetation ready to burn again.

Fire is part of California and the West, it is getting worse and more dangerous, and the people, construction techniques, firefighting, insurance market, will adapt.

[Racerbvd]

[javadog]

Well, gotta weed out the riffraff.

[speeder]

Originally Posted by RANDY P

Is hanging with the Kardashians and the other shiny people worth overpaying and suffering with administrative incompetence and huge fees?

We're about to find out!

rjp

Let me ask you something, do you like where you live? If so, why would you feel such a need to talk schit about Los Angeles, particularly while we're in the middle of the worst disaster this place has ever seen? It's kind of pathological...I'm no shrink but it seems like you and a few others have a real complex about the place you live. You know that it kind of sucks, it may be cheaper than the better places but it's what you can afford. I get it. But at least show a thimble full of respect for people suffering unimaginable loss even if it's in a place that you envy and despise.

I love where I live. I didn't think that it was possible to love it anymore but since the fires, I do. It's a place filled with the absolute best people on earth, from everywhere else on earth. Adventurous risk takers, every last one of them...at least all of the ones who came from somewhere else. Are there bad people? Of course, it's a county of 10M people. But the good people absolutely drown them out. The spirit of volunteerism and giving I've seen in the last 2 weeks has brought me to tears more than once, nearly everyone wants to help and give to those who have lost.

We don't care if they are rich people or poor, who they voted for, there is no vetting process for who gets aid. My buddy is the national marketing director for a very hot athletic shoe company, (On Running), we have had pop-ups this last week where anyone can come and get free shoes and a track suit. Since the shoes retail for up to $180, (I have several pairs), I asked him, "do you think that you need some kind of firewall to make sure that the people coming are really fire victims?" He replied that he doesn't care. When we run out, he will go to the warehouse and get more.

You can multiply that story times 1000, at least. I wrote earlier about my friend's cafe that has been making hundreds of breakfast burritos for fire fighters and cops in the fire zone since the first night. They have converted a big part of the cafe to a distribution center for food from their own kitchen as well as World Central Kitchen and volunteer drivers such as myself are bringing it wherever it needs to go.

Another close friend who owns a couple of bars in Hollywood has completely converted the performance space at one of them into a clothing drop-off space and his kids have been working 12+ hours a day sorting through them and making packages for families who email them their specific needs, such as 12 year old boy/ten year old girl/Mom/Dad with sizes, etc.

What I haven't seen is one ounce of self pity from people who have lost everything, just sadness and a will to get through it. Amazing strength. They interviewed a guy on local news who lost everything but the clothes on his family's backs and he was holding strong. He mentioned that his son was a newly minted Marine flying back from North Carolina to help...that gives you and idea of what kind of people we are talking about. Kardashians? I've never heard anyone even mention them here, (they are kind of a local embarrassment), sounds like they are popular in the heartland, though.

I see nothing but love and generosity here. I love this place and the people in it. The best decision I ever made was moving here, a long time ago. I drive Uber on weekends and worked yesterday, I love doing it most of the time because of the people I meet from everywhere on earth. I gave a ride to a teenager in her private school uniform yesterday, rich black girl if I'm making assumptions. We have a lot of them here, as well as every other type of person on earth. She was very nice and conversational. We talked about the fires, the air quality, the volunteerism, all of that. I mentioned that people on the internet from other parts of the country were talking **** about LA in the midst of this disaster. She replied with shock, "they are?!" I said yes, quite a bit.

She replied, "that's strange. Everyone I know loves it here." Me too, kid. Me too.

[Bill Douglas]

We in New Zealand feel absolute sorrow for all affected. It's on the news every evening. I'm not sure what NZ's contribution is but we have firemen fighting fires in the US, Canada and Australia every year.

[astrochex]

Thanks for the update, Denis. Its encouraging to hear about grass roots support for fire victims.

[speeder]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

We in New Zealand feel absolute sorrow for all affected. It's on the news every evening. I'm not sure what NZ's contribution is but we have firemen fighting fires in the US, Canada and Australia every year.

Hey Bill, another heartwarming aspect of tragedies like this is the way that help pours in from absolutely everywhere. Firefighters start rolling early in the fire from other jurisdictions in California and neighboring states. Pilots and planes came from Canada and teams of elite wildfire fighters from Mexico arrived wearing their gear through the airport.

[KFC911]

Yep ... we're all pulling for you guys .... and "get it". The local efforts are not a surprise to me... it happens here too .... and almost everywhere. There are good people on this orb ....

Keep us updated Denis... and thank you!

[Seahawk]

Two posts deleted.

Denis, that was a great post.

Thank you.

Now, the rest, please keep old, tired, animosities out of this thread.

Edit: Last warning to the antagonists. You guys make up your mind how you want this to go.

[speeder]

Tarantino’s movie theater where the films change every two days, (revival house), and are always on 35mm film. An absolute treasure.

[fintstone]

Back to better design of the "system" that that failed/ran out of water. According to a firefighter that was at the Palisades fire 'these homes were not typical. They were very large (15,000 ft mansions) and hydrants were over 1000 ft apart with only a 2.5 inch warf hydrants instead of 4 inches meaning there was not enough flow to extinguish fires. The homes were commercial sized buildings. The firefighters could have saved a lot more if they had been able to put up a water curtain but couldn't because they ran out of water.' If this is the case I think that code should require the appropriately sized hydrants...if for nothing else, the safety of responders. Of course, one would still need sufficient water (more than the tiny reservoirs in the Palisades and the dry Santa Ynez Reservoir could supply this time).