wheel guns

[KFC911]

I almost pee'd my panties over them pink guns

[jyl]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

JYL, aren't you the guy who owns a SIG P210? What the hell are you complaining about? I don't know what size hands you have, but most high-end semi-autos these days are pretty darn ergonomical, IMHO. And if they need tuning, there's no end to the aftermarket grips out there. My full size Springfield 1911 is probably the narrowest handgun I have and is much less bulky than any of my SIG's. Ditto for my Commander. Maybe I'm just easy to please, but I haven't thought of too many things I want that aren't already available in one gun.

No, I don't have a SIG.

A 1911 (0.9" width at slide) is slimmer than a Glock or similar (about 1.2") but still a bulky thing to wear IWB.

Suppose you could get a gun that was only 0.5" wide and weighed only, say, 8 ounces. And held, say, 20 rounds, and the rounds were light and slim, maybe caseless, but would still penetrate body armour and do big damage. And the gun could be rapid-fired with no muzzle lift at all. Wouldn't that be a nice option to have?

I know this all sounds rather Jetsons or Robocop, but it just seems weird that the very best pistol that the 21st century can muster is only a moderate improvement over a 100 (okay, 97) year old design. Jeez, you'd think we'd have handheld disintegrators by now.

[tabs]

Well Mother never accused me of being very bright. She always thought I was the one being pushed down the stairs. She even went to the scholl to complain that her only son was being belittled and harrassed by the brighter students. Little did she realize at the time it was I who was doing the pushing.

Anyway enough of my life story..


U do know that one can find nice Pythons that have a bit of wear for a reasonable cost. With that condition of gun you can shoot it and not be out any money, you do know that don't you. No one says to go buy a NIB gun, yes they have become collectable in that kind of condition. So I would not recommend buying a NIB pistol to go out and shoot..

[tabs]

Yo Charlie ya feel that way about the .25 Acp....

[nostatic]

Even the "worn" Pythons are pretty pricey - most seem to be north of $1K. By contrast the Rugers are less than half that. Plus I'm not sure about getting a Python in CA - I don't think they are on the DOJ list any more, so it might need to be an in-state transfer.

[tabs]

I see em for under 1G...

[charleskieffner]

Originally Posted by tabs

Yo Charlie ya feel that way about the .25 Acp....

i like a .25acp for a "stand-off veapons program" vs. a rock or a stick!


as far as shooting a barrel out???? give me a break here! i doubt there is a SINGLE PERSON ON HERE that shoots 60K (60thousand) rounds a year here. and 60K is an average number shot in a years time amongst the group with robbie leathem on sunday. be it .45/.38 super/9mm/.40.

yep 60k rounds and they are NOT having to rebarrel. sounds like alot but guns are made to last if ya buy quality.

i cant even conceive it, but when thats what you do for a living and thats what it takes to stay on top, thats a hell of a testament for springfield/colt/beretta/glock/hk/smith/ sig,etc etc. quality, that was represented sunday.

yes there is extreme takedown and cleaning on these, but still thats a hell of alot of rounds downrange without failures.

i look at each and every veapon i own as a really really really expensive tool that i cannot afford to break ever. and i dont have the bucks to replace them. therefore each and every time i go shooting, part of the ritual is to come home, grab some cold juans to unwind and start cleaning them down to the firing pin. it verks for me. and its a good way to become "one" mit der veapon. i told my kid if i EVER FIND his veapon dirty..................its his ass!

each and every time we go thru the drill of cleaning them and thats anal down to lubing them with a q-tip and not a speck of dirt anywhere. every long veapon has its own lil comfy/plushy case and all the associated goodies and a cleaning kit for everyjuan for the field. kleenbore makes some real simple kits that have multiple different calibers and are small enough to take anywhere.

same goes for my rws rifle and pistol. i clean the hell out of it and it goes pfffft everytime dead nuts. take care of yer firearms and they will take care of you.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by tabs

Unnnhuh...thats why I picked up a FA Mdl 83 in 22LR and extra cylinder 22 M with 7 1/2 Barrel, Scope in the box for $800.00....

Wow, that is screaming deal on one helluva .22 there, tabs. Nice work.

I've been kind of half-ass looking at their big bore guns in .45 Colt, .454 Casull, and .475 Linebaugh. I don't think you could buy a cylinder for one for only $800.

[tabs]

That FA is a BENCH Pistol it is so heavy...can't hold it steady

[tabs]

If ya keep lookin you start to find stuff relativily cheap....every once in awhile..I just bought a Browning Mdl 12 in 20 GA unfired for $560 delivered.

[jyl]

Originally Posted by charleskieffner

i really think the mfg. on the cutting edge of high techno is HK. as mentioned they designed and perfected caseless ammo mit der G-11, and a boat load of other new fangled techno stuff.

Yes. FN also makes interesting, innovative stuff. The American long gun companies don't seem very innovative at all. Nor have American handgun companies been pushing the envelope in handguns, except arguably for specialized competition guns (SVI STI etc). Disappointing.

[jyl]

Originally Posted by m21sniper

I love gadgetry, what 'cha thinkin' bro?

For battle rifles, I'm not sure what would be cool and functional, because to be honest I'm not sure what the requirements are.

Looking at some of the prototype battle rifles that the US military evaluated, it seems that they aren't trying to break much new ground on the rifle part. The effort seems to be to integrate the rifle into a "weapons system", so that the infantryman can fire multiple types of projectiles (most popular seems to be grenades with and without airburst) with advanced optics (range-finding, night-vision).

Okay, this is all very Starship Troopers cool, but I can't pretend to know if it makes sense for a soldier, and if it does, for what kind of soldier in what kind of situation. I mean, for all I know, what a soldier really wants is some sort of "fire around corners" feature like the German MP44 had in WW2.

For just the rifle part, I agree the HK G11 is super interesting. Not just the caseless ammunition, but also the idea of the first three rounds fired so fast that all bullets leave the barrel before recoil has a chance to throw off the user's aim, then subsequent full auto fire at a much slower rate. Wow! And the space and weight efficiency of the square caseless rounds, double wow.

The various bull-pup designs are also very interesting. You can get the barrel length of a M16 in a package smaller than an M4.

The FN P90 is darned innovative too. Too bad they don't make it in a more practical and less expensive caliber (for civilians).

But it seems that, if the military R&D guys gets their way, the next US battle rifle will be more notable for its internal flame-thrower, grenade launcher, electronic sight, ability to feed targeting data to air support over secure high-speed wireless networks, yadda yadda - than for any feature than we civilians will be able to use.

Think about it - the M16/AR15 may be the last US battle rifle platform that you and I will be able to actually buy.