$15,780 for a dislocated hip ??

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

...

I have a friend who's an obstetrician/surgeon, whatever, his malpractice insurance premiums alone would pay *my salary* !!! I imagine if those could be brought in line, as well as other frivolous premiums for hospitals, we'd be onto something, assuming savings are passed on...
...

that's b/c every parent produces a perfect babay -- anything that goes wrong is therefore the fault of the OB/GYN

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by Noah930

Medicare allows for $134 for the tetanus toxoid medication, itself. It also pays a physician $25 to give the shot. I don't have access to a catalog to see how much a vial of tetanus toxoid goes for, but I'd hazard a guess that it's not more than a few bucks.

Don't forget the needle and the syringe. For flu caccinations they pay less than it costs you to give it, as I recall.

I remember looking at Mom's malpractice premiums once, anesthesiologist. Would be nice annual salary. Keep in mind that in 40 years of practice she was NEVER sued.

[Noah930]

I've seen some of the statements on how much the insurance company reimbursed for the needle and syringe. We're talking pennies. The ink on the bill and check cost more than the amount it spelled out.

[Tobra]

yeah, but you can make it up in volume

if you stay up on your tetanus shots, they are so cheap it is practically free

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Normy

...

In Belgium, where I lived for nearly a year in 1999/2000, if you get sick/hurt, you walk into the hospital. You get treated. Then you walk out. There's no hassle. There's no "well, that's a pre-existing condition." There's no "sorry, you've reached the end of your coverage, so now you can just....die" There is none of that. They treat you, and when you are healthy again, you go home.

We, in the US, spend 16% of our GDP on maintenance. Human maintenance, that is. Belgium has a socialized/private system where the government manages the private companies; they make a small profit, but it is completely controlled. Expensive? NO- the Belgian government spends 12% of GDP on this sort of hassle-free coverage each year.

Hello?

N!

Could it be that illegal alien Mexicans are not streaming over the border in Belgium that require free care to drive prices up? With bleeding heart liberals like you calling for even more open borders and wealth redistriution...it can only get worse. Gee...must be some reason you returned to this backwards country?

[Dueller]

Originally Posted by masraum

someone's gotta pay for all of the illegals that get free care.

You're not the only poster jumping on the illegal alien bandwagon...and admittedly it is a problem...don't mean to single you out. But c'mon...blaming them or lawyers or HMO's or big pharma or welfare mom's is just a part of the overall problem.


As to illegals, they comprise about 12 million people and the most pessimistic numbers say approximately 60% are uninsured compared to 20% of U.S. citizens. That's a little over 7 million people compared to 45-50 million U.S. citizens that are uninsured. Couple the relatively low numbers of illegal aliens with the fact that most are young and healthy, estimates range in the 3-4% range as to the costs they add to U.S. health care costs.

Let's be real here folks..its a problem that deserves a discourse more considered than trying to single out a single political hot button cause.

[Tobra]

Jim, your numbers do not agree with any that I have seen, but your point is well taken.

[Dueller]

Originally Posted by Tobra

Jim, your numbers do not agree with any that I have seen, but your point is well taken.

Thanks for not blasting me on the numbers game...they were off the top of my head from things I've absorbed from a variety of sources. I appreciate you understanding my point. I view your comments here with great respect and have learned much from your perspective on a variety of topics...not just the health care debate

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Could it be that illegal alien Mexicans are not streaming over the border in Belgium that require free care to drive prices up? With bleeding heart liberals like you calling for even more open borders and wealth redistriution...it can only get worse. Gee...must be some reason you returned to this backwards country?

Belgium has illegal immigrants from North and Central Africa...

[Tobra]

Jim, I will not loan you any money, so just knock that reasonable and polite ***** off, it will never work.

[Dueller]

Originally Posted by Tobra

Jim, I will not loan you any money, so just knock that reasonable and polite ***** off, it will never work.

Actually not asking to borrow any money, but I do have a bunion that's....oh well, never mind. And I could have ended my ploy with "....just not the health care debate."

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by svandamme

Belgium has illegal immigrants from North and Central Africa...

I would bet that there are not over 10M of them as there are in the US.

[mossguy]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I would bet that there are not over 10M of them as there are in the US.

Probably not, but is the legal/illegal ratio similar to the U.S.?

Best,
Tom

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I would bet that there are not over 10M of them as there are in the US.

There's only 10.8 M legal residents, 10M would stand out a bit.

But some of the rough ballpark figures for Belgium, claim that about 30% of that 10.8 million would be immigrants, legal and illegal.

It's kinda hard to have figures on just the illegals, since they are, illegal, and as such don't typically go around announcing their presence.

But sure, i'll admit... that 30% also includes Dutch immigrats, French, and all sorts of folks that moved here to work for the EU gubmint , lobby groups and thinktanks and what not.

Do keep in mind, that Belgium is about the size of Maryland, or about 330 times smaller then the US of A.

[DanielDudley]

If you were on a job site, I would relocate your finger for nothing. If we were in the wilderness, I would certainly TRY to relocate your shoulder, and probably succeed.

15 large ones is a lot for a hip, but I'm not sure I would start yankin on it at the ski slope.

My personal feeling is that there is a serious attempt on the part of hospitals and insurance companies to make basic care costs so rediculously high that you will be forced to buy insurance. And IMO, a correctly run government program could be cheaper and as good. Looking at the privatization of military services for instance does not imply to me that the private sector is a model of efficiency.

In fact, most everything today seems to be about somebody getting more wealthy than somebody else, regardless of the cost to others or society at large. SO yeah, it's going to be 16 grand, and it's going to bite.

OTOH, do you really want me to handcuff you to a tree and tie you to my truck hitch ? Maybe we could google it up first. Hopefully you will go to a little therapy, and it will never happen again.

[RWebb]

how many illegal immigrants would it take to pull his femur back into his hip socket?

seems like that might be the economical way to go

[Wrecked944]

Hey Todd, I am still getting no joy from your email address. I also tried a PM but I have been away so long that I couldn't figure out how to make it work. So I am posting here and hopefully the trolls will leave me alone. Anyway, here is a link to my health insurance company...

"http://www.fchp.org"

My plan is as follows:

Cost: $164/month or $1986 per year
Pre-existing conditions? NO, nada, never - not even my Congestive Heart Failure
Full Coverage Day One: YES!
Co-Pay: $60 for a cardiologist visit
Cancellation? No, never, not for any reason ever. I will never lose my coverage. Period.
Telephone Customer Service? OUTSTANDING
Quality of medical care? OUTSTANDING++

Honestly, any American who pays much more than $2000 per year for top shelf medical care is a chump who deserves to be taken advantage of. And I like you too much to let you be a chump. If Fallon doesn't work for you then I am sure we can find a similar deal where you live. I know because I had no trouble finding a wide range of excellent and affordable private health plans to choose from. I went with Fallon only because of the cardiac clinic. So it is simply impossible that we both live in the same country and yet I pay a fraction of what you pay. Especially since I am sicker now than you will probably ever be in your whole life! Pick up the damned phone and switch companies! It is ludicrous that my heart should cost so much less than your hip! YOU ARE BEING ROBBED!

[Nathans_Dad]

What is being missed here is that what the hospital bills the insurance and what the insurance pays are two completely different numbers.

If the hospital were to bill what it actually costs them to do a certain procedure, then the insurer would only pay 20% of that cost and the hospital would promptly go bankrupt.

So, before you ask a doctor or hospital to charge what it really costs, you should first ask the insurers (who of course take their cue from Medicare which is run by the US GOVT) to pay a bill in full. If both sides agreed to do those things, then the bill would make more sense.

Of course, that would require the US government to pull their head out of their ass.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Dueller

You're not the only poster jumping on the illegal alien bandwagon...and admittedly it is a problem...don't mean to single you out. But c'mon...blaming them or lawyers or HMO's or big pharma or welfare mom's is just a part of the overall problem.


As to illegals, they comprise about 12 million people and the most pessimistic numbers say approximately 60% are uninsured compared to 20% of U.S. citizens. That's a little over 7 million people compared to 45-50 million U.S. citizens that are uninsured. Couple the relatively low numbers of illegal aliens with the fact that most are young and healthy, estimates range in the 3-4% range as to the costs they add to U.S. health care costs.

Let's be real here folks..its a problem that deserves a discourse more considered than trying to single out a single political hot button cause.

Good post. You are exactly right. Calling each other names isn't going to lead to a solution.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I would bet that there are not over 10M of them as there are in the US.

There are so many that some European countries are putting restrictions on immigrant's access to public health care. The north africans are moving in and not assimilating, just forming their own enclaves, keeping to themselves, and using the public services. It's becoming a big problem.