I wouldn't stress over it. The Chinese and Russians got an F-117 downed over Serbia back in the mid 90s.

..

seals and seal delivery are apples/oranges. i think. the delivery has become a separate very demanding skill.
someone told me the army was driving the choppers. no?

I had the opportunity to speak with several C-130 pilots that are part of a wing dedicated to SOF-only ops. I suspect that they would have similar groups for helicopters, these guys aren't doing run of the mill stuff. The C-130 guys spent the bulk of their time flying at night. :)

as i understand it entry into the VFW requires DD-214 verification of duty, boots on the ground, war zone, foreign soil.

The SEALs would acknowledge it if some mistakes were made. They can handle the truth, and they don't need patronizing, PC suck-up pussies like you defending them.

That also includes cooks, mechanics, etc. My only point is that the folks telling war stories typically aren't those that have lived it. My father was a forward air controller in Vietnam, he will still barely speak of what he saw. I don't believe a lifetime is long enough to forget the horror of war.

From here... http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-politics-religion/606459-osma-taken-alive.html#post6000694

PC suck-up pussie? HAHAHA! I was 'agreeing' with you! 'Agreeing' with every one of your scumbag criticisms of something you obviously know precious little about. What are you, a moron who doesn't even recognize what he just posted? Too funny! :D

So, what branch of the military did you serve in?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-politics-religion/606523-term-moron-overused.html

I just got a nasty PM using "moron" from the antiyank.....

Since you ask, not in your case.

Do simple, direct questions confuse you?

You speak with such confidence and apparent knowledge about inept chopper pilots and fk'd up military missions, I can't help but wonder what branch you served in.

If your myopia kept you out, it's ok to admit it. Or if you just didn't wanna go, that's ok too. You don't have to serve in the military to be a good American.

Who's the antiyank? :). Was it entertainingly nasty? Share it if it was. Actually, share your reply; I'll bet that's amusing. :D

google Night Stalkers

Might have been 160th SOAR. Those guys are Delta's chauffeurs.

+1. Had a relative who served on a PT boat in 'nam...never talked about it. He was generally a fun-loving extroverted type (looked liked a hippie most of his life - undercover, ran for sheriff later). One time we were boating, and ventured up a small channel on a local lake...the further we went, the "darker his expression became" as I could tell he was "going back" to a place he had really never left...he was someone "I didn't know" the rest of the afternoon, very withdrawn. Thank you to all who have served or seen combat....the rest of us will NEVER, EVER know the horrors...

My best bud through childhood, high school and college just retired from the Special Forces (bird colonel).

He spent four years in Afghanistan negotiating with warlords. He then spent two years in Pakistan negotiating with their bad guys and the government.

During Ranger training he opted the M60 as his weapon, more points. He had hundreds of jumps and was HALO qualified.

Not a badass. A very non-assuming type, and a Jew, but told everyone he was Italian because his last name ended with an O.

He is also the smartest person I have ever met. He is fluent in multiple Southeast Asian languages.

Before 911 he was the US Army liaison officer to Thailand. Years ago he was captured by remnants of the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia and got released by them by using his brain.

Most of the Ops were covert targeting missions. He was one of he first in Afghanistan before we went in officially. He's been pinned by GW Bush for service and valor.

After he retired he was working for a "private security consulting firm" in Pakistan.

The point is, what really makes these men special is their intelligence. Their brain is their best weapon.

I'll see him in July and hopefully get some insight as to what went down, but probably not.

He is my personal hero and a true hero to the nation. If you met him you would think he was a school teacher or a counselor.

I am very proud to say that he is my friend. I love him dearly.

Thanks.... "Murph" for your service and sacrifice.

Thank him for his service from the rest of us.

When we lived at Hickam AFB I made a lot of cash mowing yards as a kid. One yard I used to mow was a General's house. He would let me come in to the lanai where he always wrote me a check instead of cash. He started in the Army Air Corps as a pilot but he was not an officer. He kept getting arrested at different bases for wearing wings and stripes. They eventually sent him to officers school to make him an officer so he could keep flying.

My dad knew him and they had a few drinks at the O-club. The General had a lot of funny and amazing stories. He had a chest full of medals the only time I ever saw him in uniform. I was just a dumb kid and had no idea what a hero he was. I wish I remembered more about him. He is one of the few that went from Private to General.

Whipped,
Was the old man a ground or air FAC

I think you are quite correct - I lost my father recently - a veteran of Korea and Vietnam - we knew nothing about what he did during the wars - until he died. He would never, ever talk of it, even when asked directly. When we were getting ready to inter him in the local military cemetery - the military wanted to know if we wanted full honors, because my Dad had received the Air Force Cross. We kids didn't even know...

Your father no doubt is a special man, as are all the men who serve their country. We need to keep a special place for them in our prayers.