Please explain to me "My first gun."

[Chocaholic]

Quote de foxpaws

Face it, you'll never make a logical case for infringing on law abiding citizens to attempt to prevent tragedy.

Wanna bet? Were you vacationing on the moon last November?

[ZOA NOM]

Originally Posted by Chocaholic

Wanna bet? Were you vacationing on the moon last November?

I said "logical".

[john70t]

Originally Posted by polo classic

A bit weird if you ask me

Kinder Surprise - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"At least six children worldwide have died from choking on the toys"

[kneejerkcomment]
So Mattel is six times more likely to support terrorism than Crockpot?
[/kneejerkcomment]

Statistics still show the hospital or national road system is the most danerous place for children to go. The American public is still being trained to fear and acccept, using media sensationalism.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by Moses

Relax...

About 10 kids a year are killed by lightning strikes every year. More than 100 are killed by parents backing up their cars in driveways.

Accidents happen. It's the price of freedom.

I got my first shotgun at 5. Started hunting alone by age 12. Guns are a part of American culture that you don't understand. Designing firearms for kids? Probably safer than the adult sized .410 I was lugging around at 5.

I agree.

20 children a year are killed by this aggressively marketed tool, found in almost EVERY house:



No more or less tragic, no more or less negligent than the parents that failed to protect their kids from guns.

You guys want to arrest and prosecute the parents of the 20 kids that die every year in plastic pails? If not, why not...they are just as negligent. The kids are all just as dead, victims of stupid parents and inanimate objects.

If you guys want to ban guns, all guns, just say it and act on it. Free yourself. Other than that, stop using children as props and focus on the slaughter that goes on everyday in this country, get to the root cause and act on it: Insist we enforce the laws currently in place.

[KFC911]

I had to come back to this thread one more time after a visit to Walmart yesterday to pick up some fishing stuff. I don't think I've ever even glanced in their long gun display before as I own plenty and don't even window shop there. Approaching the display, what is front-and-center but one of the toy like pink, ultra small rifle (there was also a black one behind it). I just don't see ANY reason at all for such tiny little POS toys to be marketed to the masses. Something that hasn't been mentioned in this thread...my LEO tennant tells me the gang-bangers are already painting the tips their real guns orange to give them an edge. Don't sell/buy real guns that look like toys....it's just a REALLY bad idea for many reasons.
Sorry about doing it again Redbeard!

..."disconnected"...but shooting .22 since I was 6-7

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by KC911

Sorry about doing it again Redbeard!

No you're not

[EarlyPorsche]

Interesting arguments for sure.

I guess one thing ill add is that there would be one more 2 year old alive today if that gun was either locked up or not in that home to begin with. That covers both sides.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

20 children a year are killed by this aggressively marketed tool, found in almost EVERY house:



No more or less tragic, no more or less negligent than the parents that failed to protect their kids from guns.

You guys want to arrest and prosecute the parents of the 20 kids that die every year in plastic pails? If not, why not...they are just as negligent. The kids are all just as dead, victims of stupid parents and inanimate objects.

If you guys want to ban guns, all guns, just say it and act on it. Free yourself. Other than that, stop using children as props and focus on the slaughter that goes on everyday in this country, get to the root cause and act on it: Insist we enforce the laws currently in place.

This will make your argument better - It is even more aggressively marketed to kids than the strawman "pink" rifle

[red-beard]

Drowning is the second leading cause of accidental death in children ages one to 15 years in the U.S., and the highest risk group is boys under age five. Over half of these fatalities occur in home pools.

When we think of pool risks, we think of the big pools, complete with deep-ends, diving boards, and swim parties. But did you know that over 10% of pool-related deaths in young children occur in what are best known as ‘kiddie pools’?

Why Kids Drown in Kiddie Pools

[yazhound]

Originally Posted by djmcmath

Wow. That's actually surprisingly informative. And without going to any real effort, it's obvious that there's a correlation (though not necessarily a causation) between the big liberal places and gun deaths. DC, Baltimore, Philly, Detroit, Chicago ... I'm sure that's not what they were trying to illustrate, but that's a pretty clear takeaway.

Or really, instead, a correlation between large poor populace and underemployed, undereducated teenage males.... big cities, big lower socioeconomic populace higher crime rates. More likely the correlation you are looking for... not strict gun policies. I am making a wild presumption here, that if you lived in any of these cities, you would not place yourself voluntarily in any of the high crime areas, and thus, not really likely to become one of the statistics...? Whether you were packing or not....

[ZOA NOM]

That's the beauty of marketing... if the pink guns don't sell, they come off the shelves. If they do sell, then what's all the fuss? Why shouldn't people be free to buy pink guns for their kids? Too many people leap immediately to some emotional negative reaction to guns, especially with regard to kids. Stop trying to legislate every f*cking thing free people do!

[techweenie]

Originally Posted by ZOA NOM

That's the beauty of marketing... if the pink guns don't sell, they come off the shelves. If they do sell, then what's all the fuss? Why shouldn't people be free to buy pink guns for their kids? Too many people leap immediately to some emotional negative reaction to guns, especially with regard to kids. Stop trying to legislate every f*cking thing free people do!

Who said anything about legislation? Oh, that's right. You did.

Marketing guns to kids 4-10 is just plain stupid and the manufacturer is apparently reaping the consequences in social media.

Naturally, a side effect of this will be a run on Crickett guns, because some people are terrified they'll have their freedoms impinged. The gun manufacturers laugh all the way to the bank.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by ZOA NOM

That's the beauty of marketing... if the pink guns don't sell, they come off the shelves. If they do sell, then what's all the fuss? Why shouldn't people be free to buy pink guns for their kids? Too many people leap immediately to some emotional negative reaction to guns, especially with regard to kids. Stop trying to legislate every f*cking thing free people do!

Yep..

I just don't see ANY reason at all for such tiny little POS toys to be marketed to the masses.

Really, I would bet that rap music has had more of an impact of killing people than pink guns, not only is it marketed to those who are more likely yo break the law, but it actually promotes rape & murder.

Colorado Police Link Rise in Violence to Music


By DAN FROSCH
Published: September 3, 2007
COLORADO SPRINGS, Aug. 30 — The D.J. puts on the popular song “No Problem” by Lil Scrappy, and a sea of young men and women rush the dance floor.

Enlarge This Image

Kevin Moloney for The New York Times
Patrons at a club’s rap music night in Colorado Springs. Local police say recent shootings are tied to clubs that play gangsta rap.
Enlarge This Image

Kevin Moloney for The New York Times
Clubgoers are patted down before entering. The police have told owners of hip-hop venues that their clubs may not be safe.
As the party anthem bursts through the speakers and Lil Scrappy drawls, “But you don’t want no problem, problem,” the crowd swerves in a sweaty, liquor-soaked rhythm. The scene, heavy with the sweet smoke of cigarillos and exploding with hip-hop’s unmistakable pounding bass, could be almost anywhere: New York, Chicago, Memphis, Oakland, Calif.

The only sign that this is Colorado Springs is that two churches sit adjacent to the club, La Zona Roja, in an empty strip mall.

The club is part of a thriving hip-hop community that has grown as Colorado Springs, known for its military installations and evangelical groups, has grown. But not everyone is happy that hip-hop has taken root here.

After a spate of shootings, and with a rising murder rate, the police here are saying gangsta rap is contributing to the violence, luring gang members and criminal activity to nightclubs. The police publicly condemned the music in a news release after a killing in July and are warning nightclub owners that their places might not be safe if they play gangsta rap.

“We don’t want to broad-brush hip-hop music altogether,” said Lt. Skip Arms, a police spokesman, “but we’re looking at a subcomponent that typically glorifies, promotes criminal behavior and demeans women.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/03/us/03hiphop.html?_r=0

Study: Rap Music Linked to Alcohol, Violence
May 08, 2006 9:00 AM


Read a Summary of the Study "Rap Listeners Prone to Alcohol, Drugs, Violence
A recent study by the Prevention Research Center of the Pacific Institute for Research and Evaluation in Berkeley, Calif., suggests young people who listen to rap and hip-hop are more likely to abuse alcohol and commit violent acts. Ed Gordon discusses the issue with Denise Herd, an associate professor at the University of California Berkeley School of Public Health, and David Jernigan, executive director of the Center on Alcohol Marketing and Youth at

Study: Rap Music Linked to Alcohol, Violence : NPR

[Joe Bob]

The Police and other "safety" agencies should STFU on social issues and voting endorsements. They tend to mirror Boss Hogg politics......just sayin'...........

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by techweenie

In case anyone is interested, Slate has been keeping a tally since Sandy Hook...

Gun-death tally: Every American gun death since Newtown Sandy Hook shooting (INTERACTIVE). - Slate Magazine

When you click on the little person symbol, it provides a bubble of information; date, name, age of victim and so forth,

Matched Deaths: 3,835 or more since Newtown..........

Scary in it's own way.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by KC911

Something that hasn't been mentioned in this thread...my LEO tennant tells me the gang-bangers are already painting the tips their real guns orange to give them an edge.

They have actually been gluing the little orange plastic stoppers out of some sort of bottles onto the muzzles of their guns pretty much ever since the legislation to require orange muzzles on toy guns was passed. Who couldn't see that coming? I guess all we really need now is a law preventing them from disguising their real guns as toy guns, so they stop doing that.

Originally Posted by techweenie

Marketing guns to kids 4-10 is just plain stupid and the manufacturer is apparently reaping the consequences in social media.

I'm afraid I disagree. I believe those years are the very best in which to introduce kids to firearms. I base my opinion on first hand experience, and a multi-generational Higgins family tradition of teaching our children to shoot. There has never been a gun accident in our family, for as far back as our family history goes. Yet, for generation after generation, we have all been exposed to, living with, and shooting firearms since very young ages. We have a pretty solid accident free history, and a valuable tradition. I'm sure many American families can say the same thing. that's what we have - what do you have? It appears you have no more than emotions based upon a single incident, with no personal experience whatsoever.

I mentioned earlier that both of my boys received Chipmunk rifles on their sixth Christmasses. What a godsend - we never had "kid size" rifles when I was that age. We had to struggle to make do with adult rifles. Something that fit us better, allowing us to learn proper form earlier on, would have been very welcome indeed. It sure was when it came time to teach my two boys.

Oh, and their little rifles? They have been making the rounds at work for the last 12-15 years, as other guys are having kids reach that age. Those rifles are now with their third family since I passed them on. I'll eventually get them back and save them for my grand kids.

Oh, and about that "social media" - I know for a lot of people, social media is a very, very big deal. Social media = real life. Folks that fit that description would be shocked to learn that there are still an awful lot of people to whom none of it really matters - folks who live real life outside of the cyber electronic world. You know, those hopeless people who live in flyover country, clinging to their God and guns. I would suspect a lot of their customers fall into that catagory. As the witless hand-wringing ninnies that seem to dominate cyberspace blather on and on via their various little media devices about something they know nothing about, these customers will quietly carry on as if none of it matters. Because it doesn't.

[red-beard]

Well said Jeff. And I think it is just about time to squish this topic down the drain.

[techweenie]

Since the initial incident, two other young brothers have shot their sisters. One sister survived.

The notion that kids *should* have guns is ludicrous. To call a 'child-sized' rifle a "godsend" is truly bizarre. And to use social media to discount social media... well there are some irony-deficient folks out there.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by techweenie

Since the initial incident, two other young brothers have shot their sisters. One sister survived.

The notion that kids *should* have guns is ludicrous. To call a 'child-sized' rifle a "godsend" is truly bizarre. And to use social media to discount social media... well there are some irony-deficient folks out there.

THIS is Social Media? Wayne should charge more...

You have put up another straw man argument. No one has EVER suggested arming kids. Have you stopped beating your wife?

[Seahawk]

Since the report a hundred teenagers have died while driving and texting on their iPhones..

The notion that teenage drivers should have an iPhone capable of texting while driving, without a warning screen or pop-up by the way, is ludicrous.

Apple can fix this, disable texting while driving, a simple matter of tying in GPS speed and text messaging ability.

Why don't they do it? It is an epidemic and Apple sits idly by, as do you.

A car, a teenager and an iPhone makes marketing to [I]infants[I] sensible.

Originally Posted by techweenie

Since the initial incident, two other young brothers have shot their sisters. One sister survived.

The notion that kids *should* have guns is ludicrous. To call a 'child-sized' rifle a "godsend" is truly bizarre. And to use social media to discount social media... well there are some irony-deficient folks out there.