If the older gentleman shot him for throwing popcorn, he should be convicted and sent to prison. If the younger man physically hit him or grabbed him, its a bit murkier.

Agreed - but still a long way off from drawing and shooting. Unless something dramatic is reveled in the details the shooter belongs behind bars.

That's a pretty ignorant comment. I'm about as pro-gun ownership as they come, but based on the facts posted here I would not support his actions. Being an a-hole is not justification for murder.

This thread reminds me of the TM/GZ threads from a while back :(. I have a REALLY hard time believing that the older man was ever fearful for his life. Sounds like 2nd degree to me, but a jury will decide. Simply tragic to all parties involved at this point...

Unless the old man was as bloodied up as GZ was, he's not going to be able to use a SYG affirmative defense. Seems to me the texter died of testosterone poisoning, but it will be a stretch to claim the shooter had good cause.

Maybe the old guy was just tired of being crapped on.

What about the decease's wife?

Unless she was attacking the shooter, surely there can be no self defense claim on her injuries!

A terrible situation, only thing worse could have been if more people had been injured or killed by discharging in a close environment.

Help with what?

I agree with HardDrive. However, how did it ever get that far? People need to stop letting others push their buttons!

I read there was only one shot fired and it went through her hand as she was trying shield her husband. Not sure how that will play out legally. It'd be interesting if the same bullet were found to be justified in hitting one person, but negligent in passing through the first person it hit.

Admittedly this was many years ago but for several years back in the day I played slow-pitch softball in the San Antonio City Leagues with a team that at any given time had 5 or 6 SA cops. After the games we usually ended up at local bars for a few cold ones. To a man, every cop that i met while playing on that team had a real "dont even think about f$^&ing with me" attitude and I left one more than one occasion when things were getting a bit out of hand.

Lesson: don't even think about screwing around with cops and it appears even more so in todays world where the norm all to often seems to be shoot first and ask questions later.

I'm sure the guy who got killed had no idea the old man was an ex-cop and armed... until it was to late...

Witnesses told police they saw no punches being thrown during the incident, according to the report.

Your view would not represent the "majority", in most of these threads.

Somebody call the Whambulance!

One was complaining for the other to stop texting. The other was too childish to oblige and let it go.

I'm going to refrain from commenting on the gun issue...

I will comment on the movie issue...

We went to the movies last Sunday, some rude dork behind us had his phone go off, he answers... my wife looks over her sholder and gives him a dirty look (twice), he hung up.

At the beginning of every move I have attend for the last several years there is always an on screen request/warning to turn off your cell phone.

Our incident happened at a nicer theater (Regal), several time during the movie an usher wandered through with a flashlight no doubt looking for texters/phone callers/pirates, kids doing naughty things, etc.

I can't imagine complaining to management and not having them act immediately.

I understand having an important call, I can't understand not getting up an leaving the theater to take that call (or text). I feel this is just another case of our society becoming inconsiderate self important A-holes... I am not saying this poor guy deserved to be shot... however if he had exercised a little common sense.. and common courtesy... he would still be alive today.

I can't understand having an important call at the movies because my phone would be off. Ditto for texts. If you can't live for two hours without being on your phone, you should wait for the dvd to come out. To throw your food at an elderly man for making a very legitimate complaint is asking for trouble. Not that he deserved to die for it, but it was easily avoidable.

The old man was 100% in the wrong, unless he was in fear of imminent death or the death of someone else (defense of 3rd party). And the murder 2 charge demonstrates this.

Carrying brings a terrible responsibility. You have a DUTY to de-escalate if at all possible.

With the information that is coming out now, that no punches were thrown, I believe that the retired police officer over reacted and will most likely be convicted of some sort of manslaughter charge.

But, the man who was shot WAS being a jerk. I can understand his needing to use his phone, but he should have apologized when confronted over breaking the rules. He could have left the theatre for a moment to have completed his call/text. It would have ended. Instead he started a confrontation with an older man.

Now, under the circumstance, the older man should have tried to de-escalate the situation. He was armed. He was a trained police officer. He probably also knew and understood the law.

This was certainly an avoidable situation.

+1

was either one an engineer?

I don't think you could hurt a newborn baby by throwing popcorn at it. Not like a 5 lb. burrito or something.

Thank goodness they were all white!

qft

We make bombs, remember? Engineer = terrorist.

Well he was booked for murder. Wonder if they will decline to prosecute or indict?

The older man claims he was stuck by the younger man with an unknown object. Sounds like another test of Florida's "stand your ground" law.

Totally agree...

A few years back I vacationed in Kauai for a week... for the first four days I had my cell phone off... my friends thought I had fallen off the face of the planet.

Sunday I was at church (with phone off), wife left early and I stayed to chat with some people after the service. I get in the car and turn on the phone and get hit with "WHERE ARE YOU?!?"

I'm only saying the shooting happened in part....because of something the other guy did....why else would he have been so pissed off enough to shoot the dude?

Thus.....there is responsibility on both sides for what happened.

I'm not saying - nor have I ever said - the shooting was justified.

I don't know how anyone can misinterpret my posts. I go out of my way to carefully structure my thoughts and to spread out my comments into separate paragraphs.

So it can be read and understood...by (almost) everyone. ;)

Gotta say... The older dude looks anything but frail. He could pass for 60 or less.

Now there is some helpful insight.

We all know the type A personality.

Perhaps both of these men were of the same personality?

Quote from Rusty's link:

I stand up for myself but I would never throw an object at someone - because I don't know how they would retaliate....for one.

Not justifying the shooting.....just explaining that both parties screwed up...basically.

You appeared to say that it was justified in one of your previous posts - that by annoying someone, the young father who was texting before the movie ever started, should be expected to reap the 'consequences' of his action - i.e. texting in a theater even before the feature film has started, is reason enough to expect to die.
I apologize if I misunderstood this post - but to me it certainly reads as though you think that annoying texting before a movie starts is a reason for justifiable homicide.

this>
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1389734296.jpg

If you really mean it, you need help. If not, might suggest to restrain yourself as everything today could come back on you in an unexpected way. Suppose in the future you are in a similar tragic or shocking situation. Whether you meant it or not, prosecutors dig this stuff up.

Besides, there are fellow pelicans here who are law enforcement and your comment just comes off shoddy. Like many others, perhaps we have a friend or family member as a police officer and or worse might have lost a close one from a deranged individual. Of course we all have different personalities and opinions, but feeling good about shooting anyone, let alone a police officer comes off really bad.

+ a million... Squared.

Wow is all I can say after reading this thread.

My thoughts go out to the deceased and his family.

Thanks for your follow up and no worries FP.....I was just offering social commentary and analysis on the situation.

I can't imagine anyone saying the guy was justified to shoot the rude texter.

In just about every situation you can usually break it down and analyze why things happened the way they did.

Doesn't justify anything....just explains why it happened the way it did.

Yeah I suppose it does come off pretty bad. I was at the movies a while back and had my phone shut off in my pocket. it somehow turned itself back on and it rang in the theater. it rang twice before I could get to it and some old dude gave me a really hard time about it. it was an accident and I just ignored him but people lately seem to be pretty low on patience.

I do not want to shoot him dead but I do hope he gets convicted of murder and attempted murder and spends a year or two locked in a cell with Bubba and then goes to the chair and cooks. That would be the happiest ending of this thing I can think of.

Is that any better than wanting to do it myself? I dunno.

I think many of you will be surprised when the facts come out. I will not share details, but there is more to the story.

Thanks Fox and others with a more restrained and rational response.

Been a tough week. Had a suicide today and three others had parents die suddenly. WTF?

Just reported it was the child's baby sitter he was texting with......not the child. That makes more sense.....

I am at my winter home about 15 mi from the theatre. The shooter could have changed seats since there were only about 25 people in the place. if someone,s phone bothered me that much that's what I would do. Kids text all the time and I have learned to ignore it.
The guy was reported to be texting his daughter but it makes more sense that it was her baby sitter. It,s reported here the wife was reaching out to shield her husband but it also makes more sense she was trying to pull him back.
What I find suspicious is the shooter retired from the Tampa police at 51. I wonder if he had issues ,like anger management, alcohol etc.
I think this is already playing out as a TM/GZ like case BUT in this case both parties are white,adults and there are 25 witnesses.

Its amazing how fast this forum will condemn someone with out any real facts. It will be fun too see what happens if the facts ever come out. Either way its sad and really should never have happened.

"If the facts ever come out"?

I'd say that several pertinent facts are out already and the rest are coming shortly. This is not a "who dunnit" or a "WTF happened"... it's a shooting in front of many eye witnesses.