Was robbed yesterday. Time for protection.

[berettafan]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

That's a risky assumption. Maybe it's valid if done in broad daylight when the perp thinks you're at work. But in most states, a night time home invasion is like playing Russian Roulette for the perp. They have to assume they're gambling with their life and are likely to get shot. Being the homeowner, I'd assume anyone breaking into my house at night is prepared for a fight, plans on doing bad things to me or Mrs. Lee or thinks nothing of killing me to steal my valuables. Any one of those is grounds for using deadly force.

abso-friggin-lutely.

[matt f]

Originally Posted by berettafan

matt that card is likely the best thing an attorney for the deceased's family could wish for when it comes to the civil suit.

'Members of-ah the ah-joooorey mmmmm......This citizen..mmmmm....has-ah duhreamed of murdering-ah a black man so intensively (sic) that he puhlannned-ah his...mmmm......ex-a-cuse-a prior to the deed!'

Beretta, you raise a valid point.
The card is used only if I'm ferklempt!

[intakexhaust]

^Z-man
I respect your post and logic, but I still throw it out the window. Say 'boo' and it might be lights out forever. If I survive, I'll worry about formalities, logistics, anti-gun jurisdictions, and the courts later. The main thing is staying alive. That's how I roll.

I can't read minds or know what an armed intruder will do during a robbery. No way am I going to assume they will just steal and peacefully leave. Often, its merciless killing for just the most minor items of theft. If by luck (and you'll need it) have access to and can fire off before they can, by all means do it. Its absolutely naïve to waste a moment when any armed perp is in you or your family territory. You have to protect and be on the offense. Even if you had dialed911, no LEO is going to play superhero and in a split second able to be at the scene. Its not reality.

BTW: I had been in a situation in my home (long ago old residence), right after returning from a relaxed ski vacation, calm Sunday night. Not up for discussing here.

[Z-man]

intakexhaust: in my old home, my master bedroom was in the far corner of the house. If a home invasion would occur, I would grab my gun (in a gun holder beside my bed - decocked, loaded and with one in the chamber), and move to my bathroom which has a clear sight to the bedroom door, with a dresser alongside the wall, with the door hinge on that wall (door opens towards the wall). If I was able to grab my phone on my way to my position, great. IF not, no phone call. From that defensive position, I would tell the perp "Who are you? Get out. Police are coming. I have a gun." He will hear my voice coming from my bedroom, since the bathroom is only accessible through the master bedroom. If the door opens, the perp will not have a clear shot at me, but I will have a clear shot at him.

Originally Posted by matt f

If you must shoot, shoot center mass.
Shoot until empty, reload. Keep your eyes on the intruder, even if he appears to not be moving.
Approach defensively to remove his weapon from reach.
Not a smart idea to shoot to wound like the reporters always think anyone should do.

Not sure I would empty my magazine into the perp. And I would not keep my eyes only on the intruder. I have to assume there are others in the house, and if I am completely focused on him, and my magazine is empty, I'm a sitting duck. Hopefully I am in a position where multiple perps would have to go through a bottleneck to get to me, and I would be able to continue to defend myself. I have to be concerned though, of others now knowing where I am, and attempting to take me down by shooting through the wall, through a window, or from another vantage point.

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

That's a risky assumption. Maybe it's valid if done in broad daylight when the perp thinks you're at work. But in most states, a night time home invasion is like playing Russian Roulette for the perp. They have to assume they're gambling with their life and are likely to get shot. Being the homeowner, I'd assume anyone breaking into my house at night is prepared for a fight, plans on doing bad things to me or Mrs. Lee or thinks nothing of killing me to steal my valuables. Any one of those is grounds for using deadly force.

According to that statistic, Property crimes (28,800) + Burglaries (8640) + Robberies (1440) = 38,8800, while Violent crimes (4320) + Grave Assaults (2468) + Forcible rapes (720) = 7508. So violent crimes, grave assaults and forcible rapes constitute only 16% of the total crimes associated with home invasions.

Source:Home Invasion Statistics (INFOGRAPHIC) |

Originally Posted by BlueSkyJaunte

You need to stop reading articles and get some training.

I have gotten training, and continue to sign up for training. I DON'T read articles in Guns & Ammo and make my own assumptions...


-Z-man.

[intakexhaust]

Z-man
In your single scenario......... master b.rm, the strategically placed weapon, etc. you have a plan. That's excellent but god forbid you never have to use it.

But that's only one single scenario. You don't know of the million other situations in a different area that could play out. Its human nature and most do try to plan for whatever, but when its not in the least expected or situation, the outcome is a 'crap shoot'. My story wouldn't even have a chance at phoning. The element of surprise at a front door, luggage, skis, maneuvering keys in door.... meaning my hands are full.


----------charts don't mean beans when you become one of the statistics.

[matt f]

Z,

I appreciate your thoughts.
Taught by every instructor I have had, empty, reload.
All shooting on the farm or at the range is practiced that way.
My father was a 2x All Army .45 champion, as well as 2x wrestling champion.
NCAA wrestling champion for Penn State prior to enlisting.
Last Penn State athlete to letter in 2 sports during the same season(wrestling/boxing.)
He was well versed in both target and defensive shooting and tactics, as well as self defense.
Empty, reload, always.
Ability to re-load while still visualizing target imperative.

I'm keeping an open mind to some advice/experiences posted.
Matt






Multiple intruders are handled after the first one

[Z-man]

Originally Posted by intakexhaust

Z-man
In your single scenario......... master b.rm, the strategically placed weapon, etc. you have a plan. That's excellent but god forbid you never have to use it.

But that's only one single scenario. You don't know of the million other situations in a different area that could play out. Its human nature and most do try to plan for whatever, but when its not in the least expected or situation, the outcome is a 'crap shoot'. My story wouldn't even have a chance at phoning. The element of surprise at a front door, luggage, skis, maneuvering keys in door.... meaning my hands are full.


----------charts don't mean beans when you become one of the statistics.

Well, in other situations, I would just tell the perp to wait until I get into the bedroom, get my firearm, get to the master bath, and then he can proceed!

Of course I know the one single scenario I've described is ideal and optimal for me. Most likely, that won't be the case in an invasion. I will likely be surprised, and need to react quickly. I may not be able to retrieve my weapon. A lot of factors that can end up very badly for me. So I continue to train, get lessons, and improve my situational awareness. Can't carry in NJ outside of my home- so I have to look into other options as well...

I am sad to hear you have first-hand experience in all this, and I am grateful you survived the ordeal. Like you say, all this planning quickly goes out the window when the poo hits the fan...

-Z

[onewhippedpuppy]

Z, in KS an intruder poses a threat by default if he is in your home. There is no need to further justify defending yourself. That is how castle doctrine works in flyover country.

[aigel]

Good lord. I'd consider moving from Memphis to start with. That's just a rough place overall.

I've never considered a home invasion a likely scenario. I live in excellent neighborhoods and usually am the poorest looking guy on the block. Two large dogs. I am very happy that I don't go to bed at night wondering how its going to go down when they finally come for me!

G

[HHI944]

I'm reminded of James Yaeger. Heavily trained, highly skilled.....and yet there's still a video of him running like a little girl when SHTF in Iraq. He's also a huge fan of everything being simple now.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Good lord. I'd consider moving from Memphis to start with. That's just a rough place overall.



I've never considered a home invasion a likely scenario. I live in excellent neighborhoods and usually am the poorest looking guy on the block. Two large dogs. I am very happy that I don't go to bed at night wondering how its going to go down when they finally come for me!



G

Same here, but just remember that the criminals don't go looking for good stuff to steal in poor neighborhoods.

[aigel]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Same here, but just remember that the criminals don't go looking for good stuff to steal in poor neighborhoods.

Statistically there are bigger things to worry about in my area.

Crime rate index (city data):
Memphis: 900
Nat. Average: 300
My town: 130

I'd be more likely for me or my family to get hurt by my own guns than them putting me ahead ...

G

[Shaun @ Tru6]

That is cool information. I just looked up Watertown, MA

We've had 0 murders from 2000 to 2012, range that city-data.com gave.

our index is 121. Next door Newton and Belmont are 74 and 92 respectively.

I always feel safe here.

[wayner]

Wow! If home invasions are so likely, I really would consider moving as being a simpler option than all of this strategic planning and fortification and constant stress.

I took my wife to Memphis last year to see some music on Beal street and was amazed at the amount of police presence as well as tourists ambassadors (police disguised as friendly visitors bureau representatives who were much more interested in scanning the horizon for threats than helping a visitor find a good place to eat).

I felt protected, but didn't feel like I was in a safe place and we were glad to leave.

I feel fortunate to live in Canada where we sometimes do not even lock our doors.

[Scuba Steve]

To be fair, my parents live in semi-rural central Texas and haven't locked their doors since moving there in the '70s.

[Rick Lee]

I lock my doors (and use an alarm) to prevent property crime when I'm not home, not to keep home invaders out while I'm home. I've also lived in a part of TX where it was unnecessary to lock doors and neighbors looked after each other. But that lifestyle is inversely proportional to population growth and proximity to a city.

[intakexhaust]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Same here, but just remember that the criminals don't go looking for good stuff to steal in poor neighborhoods.

It's far worse in the poor neighborhoods! Gangs - cash and drugs, cash and drugs, cash and drugs............