Air Conditioning De-commisioning

[Nick Triesch]

What I am saying is it won’t keep up with today’s family cars!! In the mid 80’s a 911 turbo went 0-60 in about 5 seconds. And that was fast!! Today’s mustang GT will top that even at its weight. My 85 Carrera is tuned perfectly and Honda’s, Subarus, almost anything else will
Pass me like I’m standing still. 200 horsepower just does not get it. Especially with the wonky 915!! But I do know the 930 is fast.

[Nick Triesch]

I don’t have my Carrera because it’s fast. I have it because of the gauges, leather seats, weird handling, sound it makes from the rear when I twist the key on the left side , it’s beautiful body and whale tail , coming into a corner going down to second then popping up to third out of the corner and the smell of gas, oil and leather when I get inside of the car. That is why I have my 85 3.2.

[redridge]

Originally Posted by Nick Triesch

What I am saying is it won’t keep up with today’s family cars!! In the mid 80’s a 911 turbo went 0-60 in about 5 seconds. And that was fast!! Today’s mustang GT will top that even at its weight. My 85 Carrera is tuned perfectly and Honda’s, Subarus, almost anything else will
Pass me like I’m standing still. 200 horsepower just does not get it. Especially with the wonky 915!! But I do know the 930 is fast.

you need to take it out on the twisties... thats where these carreras shine, I can easily keep up with 993tt in the twisties.

[Coastr]

It was the fashion to take it out when the cars were worth not much and fixing the AC was 25% the value of the vehicle and you’d never get the money back. But now fixing the AC is maybe 3% the value of the vehicle and you’ll recover most of it in an increased sale price. There are also better solutions available than there used to be.

Also the weight of the aircon is not totally at the back, but still, the difference is equal to a full tank and an 1/3 full tank fuel. Yes, the butt dyno can slightly measure it, but as stated these cars are about having fun not pushing the limits. It’s about the difference of putting a 6 year old in the back seat.

Better to drive the car 365 days and lose a 10th than make it mildly faster/better to service but only drive it 100 days a year. At this point the only reason to own one of these cars is to make you smile, they’re not fast and not the best DD.

If you live in the north there is still the benefit of defogging the interior, and there are some great driving roads on the hot side of the mountains. There’s a reason every single car comes standard with AC.

[famoroso]

These cars are not about "fast" or "slow" for me, but rather how they feel, and how they make me feel, while driving them, or, for that matter, just looking at them.

"Fast", vis-a-vis the ubiquitous family car comparison, is an objective entry on a road test statistics page.

Feel is subjective. It's the reason I don't drive family cars, or, perhaps more accurately, it's the reason I choose to drive an E39 M5 versus the faster Tesla Model 3.

The fact of the matter is that weight is the enemy of both objective performance and subjective feel. It's ok if you don't want a "Sports Purpose" feel, some people are more touring / luxury oriented.

Take a look at recent 3.2 Carrera Club Sport driving impressions like this one...

https://www.instagram.com/p/CUaAzT8sBNY

"This could possibly be the best driving 911 to come out of the 1980s."

Or this one...

https://www.goodwood.com/grr/road/news/2021/10/chris-harriss-clubsport-changed-my-mind-on-the-best-911--thank-frankel-its-friday/

"It was so agile, so communicative and so pure."

The Club Sport has some additional power, but it's most important ingredient is the ~2,580 pound curb weight.

I have spent time speaking with the OP. My sense is that the changes he's made to his car lean more towards Sports Purpose than ease of defogging (which BTW... https://www.amazon.com/Rain-X-630046-Interior-Glass-Anti-Fog/dp/B00T9LR9FA). Hence, my recommendation to jettison his non-functioning AC in this instance.

I see (and live) both sides of this The Right Tool for the Job / Different Horses for Different Courses debate. It's the reason my '87 is wife-friendly with rubber suspension bushings, heat and killer AC and my '89 is a Sports Purpose wife-unfriendly car with GT3 muffler, spherical suspension bearings, big torsion bars and devoid of: heat, AC, radio, sunroof, etc.

If you have one air cooled 911 to play with, you may have to make some performance vs. luxury compromises. Regardless, get out and enjoy the drive in these wonderful machines, whether you're sipping cappuccino at C&C with friends Saturday morning or attacking canyons at dawn on Sunday, or... both.

[Larmo63]

I've owned multiple Porsches and not one has had air conditioning. Somehow I survived. Heck, the air doesn't work on this car so I've never used it. I'm leaning in Frank's direction of jettisoning the whole system. I didn't buy the car for re-sale or practicality, I have other cars that can do that.

I bought it to drive in a spirited manner.

[Coastr]

The question is not whether you can have a car without. Of course you can and many people do. The question is should you pull out the AC from a car that has it installed from factory, or should you fix it and enjoy the benefit.

[GH85Carrera]

I admit I am weird, I actually drive my 911 on road trips. All the folks that live along the west coast with mild weather car be comfortable most of the time with no AC. Drive out to Barstow or Needles on the way to Arizona and tell me you don't wish for a good AC system.

If you live in LA and the extent of driving your car is the wonderful canyon roads, living with no AC is fine. Don;t try to drive to Key West in July, like I have done. Stay away from Savannah, GA in August. Most of Texas and the "fly over states" are going to be off limits in the summer.

My goal is to drive to all 48 states, and I am just 9 shy of that right now.

Bottom line, it is just a car. If it is your car, do to it what makes you happy. If you treat it well it will have a next owner, and they can do to it what they want.

[hitch911]

I too yanked my AC system, a decision made easy living in the PNW with a cabriolet. I'm positive I'd have a different outlook living in Phoenix. Growing up with volkswagons and a father chirping in my ear to treat the engine with care.."no lugging, don't call for heat till the engine warms up first and don't drive in the heat of a hot summer day if you can help it." So pulling the system, especially the rear condensor under the engine grill which gets hot when the AC is on and pre heats all that ambient cooling air before it gets to the engine was a no brainer. I'd rather my engine benefit from the cooling air then me, easy to say and easy to do where I live.

[FA-18C]

Larmo - like others, including Frank, I yanked the compressor and condensor out of the engine area. When I drop the motor I will yank the bracket. I had a 5-year old 87 Coupe with 26K miles on it that spewed warm kitten breath in the summer. Never a high point in FL in August. I was OK with driving the car and sweating a little, and then it was my only car. I bought this one for fun, not commuting. Have kept all of the parts, but leaning towards dropping in the electric AC after my other punch list items are done. Note the strategy when dealing with the homefront comptroller - do all the mechanical upgrades first for you. Once that is done, I plan on driving with her more - she loves the car, but will make sure it is warm out. And just like that, of course it needs an AC upgrade...

Its a classic sports car. I agree with Frank, it is the feel and fun driving it. It has soul...

[tsuter]

South Texas...in the desert....I'll take this......hahahahaha! I think it was almost 90F in the shade.....

[FA-18C]

Impressive!

[PeteKz]

I have an early car that never had AC, so it's an easy choice for me if I decide I want AC--the electric AC retrofit. I live in the PNW, so we do get some 100+ days here in the summer, but it's dry, and most of the time AC isn't needed (I moved from Northern Virginia 3 years ago, and I don't miss the humidity). If you have a later car that came with AC factory installed, it's way cheaper to fix what you have, so preserve it. If you decide to restore the original AC, another thing to throw in the decision tree is whether to go with 134 or R-12. R-12 is still available and works better. 134 is getting phased out now, but will remain available for some years.

[FA-18C]

Pete, I enjoy (sometimes) working on the car, and this is as much about getting all of the AC crap out of the engine bay for me. The ability to drop in the Retro system and use the front condenser and add one in the wheel well seems like a win. More $$s, but the systems are becoming more common, and improvements will tip the scales one way or the other. I don't daily drive the car, and in the summer if I drive it to work, I just take the top off and leave that at home.

I will get a Sonderwerks topper and cover first...