Fitting 6 speed G50 to '89 Carrera - Page 8

Iciclehead · 11-12-2012, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jc.capcity

Can anyone help me with what is "natural" valve noise for the 3.0 sc motor. My records are showing valve adjust within last 10k. Im new to the car. Its got 124k and runs really well but I have a mechanic suggesting valve adjust and I feel I might be premature. Love to hear a before and after adjust on that motor. Help.

This question is probably best answered from some of the guys in the Engine Rebuild forum or perhaps start a thread about it. I suspect also a search in either the Technical or Engine Rebuild forums may be your friend.

Anyway, in terms of my response to your question, I find 911 engines noisy...compared to other cars I have, there is a whole lot more clanking and rattling, likely due to it being air cooled and not having some sound isolation from water jackets to deaden sounds.

Personally, I would do a good valve adjust yourself, it is tedious but not difficult and then you can make sure to do it right. You need the little bent feeler guage and some patience, but lots of threads on how to do it, plus some good articles on the Pelican Technical articles.

I would also judge the noise when the engine is dead hot, namely, take it out for a hour drive, make sure that the engine is good and warm and then assess the sound. YOu can also use a stethescope for any particularly noisy areas in case you have a loose valve (or a long screwdriver on the valve cover), which may help guide you if you do the valve adjustment yourself.

Generally they are pretty stable for adjustment, so unless the sound is really "CLACK CLACK" kind of thing, I would not worry too much.

Dennis

Iciclehead · 11-26-2012, 08:53 AM

Well, the journey continues. I know I have seen several people convert their front bulkhead to the earlier style, but I never realized that it was quite the PITA that it turned out to be

I basically started out by drilling out the spot welds, tried several methods and ended up with using a 5.5mm drill bit suitably located with a punch to drill partway into the spot. Then I took another 5.5 mm drill bit that I had cut off square to finish the drill through the weld.

Early on I realized that I was not going to be able to save the old panel

and so I just hacked out the centre section as it was getting in the way.

Here it is partway through

Drivers side, had to pull back the front edge of the battery tray as it was welded into the bulkhead.

And they sure were generous with the chipguard, seriously....there were places where I removed about 8 mm of the stuff and this is all original. The oscillating knive thing that has been listed elsewhere is the ticket, finished up with a wire wheel on the grinder

There is a structural tube that is formed by the pan and the front bulkhead. This is one one that is the biggest issue and which needs to be kept whole so that the integrity of the front remains intact. It also needs to be bent way back to clear the new panel...but more on that later.

Iciclehead · 10:47 AM

The car had AC that is being replaced with the 993 condenser. Needed to cut out the hump and put a flat plate in.

Here it is as it started

Here it is with the panel out...sort of an awkward location at the rear as there are to layers of sheet metal there, the crossmember (upper) and the the pan itself.

Cut up some nice galvanized sheet metal, did a bit of hammering to replicate the curve that is there and mig welded it in place. I was going to gas weld it so that I could planish the metal smooth, but found out that my oxy/acetylene hoses had a split in them (thankfully the oxy side), so I need to buy a new set of hoses before I do anything with that particular source of heat

Iciclehead · 11-26-2012, 09:09 AM

Fitting the new panel was also a bit of a pain, as the rear of the structural tube needs to be bent out of the way to allow the new bulkhead to be rotated/slid into location.

I tried a number of different ways, but at the end of it, I had to remove the jack holder, bend back the battery tray, and both bend the structural tube and curve the ends back to clear the edges of the new bulkhead

Here is the offending jack mount (other side has the main battery grounding point, didn't want to touch that one).

With a bit of fiddling and a little reshaping, the new bulkhead is in place, the spot welds to the inner fenders are done...they were a pain due to the Porsche primer both insulating the MIG wire (no start) and also causing bubbling and generally a miserable result.

I posted a question about it and got some good advice, so I finished up by grinding off the paint/galvanizing through the spot welds and increasing voltage and gas flow for the MIG. It helped, but I have much to learn about welding. I will also do some seam welding on the inside to make sure that things are strong.

Here it is until so far, spotted solidly in place. Today's job is to reshape the structural tube and finish up all the welding, plus reweld the jack support and battery tray into place and then on to the next job.

Here is the inside view, you can see the bent back structural tube part....should be straightforward to bend back and weld in place

I'll post more as I get time. I am still waiting for the Porsche front and rear signal light support as I only have one early fender to backdate my fenders to the earlier style. Porsche sells the sheet metal that actually holds the signal lights at a price so low I only cried for a while...

Until next time,

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-12-2013, 03:24 PM

Well, here is a bit of an update for anyone that might be following along, pretty conventional backdate work at this point.

I have the whole front end welded together, did the seam welding on the outer/front tube:

And of course on the inner side (little easier as it wasn't almost overhead welding).

Now just to backdate the fenders....I am a little worried....

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-12-2013, 03:34 PM

Here is the cutout I am using on the passenger side...pre blasting....

It is a pretty sketchy part with a lot of rust which proved to be an issue when I did the welding

Here it is fitted into position, took a lot of time fiddling to make sure that everything would align with the hood and trim pieces...

Anyway, taking a rest from the welding which proved to be really, really difficult. I tried gas welding originally, but either the blasting thinned the metal, or the rust did, because it was noticeably thinner than the 1989 fender it was mating up to. There definitely were some pits and crevices that just caused blowthrough and then the miserable spiral as the old material was so paper thin that it just disappeared when the torch hit it.

Switched to MIG, no better luck there, but was able between the two welding methods to get it attached....and thankfully I use lead as a filler, hopefully some of the very thin spots will get a little strengthening from that! On balance it will hold as there was solid metal (albeit thinner) between the pits and such, but it is not ideal.

I am just waiting for the lead to cool down, will get my file into it and see how it looks. I figure if I can work it with the file and sanding board and everything seems solid, it will be acceptable.

Don't like it though...the other side will have nice new hammerformed metal with new Porsche metal for the actual signal light holder component.

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-12-2013, 05:07 PM

Well, just got back from a few hours of filing, sanding and leading. Result is *acceptable* in that it is solid and the shape feels quite proper to my hand. A few minor imperfections in the lead which I may just leave for the high build primer and one minor wave just in front of the wheel well that will take a few minutes with the hammer and dolly.

Looks OK, now on to the other side...

You can see the difference in colour between the steel and the lead, it is quite extensive but very thin...my bet well under 0.5 mm. There was one divot on the far side that was a bit deep but it was so awkward to get at with the hammer that I just said to heck with it....the joys of lead...

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-13-2013, 03:16 PM

Ok, very frustrated today. Started on the drivers side signal light box, idea was to use the little filler panel from behind the short hood bellows as it matches the fender lip, then extend it with a piece of sheet steel to fabricate the rearmost part of the fender behind the long hood signal light box.

Trim went well, decided to use a piece of original steel from where the condenser fan was mounted (from the bottom of the trunk), did that bit of cutting and then decided to gas weld the two together.

Well, something is fundamentally wrong. Did 3 attempts at the seam, not one of them worked. Now, I am not the best welder in the world, but I can do this normally, I mean, my dad was a welder and I grew up with the stuff. It would not puddle and pool like I normally see. The welds were very porous and almost created slag - odd in gas welding...here is a pic of the "best" result.

You can see the very poor weld and it had no strength at all.....an easy wiggle and the weld split - and that is not normal, even for me.

So after the 3 attempts, said screw it.....got some fresh steel, used the MIG welder and done in 15 minutes. Weld is strong, no issues other than needing to finish the surface of course....here it is in rough.

Thought went through my mind....was the problem with the gas welding that it was galvanized steel (the fender/bellow filler and the section all came off of the '89) ? I mean I ground the edges clean, nice and shiny.....and horrible welds.

MIG was dead easy...

Factory manual gives specs on MIG welding galvanized surfaces, increased gas volume etc...

Is it not possible to gas weld the galvanised stuff?

Grumpy....

Iciclehead · 02-15-2013, 04:43 PM

Ok, I guess no one can figure out my gas welding problem, oh well, I'll just continue with MIG.

Anyway, the drivers side continues and it has been fairly easy, just a lot of painstaking work to make sure that the fit of the signal light is right. I am presuming that the signal light frame I bought from Porsche is the correct shape.....it matches the signal light and near as I can tell is a match for the fender cut off on the passenger side.

There is a small difference between the fenders though... pre' 73 to my '89, namely that the section beside the headlight is slightly more curved than what the earlier car was. It took me most of today to get the frame close....I will need to do a bit of hammering to get the fender out where it is supposed to be to make the signal light work.

Anyway, a question for anyone that might be reading....namely, what does the space in the signal light that the arrow points to actually do? There is no light bulb there nor is there a provision for one.

The lens has a clear section over that part of the signal light housing....I would have thought that perhaps it had a purpose?

Here is the lens....

Having never been near a backdated 911 in the dark, I actually don't have a clue about it....

Thoughts?

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-16-2013, 10:39 AM

Hello again, today is going a bit better. Haven't heard from anyone about my gas welding problem, but I was getting equally grumpy with my MIG as there was a lot of spatter and porosity.

Well, here is a lesson for MIG welders as dumb as I..,...clean the 'effin tip! I went online to the Miller site, they had some good documents and sure enough, one of the causes of porous welds was crap in the welding tip. Took 5 minutes to clean it out and sure as snot hangs in a nostril, there was a big booger of a metal ball inside...likely ruining the gas flow.

Cleaned it, reset to sensible settings and set about welding. Ahhh....nirvana, well, at least what passes for my nirvana....decent welds. Here they are, the grinder and I will get to work, then some lead to make it all pretty and we ought to be done. Then it will be on to my hybrid '73 bumper with '89 valance and fog lights. Ought to be less hassle for sure.

Here are the pics...

...anyway, if any of you are able to answer my questions....please do, I still am mystified about the gas welding fail and the inner section of the front '73 signal light...

Dennis

Iciclehead · 02-17-2013, 04:06 PM

Just thought I would post the final result of the drivers side fender for completeness....

Tomorrow I will be finishing up the fenders/front bulkhead work, need to weld in the little filler pieces and a few welding details here and there.

Then it is on to the front bumper/valence which ought to be easier...might actually try fitting the transmission/engine case together again as I have a machined pilot bearing done, so I can test out the starter and clutch engagement. I'd also fit the whole engine transmission combo into the chassis to try out the shifter linkage and make sure that is all working properly.

Dennis

vintagecarlover · 02-18-2013, 02:34 PM

great metal work, subd

Iciclehead · 02-22-2013, 05:21 PM

Thanks Vintage! I sometimes wonder if anyone reads this thread...nice to hear that I have at least one reader!

Anyway, on to the front bumper. It was a take off (obviously) from what I gather was a 1968 which means it has different mounting than what I want, but it was not all that much money and looked pretty good even though the paint is lousy. At least 3 different colours on the thing....here it is before sandblasting today

I presumed that I would need to refinish the odd spot and modify the mounting insofar as I am putting a 1989 valence with fog lights on it. That is why I was OK with a not so great bumper/valence....the valence was coming off anyway.

Well, sandblasting revealed some pretty ugly body work...tons of filler, holes for the deco trim merely hammered down and body filler larded on to it. Crinkled metal...it will be a lot of work but a new one is $810 (repro) plus shipping and I think I can fix this one.

Look and weep...

Close up of the worst part...

Inner side is not much better.....I wonder what those mounts looked like originally, right now they look like shrapnel...

Only good news is that the metal appears to be reasonably thick and not perforated, just bent. I guess me and my pick/file/dolly will get a workout. I will be removing all the brackets and supports for clearance and so I can modify them for the later (1973) mount set up. I'll look around this forum so I can see what the inside of a real 1973 front bumper looks like.

And yes...I will be using 3 inch lead when I get sick of tapping. Might just do some other stuff tomorrow like disassemble the trailing arms, front A arms, get all that ready for blasting and powder coating and get the brake stuff ready for plating (have a bunch to do).

Ahh...the challenge, that is why we do this...no?

D.

JohnnyT · 02-22-2013, 06:38 PM

Nice work!
Can you post a photo of the back side of your AC mounting? From inside the fender.
I am considering this install on a stock 87 911 Carrera. I'd like to see how you installed yours. I see a bracket or two welded on. I'm thinking of a bolt on installation.

Thanks, John
Seattle

Iciclehead · 02-22-2013, 07:35 PM

Thanks John, there are some pictures earlier in this thread (around page 7) that show the final installation. Let me know if you need any more and I can get them tomorrow. It was a major rework just FYI...

Dennis

will hung · 02-25-2013, 05:15 AM

Don't worry. I believe many are reading this thread. The work has me speechless. Can't wait to continue reading.

kenikh · 02-25-2013, 09:12 AM

Um...yeah. Lots of us reading. Given the thread, we just don't have much to contribute. We're the ones learning.

Forkster · 03-04-2013, 10:09 AM

Quick question D - are you still looking to source someone to re-weld the sunroof hole?

Ed

Iciclehead · 03-04-2013, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forkster

Quick question D - are you still looking to source someone to re-weld the sunroof hole?

Ed

No, not any more, the sunroof was welded in by little ol' me about a year ago. It was hard!! I used MIG and it was much tougher to manage the bits of warping that occurred (as the MIG welds are not really that easy to stretch).

Dennis

Iciclehead · 03-22-2013, 05:08 PM

A little more progress to report. Started by removing all the inner brackets of the front bumper as they were in the way of the grand plan...namely to use the later valence.

I did the first round of metalwork to get the front bumper looking a little better than it did after sandblasting. Lots of dents for sure, but it is coming together, a tap here, tap there, odd bit of bending and here it is, ready for its first mockup.

Must admit it doesn't yet fit all that well, here is the D/S fit to the fender lip....little inward and a little forward

P/S is a little inward...

So next steps are to fiddle a little more mocking it up, see if I can get it so it does not interfere with the front bulkhead and still provide a good fit at the fender lip. Wouldn't shock me if I have to pull the edges out and make the bumper a little wider and flatter, ought to be fun!

Once I am happy with that then it will be time to make the flat lower section of the bumper where I can fit the valence.

D.