pay pal problem

[pilot73]

I know this is the wrong forum but we all buy parts and usually through pay pal. I put an ad out to buy a running 911t engine for $2000 and a Samba guy answered and sold me one for $2200 shipped from alabama . the engine had no compression and a rod knock so I called him up and swore it ran (even though the carbs were rusted shut)I called paypal to get my money back and they told me to ship it back to the seller . The shipping was $1700 by it self . so i sent it COD then pay pal told me I had to pay for shipping or they would rule in favor of the scammer. Any suggestions?

[joeblow]

Did you PayPal with a Credit Card? Your Credit Card protection might cover you if you did.

[ShakinJoe]

This is one of many reasons I will not do business with paypal.

[pilot73]

my american express paid paypal and they don't cover used auto parts We should start up a pay pal alternative . there must be some other way of getting people money without this crooked company

[Motorsport-Tech]

$1700 to ship a motor? that is grossly overpriced. cant believe amex is shafting you as well. it may not cover used parts, but it should cover you not getting what you paid for.

[mgro1959]

Did you get anything in writing emails etc stating the condition of the engine. if so, then the engine was not as advertised paypal should have to cover you and the shipping cost. maybe try squaretrade. I think that is what it is called. It is associated with paypal/ebay and they look at both sides if something can't be solved. As well maybe try Better Business Bureau. Goodluck in sorting out this mess. As far as the shipping I am in Vancouver Canada and can get a whole car shipped here for less from Florida, had a sidecar from Kentucky for 600 and a toyota box from Arizona for 250. Dont know where they are coming up with 1700 for a motor. Someone is taking someone else on that.

[NorthernThrux]

Look at Fed Ex ground or any LTL service. I shipped a 200lb motorcycle engine on a pallet to California from Ontario, Canada for $400 using Fed Ex LTL services. For cheapest service you'll want to avoid residential pickup and delivery.

[techweenie]

I think the issue here isn't' the shipping cost.

My advice is not going to help the PO. But for anyone else initiating a deal on something with -- let's say -- 'concealed condition' there's an alternative.

In the past, I've used escrow.com. It costs a few bucks (I think I paid $45) but my buyer got a chance to inspect the part I shipped and agree it was what I represented before the money was released to me.

[pilot73]

escrow .com sounds like a good idea for the future I'll try square trade for now

[Unobtanium-inc]

Please note that PayPal will NOT refund your payment, offer protection, etc. on something based on the condition. If you click "item was not as described" in your complaint, your claim goes into a paypal black hole with no way out. The minute you escalate to a full claim you get an email from them saying they do not arbitrate condition. The ONLY way paypal protects you is in the case that you don't receive the item at all.

Sadly, there's really nothing you can do short of showing up at the guy's house with the engine and appealing to his humanity. Save the money you would have spent shipping it back and use it toward this engine, or toward buying a better example.

[Anastasios]

Paypal is a real scam.
They update their policy and you (buyer) have to pay return shipping charges.
So you are unable to ask for a chargeback your CC ?
I close my paypal account and never regret it.

Good luck

[techweenie]

I believe Paypal also refuses buyer protection for out of country purchases.

Basically, Paypal is bait and switch. And I have to consider their "hit" with everything I put up for sale. I'm selling a Fuchs wheel for a friend and doing it as a favor, taking $15 for my time (and buying a carton) so I have to price it at $414 in order to net $400. Plus, of course, I have to 'mark up' my FedEx charges as well. And if the buyer pays with a credit card (which nobody has, so far) I understand the fees are even higher. So, heavy fees, and no recourse. Not much of a bargain.

eBay bought Paypal as part of their business plan, which as I understand it, is to gross 10% of every sale -- partly by forcing the use of Paypal. Sux.

[cadavieco]

oops I´ll cancel my paypal account now!!!

[alwaysflat6s]

Guys,

Here is my question. If we all cancel our PayPal accounts, WHAT do we use instead?

Most people aren;'t set up to accept credit cards, and you saw the note about American Express not backing up their customer buying used parts.. so where does that leave us?

I will say that I TRY very hard to figure out who I am dealing with before I make deals. This has saved my a lot of headaches [but I have passed on a lot of "good deals"]. Your first hint is a brand new seller or someone you know nothing of refers you to "a friend'. You see is here regularly. I can't remember the last time I bought anything with checking out the seller in some way first.

I am not pretending to know answers. I have lost big on a couple of deals because of this type of situation. Thankfully, a lot of us post about people.. but we all know about some that keep coming back..and back..and BACK ... !! With new IDs and ... above all watch out on craigslist. I see our worst local scammer [North SF Bay area] still in business and knows how to represent himself like he and his parts/engines are the greatest. [Beats the old pre www days.] My first hint on one local guy was when I noticed all the fresh bullet holes in the door of his truck! BTW< if it is local and you get a big burn, you can take them to court AND you can sometimes press fraud charges. Don't expect a lot of help. Most PDs are very reluctant to go with that [as it is too much work and rather difficult] and you have to know the laws and PUSH to get them to do it. I got full restitution from 2 of them because things were getting hot for them. Don't lie down and allow yourself to get screwed when you can pursue them.

I would love to hear anyone's workable ideas.BTW, I have used escrow.com a couple of times. Works great but gets expensive. In recent years questionable sellers refused me on it.

EBay tried to do their own version of PayPal. They could copy only so much of the technology and it was a failure ;-> That was when they bought PayPal. I sure wish it had remained separate.

Glad to see this discussion.
JR

[Benny771]

As a buyer... I have had very few issues. But Paypal has always worked for me. And if the condition is not as stated.... you send it back. Usually the seller does not want bad feedback so if it was obvious, he will pay for the return shipping.
Mind you, I have never purchased a motor or anything that heavy using paypal.

[86 ssinit]

When PayPal told you to ship the engine back the money you paid for the motor through PayPal should have been frozen. You can't get it and he can't. Than you work out a deal with the seller about shipping. Nobody can touch the money so the seller wants to work out a deal. I have bought and sold stuff on eBay for years and have had this problem. If you returned the motor before you spoke to the seller all your going to get back is your $2200 for the motor. Shipping is up to the seller and at that price he's not going to pay. Before you pay that shipping make sure PayPal is going to Give you back the whole original price.

[pilot73]

If I pay for the shipping I'm in it for almost $4000 and still no motor or promise of refund.The shipping is the issue!

[86 ssinit]

Sorry buddy but I think your screwed. I sold stuff on eBay and the price of shipping was always up to me to refund or not.

[86 ssinit]

Was this sale through eBay????

[mgro1959]

Keep the motor and work a deal with the seller on the shipping. May not be the best situation but you do have value in the motor. You could suggest going to local law authorities if the seller did misrepresent the deal and you have proof. may scare them into some sort of deal. Yellow freight, reddeway trucking are two reasonable shipping companies. Also ship happens is around and there is a co. that bids on the shipping but the bidding is done to undercut the previous bidder rather then uping the ante. Not sure the name of it. Goodluck again.