Not much more hair i can pull out

[phxaz928]

Would like to first off say hello, to everyone. I had just recently purchased my first 1985 928s Porsche. When i got it had a coolant leak, luckily just the water pump not a crack in the block. I changed out the water pump and put it back together and it started and ran fine, except for the belt tensioner light. I rebuilt the tensioner assembled the car one more time only to get a no start problem. I figured it was the timing so i read up on the timing in the workshop manuals and proceeded to line everything up TDC. From the colored links on the camshaft chain with the notches on the cam shaft to the notch on the cam sprocket and cam sprocket housing back cover to the dampner. Actually, i lined up everything at 45 btdc, because i read that the cam can only be turned when the crank is at 45 btdc. I put it back together, started it and it ran real crappy. Like it needed to be advanced. I have tried lining it up 3 more times and the same result. Is there a step i forgot somewhere? The only thing i did different the 2nd time was remove the alternator and set it on the ground with wire attached. Also i just had the front passenger side jacked up. It was like that for 3 days. Would that cause a problem maybe with the fuel pump? One more note on the passenger side cam housing notch was painted red and the driver side was green with each cam sprocket having a red 0tdc mark and 45 btdc . Could it be possible that i need to match up the passenger side to the red and the driver side to the green? Or should i be looking elsewhere besides the timing? The car runs but runs horrible. Any suggestions? Thank you

[rhjames]

fuel pump should not be an issue.

sometimes the simplest solution is to look to the things you altered or repaired.

did you align everything according to the FWMs? if so, you should have a nice smooth running engine if nothing else was altered.





--Russ

[Danglerb]

Pictures and more info in this thread,

http://www.porsche928forums.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=344

Off the top of my totally 32v inexperienced head the timing is "close" but the gears may need adjustment in smaller increments than a tooth, that 32v'r type stuff.

[phxaz928]

I have lined up everything over and over. Its gotta be something else. The fuel pump works fine, just double checked it. And the car still runs very rough misfiring here and there. Could it be possible for a engine to run with bent valves?

[MPDano]

Did you do a compression check on all 8? Did you check for vacuum leaks?

[phxaz928]

Have not done a compression check,but i did replace all the vac line and intake manifold gaskets.

[phxaz928]

Any tips on doing a compression check?

[MPDano]

A compression gauge and a fitting to fit your spark plug holes, remove all plugs, remove coil wire, remove fuel pump relay, crank it and let it turn a few revolutions, write down compression reading, then do all 8. Report back to us.

[Danglerb]

Something like a MityVac works great to test vacuum lines, pull the line off the throttle body and hook up the mityvac, pump down a vacuum and see how it holds and if actuators move properly etc.

Recheck the most recent work.

A few more tips to what MPDano said; use a charger on the battery and start with it fully charged, use the same number of rrr -rrr-rrr's like 5 for each cylinder.

Wish I could offer more, but I know very little about a 32v motor. If I was stuck I think I would buy Porkens 32V'r tool for setting the cam timing.

*** OK compression tester and MityVac are about $40 from Harbor Freight Tools. The MityVac branded tool will warp in sun light on a hot day, mine did, so I bought the fairly nasty looking HF brand that is metal.

[MPDano]

Yes, Mikes suggestion will also find out if some of your vacuum valves are working as should be. I had a couple bad ones on my car (diaphragm was torn or disintegrated), which will create a huge vacuum leak. I replaced my Decel Valve and Air Diverter Valve.

[phxaz928]

Well that was it. Cylinders 1-4 checked out OK, but 5 & 6 no compression at all didn't even bother checking 7 & 8.

[MPDano]

Glad we sorted it out, although that's bad news. 32Vers should chime in now to see whats your next step.

[Danglerb]

Ran fine when you got it, ran fine after wp, would not start after tensioner, rechecked timing and got it started but ran rough. Now compression is ok 1-4, but nothing 5&6.

Not feeling very sorted out yet. Maybe timing was way off on driver side at some point in the would not start stage?

Maybe somebody else in Phx Az could take a look and maybe give you a hand?

[phxaz928]

Yes, I think may be the case. If there are any special tips I should know before ripping the head apart would be very useful, or perhaps a good machine shop. I think I'll do the rebuild in stride instead off trying to rush through it due to my excitement of wanting it to run. I have never worked on a porsche before. I really do appreciate all of the advice. You guys are great thank you.

[Danglerb]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190285089915

and

www.liftbars.com

for the guide and 32V'r.

You didn't mention any huge nasty sounds during this, so maybe the damage isn't too bad. We still don't know EXACTLY what is wrong either.

[SolReaver]

PHXA: compression in one bank and zip in another after doing a TB. you may have messed up the fine timing on the second bank. Happens all the time. Refer to this video and see if you did everything OK. The link was posted by a generous owner on Bannlist. Be sure to thank them. The TB on a 32V is not rocket science, but it can be tricky. Don't beat yourself up for not getting it right the first time. Cams slip, things get off a tooth, stuff happens.

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/4629118/12377608

Please don't start taking things apart any more than you need to.

You can use this site to download it.. http://www.splandoo.com/

Then burn it to a disk and show it at 928 parties. All the parties I never get invited to.

MPDano, James, and Dangerleb: If you don't have it already, it is a good reference and worth the disk space. Just last night watching this helped me through a nasty bout of insomnia. I want liftbars...I NEED liftbars....I want a porkentensioner...I NEED a Porkentensioner......

[phxaz928]

Anyone know of a place that possibly rents the sprcial tools i need?

[Danglerb]

You need to hook up with some other local to you owners and have or visit someone elses timing belt party. Regional groups do them all the time. Thats the best choice, you get access to the tools needed, and some hands that already know how to use them.

What also works, buy a flywheel lock and Kempf tool off ebay, use it, and sell it.

[SolReaver]

Hey. I had been thinking a bit about your prob. It seems to me that if the engine ran champion BEFORE the TB job...And ASSUMING that you didn't release the lock bolts on the cam to cam gear...Perhaps your problem is just that you are a tooth off. I am not an expert here, however...I was under the impression that the fine timing of the cam timing was only if the timing was disturbed or if the heads were removed.

Mr. Safety would like to add that you should ALWAYS rotate the engine 2 complete revs by hand and check for interference whenever you tinker with the timing or else very bad things can happen. How close is it? Did you release the lock bolt or the 3 bolts?

[Alan in AZ]

I don't know if taking it to a shop is an option at this point (e.g. trailered) - if so check out Exotic Motorwerks - Dan Warner specializes in 928's.

Alan