For those who doubt my posts...

[ShopCat]

Originally Posted by littleoldman

Cajun is right.
Even if you have the car why not borrow under 3% and buy almost anything in the stock market and beat the 3%

Obviously this thread isn't about people with the cash considering the first post...

[Cajundaddy]

Originally Posted by ShopCat

Obviously this thread isn't about people with the cash considering the first post...

Yep, the other side of the coin is the guy who *needs* a 911, has sheit credit and little cash. The bank sees this guy coming and pounds him with a 18% loan and gap insurance. He figures "It's a 911, it will appreciate more than 18% per year", only it doesn't, or he tosses the motor. Now he is deep under water with no easy way out.

There are a lot of these guys...

[Patrick3000]

Originally Posted by MrBonus

Except classic car loans don't offer great rates like new cars and generally the people buying them aren't buying them to use as a daily driver.

You would be surprised at some of the terms. My last classic car was financed at 3.19%, 60 months, unsecured. Not because I needed to but because I could. Sometimes lenders do stupid things with OPM.

BTW: I purchased it to use in vintage racing.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by Patrick3000

You would be surprised at some of the terms. My last classic car was financed at 3.19%, 60 months, unsecured. Not because I needed to but because I could. Sometimes lenders do stupid things with OPM.

BTW: I purchased it to use in vintage racing.

Too funny! I financed the purchase of my 2nd roadrace bike (a 1997 Ducati Monster 750 that I fitted with Supermono bodywork, among many other mods). You only live once, right!?

[Patrick3000]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

You only live once, right!?

Should be ready for the PCA Club race this Fall at Summit Point.

Life is not a dress rehearsal

[Matt Monson]

Yummy yellow.

[Catorce]

So one of my businesses is a marketing company that sells credit repair products. I am fairly well versed in the nuances of achieving a high credit score, which doesn't necessarily equate to strict financial health....i.e. you can have a great credit score but be upside down on a lot of things. There are some good reasons for financing a car that could help you a lot:

1. You can use the car as a company car.
2. You don't currently have an installment loan on your credit. You need one of each type of loan to raise your score (installment, revolving, etc).
3. You are 1-1.5 years out from buying a house. A good sized car loan a couple years before you buy a home is great for your credit score.
4. You eventually want to finance a more expensive car. For example, Woodside credit, who finances your Lambos, Ferraris, exotics, etc. will NOT finance you unless you have had a similar car loan in the past.

You will note that NONE of these reasons make strict financial sense, but they may make sense for YOU in your situation, whatever that may be.

I have 17 cars and 2 car loans. I think that ratio is pretty decent. I tend to finance things I am not really planning to keep, and I tend to pay cash for older stuff that I won't sell.

It really depends on your situation.

[Vaive]

Financing is why prices have skyrocketed. And it's also why prices will collapse at the slightest economic downturn, when these loans start defaulting en masse. When a job loss happens or business income decreases, what's the first thing to go? The toys...classic cars, boats, RVs, Harleys, etc.

The vast majority of people who borrow money for toys do so because they don't have cash to buy. There are some that do the math and figure I can borrow for X% and invest my cash into something that returns greater than X%. Myself included. I have a boat loan at 2.49% that I could have easily paid for with cash. But 2.49% is practically free money, so why not?

But let's be real, these are the small exceptions to the rule. Americans buy things based not on the price, but on the payment. $400/mo for an 84 month loan on a $25K used car that depreciates to $10K by the end of the loan? Sweet deal bro, where do I sign?

[Matt Monson]

Yep, there are always exceptions. But it’s a rule for a reason. a guy with 11 cars financing two is the exception. I have 8 cars with two of them on leases. I have leased my last couple of cars because rates are so low and residuals high so that I can buy the car at the end and have it worth more than my purchase price. Six months later it’s the deposit on the next one. Again, the exception, not the rule, and you have to pick the car carefully.

[Vaive]

I'm a fan of leasing as well. If you understand how leasing works and shop around, there are insanely good deals to be had. I leased two cars in 2017 one for me, one for the mrs, combined MSRP of $110K, combined monthly payments $800 with not a dime down for either. We're both driving luxury cars (real luxury not a BMW 3-series for the price of a Camry.

However, again, small exception. Most people have no idea how leasing works and get raked over the coals. I see ads with $400/mo leases with $6500 down on a $40K MSRP car and shake my head. Half of me is disgusted, the other half of me figures I can get the good deals because of so many people getting bad deals. They're essentially subsidizing me.

[Catorce]

I have never leased because I don't understand it. I hear it can be good in some cases, but I just don't know enough about it to take the plunge.

[robertmark]

Who cares if people finance these cars or any cars??? My dad taught me you only buy a car you can afford with money saved in the bank. The only thing you finance is your home. I’ve never had a car loan, and certainly not a lease, leases only make sense when they can be expensed on a p&l. , but to each their own. Some people finance their vacation, I think a car makes more sense than that. That’s the Great thing about America, choices.

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Dangit. Don't know why the picture didn't show. It's a dude with a '95 933 he's selling because he lost his job. He says he "only' has 15 $850 payments left on it. I'll try to upload again later when I'm not trying to work.

Re: the pic not showing - the bbs will let you upload a PNG file and link to it but not show it. You'de have to re-save it as a jpg file then upload it again and it should work.

As for the financing, jesus..... but I guess it's a good thing, in todays market where any half decent air cooled 911 is going to be $40k+ there's always going to be a segment of themarket who wants one, but can't swing the cash.

I guess the prevailing attitude is, hey, I owe $300K on my house, $150K on two SUVs, $30K on my boat,, what's another $50K for a toy? I deserve it don't I? I work hard, don't I?

I for one look at the price of a lot of cars that sell ($100K+ hot rods, damn near any turbo, longhoods, etc and wonder who on earth could ever afford that.... I guess the answer is, not everyone lets that stop them!!!

It's good for the market, if you ask me

Mind you, didn't ANYONE learn ANYTHING from the financial crisis? Your average north american consumer seems to be pretty irresponsible. Lots of spending, NO savings. And don't forget, half of all people are below average!

[Matt Monson]

No, people did not learn their lesson. 7 million Americans are 3 months or more behind on their car payment. Winter is coming. I’ll be buying more cars after the crash.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by Jonny042

. . . Your average north american consumer seems to be pretty irresponsible. Lots of spending, NO savings. And don't forget, half of all people are below average!

Not to mention, obese! We have become a nation of narcissistic, gluttonous, two-legged pigs!

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

Not to mention, obese! We have become a nation of narcissistic, gluttonous, two-legged pigs!

Wide hips are only good on a Porsche. LoL

[Cajundaddy]

Originally Posted by JMS935

Wide hips are only good on a Porsche. LoL

...or the right latina...

[robertmark]

As someone who sold Countrywide/Bank of America's foreclosures during the crisis of 08 & 09, I can tell you the banks and the consumers have NOT learned their lessons. Low/no money down mortgages are back and people are buying. Rinse and repeat!!

[Vaive]

Originally Posted by robertmark

As someone who sold Countrywide/Bank of America's foreclosures during the crisis of 08 & 09, I can tell you the banks and the consumers have NOT learned their lessons. Low/no money down mortgages are back and people are buying. Rinse and repeat!!

Business cycles last 10 years.
People's memories last 8 years.

[mooty]

Originally Posted by Catorce

So one of my businesses is a marketing company that sells credit repair products. I am fairly well versed in the nuances of achieving a high credit score, which doesn't necessarily equate to strict financial health....i.e. you can have a great credit score but be upside down on a lot of things. There are some good reasons for financing a car that could help you a lot:

1. You can use the car as a company car.
2. You don't currently have an installment loan on your credit. You need one of each type of loan to raise your score (installment, revolving, etc).
3. You are 1-1.5 years out from buying a house. A good sized car loan a couple years before you buy a home is great for your credit score.
4. You eventually want to finance a more expensive car. For example, Woodside credit, who finances your Lambos, Ferraris, exotics, etc. will NOT finance you unless you have had a similar car loan in the past.

You will note that NONE of these reasons make strict financial sense, but they may make sense for YOU in your situation, whatever that may be.

I have 17 cars and 2 car loans. I think that ratio is pretty decent. I tend to finance things I am not really planning to keep, and I tend to pay cash for older stuff that I won't sell.

It really depends on your situation.

YES, and I have spend some of my career modeling and doing algorithm in theory for credit scoring... FICO and your income and network are totally unrelated. we have clients who are worth over $1B with 600 FICO... I kid you not. but u know

Originally Posted by Vaive

Financing is why prices have skyrocketed. And it's also why prices will collapse at the slightest economic downturn, when these loans start defaulting en masse. When a job loss happens or business income decreases, what's the first thing to go? The toys...classic cars, boats, RVs, Harleys, etc.

The vast majority of people who borrow money for toys do so because they don't have cash to buy. There are some that do the math and figure I can borrow for X% and invest my cash into something that returns greater than X%. Myself included. I have a boat loan at 2.49% that I could have easily paid for with cash. But 2.49% is practically free money, so why not?

But let's be real, these are the small exceptions to the rule. Americans buy things based not on the price, but on the payment. $400/mo for an 84 month loan on a $25K used car that depreciates to $10K by the end of the loan? Sweet deal bro, where do I sign?

u are partly correct. but more complex than that.
my ex life, we create "products" for you to buy/lease/burn your money. remember the 40year mortgage...

reverse mortgage...

20 years ago, there weren't such thing and mortgage don't go upside-down... and if you think, the mortgage debacle was bad. we have even more exotic derivative to fk you up...

the buying by PMT technique is one to be avoid surely.. but there are other traps

Originally Posted by Catorce

I have never leased because I don't understand it. I hear it can be good in some cases, but I just don't know enough about it to take the plunge.

there is nothing right about lease.
tax write off... well, if I audited the company leases, I can fairly easily prove 90% of "lease" are shady from tax pt of view.