Hackety Hacks

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

The kid Nathan is talking about was silly and inconsiderate to take the job and quit the next day, but the fact that he is even asking again for work from Nathan shows he has a pretty sizable set of ballz on him; nothing worse than having a pissant yes-man around, so maybe the fairly rare, display of ballz is promising?

Or lack of brains

[Matt Monson]

We were all young once. I did selfish inconsiderate things too. I’m sure we all have. You could even make the history part of an interview question. Something like,”based on our previous history, why should I give to another chance?” His answer might surprise you. Or he might be a douche. You never know if you don’t ask. But you do you. I’m not telling you how to run your business. I’m just saying what I might do.

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by Macroni

Wow, Anthony a mouthful covering a few topics.

My theory: Hire slow, fire fast coupled with a commitment to the patience required for training. An organization needs to train to a specific performance which is measurable by clearly defined and well communicated metrics. I find all employees need not only management but proper supervision.

I am not around during the day and you guys move fast. I managed my guys well and worked alongside them. I kept a tight run ship as they say. My parts were flight safety critical so I made it a point early on to learn every job. From sweeping floors, melting and pouring alum and mag, shakeout, grinding/cleaning, grit blasting to radiographic inspection,NDT, final inspection, etc. I also ran the business did all the quotations, first articles and delt first hand with my customers and quality assurance. Hard to keep on top of 30 employees while being at your desk. I never asked any employee to do anything I wasn't willing to do myself and took on the most critical and dangerous work myself. I treated them as I would expect to be treated and considered many family. Every new employee was hired on a 3 month probationary and training period. This meant that they were with a trained employee or myself at any given time for the first three months. People can put on a good front. The last young employee I hired was a nice young man who graduated from Stevens in Hoboken and was being put up by his girlfriend's father in a Hoboken Brownstone worth millions. All he had to do was keep himself clean and stay employed. Never had an issue until one day about 4 months in he fell off the wagon and I found him and another employee in the yard hiding. I always suspected the other employee of having issues but he was too tricky. On this beautiful sunny morning I showed up and found them with a mirror, pipe and beer at 8 AM. Needless to say I had had it and they were gone. A week later his mother called demanding his job back and then his smoke show of a girlfriend and her equally hot friend came begging for me to take him back. They offered to take me into the storage shed and I could have my way with them. It did take all my sensibilities to resist but what is wrong with people today?

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

To one of Anthony's points I banned cell phones in the workplace and made use of any social media on company machines against the rules. That helped with productivity but not attitude

It's been 7 years since I last had an employee. Restructuring my business and creating something that just my wife and I could run was huge. It did impact our volume and potential for future growth but a $40-50k drop in payroll type expenses has offset it enough that the impact to my bottom line is negligible.

Once I saw that Cell phones were an issue I band them as well but I found that they would take extra long bathroom breaks and would be conversing with their GF not realizing how much time they were away. So I had to then limit bathroom breaks. Today that wouldn't be so easy.

Originally Posted by ShopCat

Lol all of this sh** applies to older employees as well, you're in lala land if you disagree. I go through so many operators and truck drivers for sleeping/personal runs on company time its not funny, and plenty of them are older. I just disagree that its somehow an age thing. You would think the older guys would have their sh** together more but can't say I've seen a trend either way, and our payroll runs 6 digits a week so I hire/fire a lot of people.

No doubt there are slackers of all ages. Although to me it is quite apparent that they are far more common than they were 30-40 years ago. It also depends on what business you are in and the bottom of the barrel has always been an issue. Each generation seems to feel more entitled and less motivated. This really became apparent during the Clinton years. They expect more for less and are always looking for the quick buck. The laws in place today IMO cater to the lazy and those who take advantage. People have learned to work the system far more today than they tried to years ago. If they only put the energy into their job they would find again IMO that things will fall into place and they would progress more than by taking the lazy approach and expecting to be given more for no reason.

I was talking to a friend last night who owns a couple of UPS stores and Rite Aids down in FLA. He is a lawyer by trade and is amazed how in the past 10 years how bad it has become. He is afraid to hire new employees under the age of 45. It is hard to find anyone willing to work or actually show up and most don't seem to give a fuch. They take advantage and the more rules he puts in place the worse it becomes. The laws make it difficult to fire them once hired. Sadly the race card is thrown more times than not. The added Unemployment and aid from the government is making it tough to keep employees very much like I had issues back when Obama did something similar and who ate it? The businessman.

I find that if you did not experience the way things were prior to 9-11 and how the world was back then that it is very hard to get anyone who was born after 1990 to understand what I am saying but those of you who were around back then and saw what people were like and the dedication that it took to make this country the powerhouse it was is a different world with different people than we are dealing with today.

[NYNick]

Back in my professional days, I had an assistant come to me and my partner in May and give us notice he would be leaving in September to go back to Grad school. He thought he was being nice giving us all that notice so we could find his replacement.

The look on my face must've been priceless. When he asked what was wrong, I told him there was no way we were going to keep him around for 4 more months, training and paying him so he could leave in September.

I said: "Why would we do that? Your last day is Friday".

Sometimes they just don't think it through.

[sugarwood]

There is a glaring case of selection bias in these anecdotes. College has become the new norm. Almost everyone goes to college now, and you guys are hiring for menial retail and blue collar jobs with low status and low pay. Respect to anyone who grinds out an honest living, but the unfortunate reality is that almost no one enters the trades anymore, and you are dealing with a tiny subset of the talent pool. It does not represent the whole in any form. You have the exact same issues 100 years ago if you owned a garment sewing sweatshop. Triangle Shirtwaist Fire had locked their doors for a reason, to prevent lazy employees from unauthorized breaks and to reduce theft.

Minimum wage laborer? Factory manufacturing job? UPS store cashier? Rite Aid cashier? Who do you think you're hiring for these jobs? The Ivy grad? The kid with a degree in hard sciences? A kid with an MBA or JD? People don't take out $100k of college loan debt to work with hand tools in a dead end back breaking job. They are out there building corporate careers or starting tech businesses in cushy office parks. Top young talent moves into large cities, so you don't even have access to the same universe of recruiting, if you're trying to fill rural or suburban jobs.

If you worked at an elite professional firm, then you'd see what kind of talent and work ethic is actually out there. Those kids command starting salaries of $150k. Are you paying that kind of salary? If not, then you can't be whining about the talent pool you are attracting for minimum wage. Menial work, low status, and low pay will not attract the top of the labor pool. This has been true since the beginning of time, and has nothing to do with "today's lazy youth."

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by NYNick

Back in my professional days, I had an assistant come to me and my partner in May and give us notice he would be leaving in September to go back to Grad school. He thought he was being nice giving us all that notice so we could find his replacement.

The look on my face must've been priceless. When he asked what was wrong, I told him there was no way we were going to keep him around for 4 more months, training and paying him so he could leave in September.

I said: "Why would we do that? Your last day is Friday".

Sometimes they just don't think it through.

Dayum. You’re harsh. In the retail and manufacturing worlds Ive been part of that would have been appreciated. They would have assisted in the training of their replacement and offered a reference or letter of recommendation for their professionalism. I’m not talking about some part time grunt. But someone I would call my “assistant”? That’s a skilled job and I would appreciate the help and long lead time in making sure I get a good replacement for them in place.

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Dayum. You’re harsh.

Yup, I was. That was the dog eat dog world of Commercial RE. Eat your young and all that snake infested viper pit crap, suspenders, limos, Wolf of Wall Street environment included. Huge money, 15 hour days, divorces, Moet, drugs, endless parties and in my case, an ache in the pit of my stomach that wouldn't go away. So I quit.

Walking away from the money was tough, but I couldn't be that way anymore. One of the best decisions I've ever made.

[Macroni]

Sugha

I think your view is just as myopic.

The world is made up of many more businesses than Tech start ups.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by NYNick

Yup, I was. That was the dog eat dog world of Commercial RE. Eat your young and all that snake infested viper pit crap, suspenders, limos, Wolf of Wall Street environment included. Huge money, 15 hour days, divorces, Moet, drugs, endless parties and in my case, an ache in the pit of my stomach that wouldn't go away. So I quit.

Walking away from the money was tough, but I couldn't be that way anymore. One of the best decisions I've ever made.

That makes more sense. I thought you were talking about at the restaurant. I was scratching my head thinking,”asst managers at a restaurant are that easy to replace?!?” That’s a whole different universe you are describing.

I do fire quickly under a year of service. But after I’ve mentored you for a few years gets a certain respect, that they’ve earned.

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

That makes more sense. I thought you were talking about at the restaurant. I was scratching my head thinking,”asst managers at a restaurant are that easy to replace?!?” That’s a whole different universe you are describing.

I do fire quickly under a year of service. But after I’ve mentored you for a few years gets a certain respect, that they’ve earned.

Oh, restaurant managers? How 'bout this one! Cutest little southern girl you've ever seen, single mother of two, responsible, nice, honest, etc. She didn't show up for work one morning after a few years, no call, no show, no nothing. Didn't answer any calls either. Turns out she moved out of her apartment in the middle of the night, packed her kids and her stuff and moved back to Texas to be with an old flame. Never heard from her again.

Who does that?

[Macroni]

Originally Posted by NYNick

Who does that?

People who owe money, feel shame or afraid of being held accountable.

[ShopCat]

When I gave my 2 weeks notice at a CPA firm and they didn't seem to want me to stay, just finish the week out and sayonara. We had just finished up busy season but still, I though I was being courteous, but got nothing back. I see employers complain about no loyalty in the workplace any more but I believe employers are just as at fault for the erosion.

Also, not to get too political but maybe every other developed nation rebuilding from ruble had a little something to do with who became the powerhouses of the 60s, 70s and 80s.

[Matt Monson]

I’ve never had a no-call no-show except someone drunk/hungover. Generally ended in them fired or written up. Closest was a guy who quit without notice mid-shift. But he announced it and just walked out the door. I’ve never been ghosted.

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by sugarwood

There is a glaring case of selection bias in these anecdotes. College has become the new norm. Almost everyone goes to college now, and you guys are hiring for menial retail and blue collar jobs with low status and low pay. Respect to anyone who grinds out an honest living, but the unfortunate reality is that almost no one enters the trades anymore, and you are dealing with a tiny subset of the talent pool. It does not represent the whole in any form. You have the exact same issues 100 years ago if you owned a garment sewing sweatshop. Triangle Shirtwaist Fire had locked their doors for a reason, to prevent lazy employees from unauthorized breaks and to reduce theft.

Minimum wage laborer? Factory manufacturing job? UPS store cashier? Rite Aid cashier? Who do you think you're hiring for these jobs? The Ivy grad? The kid with a degree in hard sciences? A kid with an MBA or JD? People don't take out $100k of college loan debt to work with hand tools in a dead end back breaking job. They are out there building corporate careers or starting tech businesses in cushy office parks. Top young talent moves into large cities, so you don't even have access to the same universe of recruiting, if you're trying to fill rural or suburban jobs.

If you worked at an elite professional firm, then you'd see what kind of talent and work ethic is actually out there. Those kids command starting salaries of $150k. Are you paying that kind of salary? If not, then you can't be whining about the talent pool you are attracting for minimum wage. Menial work, low status, and low pay will not attract the top of the labor pool. This has been true since the beginning of time, and has nothing to do with "today's lazy youth."

You crack me up and are the most clueless individual I have come across on these forums. My wife sat on a trading floor for nearly 20 years and sits on the **** board. She hires some very smart individuals and interviews countless people. Many prove to be as clueless as a floor sweep and equally unmotivated. She mostly agrees with my comments and if she was responding wouldn't be half as kind as I am. Min wage workers years ago had more commitment to their jobs than most of the young kids today applying for high paying positions. Many looking for a quick leg up and don't want to pay any dues. I never denied their being slackers since the beginning of time but today it is clearly worse and getting even worse as the internet consumes more of our lives.

As I said what was the exception is now the rule and you my friend seem to be the rule. If your how to shift videos are any indication of who you are you clearly are even more clueless than I give you credit for.

BTW my employees were mostly skilled laborers making critical parts and I paid them handsomely. I started the floor sweeps at $9 an hour when min was only $4.25 and there was a time people were grateful for the extra coin. Not today they all want more and have to work less. Get your head out your Arse and look around if you see it differently take off the rose colored glasses.


Please excuse my anger I am off my pain meds for surgery on Monday and I get a bit cranky.

[Alan A]

NY is at will.

But if you ask someone to leave if they give notice - especially if they’ve been there a while - and then refuse to pay them for said notice period, expect to be on the losing side of a lawsuit for wrongful dismissal.

Especially if the person has a husband who can afford a lawyer and holds grudges...