Help needed for SC valuation

[stratofortress]

Hello all,

Allow me to begin by stating how wrong it feels to post this, even though it's not technically for sale. This car has been in my family for as long I've been on this Earth, so my heart says absolutely no way in Hell am I letting it go, but financially it makes a lot of sense. I'm truly torn. Mind vs heart. OK, some background:

Keep in mind, I made sure everything done to the car was reversible except for some of the interior removal like the headliner and part of the carpets. Everything I have removed, I kept. The car was completely 100% stock when I took possession of it.

It is a 1980. I am the third owner as of one year ago. The first owner had it until 1986 when it was then purchased by my uncle and driven ~40k miles over ten years. The car has a 160mph speedo changed out from the factory 85mph one. It currently reads just under 92k and does not seem to work. When my uncle purchased the car in 1986 the speedo read ~50k. There is no further history on the mileage other than what I've stated. Also, other than some tire and oil change receipts from the 80s and 90s, I have no maintenance records on the car. My uncle was a mechanical engineer by trade and performed a lot of the maintenance himself, including valve adjustments and a clutch job.

The car sat, undriven, in a climate controlled garage in Atlanta, GA from 1996-2014. In saying that, the garage did get damp, and the inside had spotting of yellow mold on most of the leather surfaces. The interior certainly wasn't perfect, as the dash leather was separated and rear seat bottoms crusty. I kept and cleaned all of the salvageable interior items. The door trim and rear quarters are in excellent shape. The upside is that I know for a fact that the bare surface of the interior is free of any corrosion. The seats were kept separate from the car and are now gone.

There is zero rust on the car.

It is a paint-to-sample.

The clutch was done about 1000 miles ago (back in the mid-90s).

It has the green factory Bilsteins.

Has the original owner's manual, air compressor, tool kit, and Bilstein jack.

It had a Momo Porsche Design steering wheel, but needed recovering, so I installed a Nardi wheel that I had from my last car. Still have the Momo wheel.

I removed all A/C components (compressor was already uninstalled).

I removed all sunroof components (the seals needed replacement).

The HVAC plumbing and controls have been removed for inspection.

I removed the original Blaupunkt head unit.

The heater hoses in the engine bay have been removed as some of them deteriorated.

I removed some outside body trim (rubber bumpers, side skirts, fog lights, etc.) in search for rust, but found none. As you can tell I'm paranoid of rust; I wanted to make sure this car was solid when I bought it.

There is a dent in the driver’s side rear footwell area, behind the driver seat, where a nimrod jacked the car up improperly.

It appears as if the paint has been touched up on some places like the doors and rear quarters. Some parts are noticeably shinier than others. The hood and headlight rings' paint was oxidizing, so I put a coat of plasticoat on them. For those not familiar, it's a spray-on paint that easily peels off.

I have the original 7s and 6s Fuchs in good condition. I found a cool set of 911 spec fitment Ronals (8s and 7s) locally and purchased some new BFG Sport Comp 2 tires to go with them.

I knew going into this purchase that the fuel system would need attention. I removed the gas tank and had it cleaned. The fuel pump, fuel accumulator, and fuel filter were replaced. The injectors were professionally sonically cleaned. The fuel system as a whole was in great shape except for injector #5 which was initially completely clogged.

The engine was first turned over by hand after soaking the cylinders in MMO for a few days. It turned very easily, no friction. I performed a compression test on all cylinders and found the following:

#1= 180psi / #2= 170psi / #3= 173psi / #4=175psi / #5= 170psi / #6=173psi

The oil has been changed twice already as well as the gear oil. The brake lines have been bled and replaced with stainless steel units. No leaks.

I replaced the plug wires, distributor cap and rotor, spark plugs, air filter, air box straps, steering wheel bushing, battery (DieHard AGM), and alternator belt.

All of the work has been done by yours truly as I've worked as a mechanic in the past. The car runs excellently with a smooth idle and no hiccups. It revs freely up to its redline with no hesitation and shifts with no hint of grinding. No discernible smoke from the tail pipe. It appears to truly relish its time out of hibernation. I've already taken it on spirited drives up in the north GA mountains, and that says a lot for how comfortable I am with its reliability. After a long drive I'll park it in my garage and check for oil leaks the next morning, and not a drop has hit the ground which I'm frankly surprised about. I have two Sparco Sprint seats for the car now which are both in mint condition (passenger is out right now). The car has a clean title and is also registered here in GA. This car looks absolutely stunning. I did have plans for it as a lightweight street/DE/autox build and was going to tie up some ends such as a new carpet kit and patch the sunroof, but I'm not sure I truly want to go down this road. There are currently other things in my life that I'm wanting to spend my money on than Porsche ownership. But of course that thought changes every time I go visit her in the garage.

Please let me know a fair valuation for the car as it sits. Thank you guys.

[COLB]

As it sits, it is probably a $15k car, +/- a grand, depending on the state of the paint under that plasticoat.

It sounds like you have done a fair bit of reconditioning work, which is a positive. SCs in interesting colors are usually a significant value bump. Paint to sample Turquoise(?) may test that theory. Is the paint tag still on the car, showing the number?

Running, shifting, driving, and stopping -- with no rust -- and registered street legal is significant when valuing a project car. And this is still very much a project for someone.

I'm not an aftermarket wheel guy (on any car) -- but I agree the Ronals look nice, and fit the color scheme reasonably well. They add zero to the value of the car, though, and if you DO go to sell it, you should put the factory wheels back on, and sell the Ronals separately. Otherwise, you will basically be throwing them in for free on the deal. Selling off the Fuchs from the original car would be a sin.

It looks like the interior was brown. I dig brown interiors, but they are pretty hard to source second-hand. On the plus side, there is also a low demand for them, so perusing old classified ads might find some unsold pieces -- even if they are many months old.

You said the car is not for sale at the moment, and are concerned about putting money into it.

You need to think about what your true goals for this are. If you don't think you will keep it for the long term, I recommend you minimize any further customization, and browse the "for sale" classified to find the used parts to get the interior in a better state. A carpet set, new heater hoses (which should cost very little), and stock seats will go a LONG way toward increasing the value of the car. Core seats are readily available, and vinyl recovering is not that costly.

Even respraying the hood and light rings can be done relatively cheaply if you can source the correct paint, and do the prep yourself. You might take it to a detailer to see what they can do. This looks like metallic/clearcoat paint -- so the oxidation may respond to a polish if the clear is still intact.

Consider pulling the light rings, and installing H4s -- light ring problem solved.

I think $5k invested in cosmetics on this car will probably polish in another $10k of value.

With a decent interior, and painted hood, it could bring $25k easy.

[COLB]

BTW -- here are some ads worth checking out.

Here is an old carpet set that sounds like it might be available for the cost of shipping:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-used-parts-sale-wanted/861013-things-not-going-hershey.html

This guy is parting out an 80 Targa, and may have some things you could use.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-used-parts-sale-wanted/858700-fs-parting-out-1980-targa.html

Like these lights:



And some correct year seats for $400.

[NYNick]

I kinda like the car. If priced as Colb suggested, I'd be a buyer.

[Norm K]

If that color was indeed applied by the factory I think it does add some value to the car. If it runs as described and is truly rust free then I suspect the $15K number might be a bit low in today's market.

I'm curious about the statement wherein you note the odometer "does not seem to work". I would think it either works or it doesn't.

Where is this car?

[stratofortress]

COLB, I appreciate the thoroughness of your response. If I were to sell, I wouldn't mind throwing some parts back on, but I'm really not looking to spend more to get more, even if it is sound advice (which it is). I'd be looking for a quick and painless sale. I don't know if I could bear the time bringing it back to 100% stock just to sell it. That would be agonizing psychologically.

I tried to be as transparent as possible about the car. I really expected the worst out of it, but the car never fought me and runs like it never skipped a beat. From 1980-1986, the car lived in Texas, then here in Atlanta for the remainder, so it is indeed a rust free example.

The paint was in fact applied by the factory, and I verified that this is a color-to-sample by calling Porsche of North America (located right here in Atlanta) and having them pull up the certificate of authenticity. She said it was a code 99. The code in the for jamb reads 281 however, still not matching any offering by Porsche for any year or model. I told her this and she stayed that not all code 99 cars read 99 on the door, especially the older models.

My uncle told me the odo worked up until storage, so I'm thinking I may have accidentally disconnected something during my inspection and disassembly. All I recall doing is resetting the trip meter.

[stratofortress]

Here's a pic of the paint code

[Matt Monson]

I don't think that car would stay on the market more than a day at $15k. It's worth more than that, IMO.

[COLB]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

I don't think that car would stay on the market more than a day at $15k. It's worth more than that, IMO.

I think you an NYNick are correct, and I low-balled it a little. I think if it were red or black $15-16k would be about right -- but the Turquoise PTS is a wild card.

It is possible that you broke the odometer when you reset the trip counter -- this is especially easy to do if the car is moving when you do it. But it could be the connection. It is work checking.

Realize I am not talking about getting it back to 100% -- I'm just talking about putting in carpets and correct seats at a minimum, and remounting the rubber trim. Even used beige/cork -- which are pretty easy to source -- would be preferable to bare interior with a Sparco seat. What was the original interior color? Many of that year have the mixed brown/beige.

The paint would be the next step, but even if you don't do it I would pull the plasti-dip before advertising so prospective buyers see exactly what they are getting.

But as you said, there is a cost involved in anything you do to the car, from both the PITA factor and the dollar value of your time.

If you decide you just want it gone, you could:

- unload it fast at $15-16k

- ask for $20k and see what response you get; or

- aim really high and wait for the "right" buyer at $23-25k and source some interior bits while you wait for the dude willing to pay a premium for a paint to sample car.

It is easier to come down in price than go up.

[stratofortress]

The interior is chocolate, a dark brown. No beige at all. I do still have some carpet pieces I can throw back in and the outside trim would be cake.

As I'm not looking to unload it fast, I can wait for the right amount for the right buyer. Its a truly unique 911, I'm sure someone will recognize that in the marketplace.

I feel fulfilled in just breathing life into it. I've had some meaningful drives up in the north GA mountains where my uncle used to drive it. Him getting to see it run again was one of my goals in acquiring it. Ever since I sat in that car for the first time when I was 8 years old I always wondered what it was like in motion. It was everything I thought it would be.

Much thanks for the kind replies from everyone.

[COLB]

Originally Posted by stratofortress

The interior is chocolate, a dark brown. No beige at all. I do still have some carpet pieces I can throw back in and the outside trim would be cake.

As I'm not looking to unload it fast, I can wait for the right amount for the right buyer. Its a truly unique 911, I'm sure someone will recognize that in the marketplace.

I feel fulfilled in just breathing life into it. I've had some meaningful drives up in the north GA mountains where my uncle used to drive it. Him getting to see it run again was one of my goals in acquiring it. Ever since I sat in that car for the first time when I was 8 years old I always wondered what it was like in motion. It was everything I thought it would be.

Much thanks for the kind replies from everyone.

Careful. Doesn't sound like you really want to sell it.

Given the rarity of the color, and the family connection, it is a special car.

Best of luck. Hope it works out, whichever way you intend to go.

[techweenie]

I'd put it a bit over $20K in a fair transaction, but as suggested, $23-25 is a starting point for convo.

Remarkable color combo.

[Kevin911sc]

Spend $400 on a RS carpet kit its not that difficult to install...my car came in similar shape.
install a matching passenger seat, ask $24k and it will sell for $23 if not asking within a week.
If you get a leak down done and with the nice color...you could probably get a little more.

[Matt Monson]

Let a potential buyer get a leak down with PPI. I agree on the RS carpet thing though.

[NYNick]

There goes my $15k deal...

[stratofortress]

It appears as if the price is going up. So from $15k to $25k...that's a big spread. I do plan to put the matching passenger seat in and some black RS carpets, those are on my short list, as well as a valve adjustment.

COLB, you're right, I don't WANT to sell, it would just open more doors for me. There is a present fear that once I let it go, I would never be able to afford opening that door ever again. Air-cooled P-cars seem to be good investments these days, and maybe I'd be a fool to sell it off now seeing where the market is going.

Again, I'm not dead set on selling, this thread was made so I can get an idea of whether or not its value is worthy of the sacrifice. I still have much pondering to do.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by stratofortress

COLB, you're right, I don't WANT to sell, it would just open more doors for me. There is a present fear that once I let it go, I would never be able to afford opening that door ever again. Air-cooled P-cars seem to be good investments these days, and maybe I'd be a fool to sell it off now seeing where the market is going.

I think a lot of this answer depends on your age and where you are in your earning curve. You've already given us an idea of your age. If you are in a field where your salary could double or triple in the next 10 years as you get seniority and experience then a car like this may very much still be available to you later in life. If you have a job where you are really only seeing COL adjustments and not much room for advancement, this may be your time to keep the car, enjoy it for 5-10 years and then cash out when it worth even more.

[NYNick]

In all seriousness, if the $20-25K makes a big difference in your life today, and priorities prevail, of course the decision is easy.
But if the money is secondary, you clearly cannot sell this family memory. You'll never replace those, and the car, even if replaced sometime later, will never match up. With the market where it is, I personally think you're nuts to sell at all.

Only you can set the level of importance in your life, and I wish you the best.

Nick

[sm70911]

I remember on TG when Clarkson was talking about the Eagle Speedster, and he said "I yearn to have it" ... In a nutshell that's how I feel about your car. Its irrational but when I look at the color it affects me in the same peculiar way Jade Green cars affect me. My rationale disappears. I keep imagining it in my garage with a Chocolate brown interior and thinking hmm I love the Ronals but today I'm going to put on my satin classic pattern Fuchs. The mileage doesn't really worry me as much as the possibility / probability of Head studs. I found a cared for car, similar miles that had been in the south and needed them doing.

If I had the car I know I'd have trouble deciding if I would hot rod it and drive it while accumulating the parts to bring it back to stock. Or hide it and just devote my spare time to getting the interior and a few other little things sorted. GWOS Colb is right about the lights. Personally I wouldn't do the RS interior, right now its a blank canvas, and to me requires some thought and time.

I expect you are probably inundated with offers, I know if i had the garage space I'd be PMing you. Normally I'd say there is always another Porsche, but this time i think your feeling is correct ... First off you wont get a car with this family history and its very unlikely that you will find that color again. My 2c is its special so do everything in your power to keep it.

[COLB]

Check out these seats. No reserve on Ebay, out of Jersey.

Porsche 911 Leather Seats Fit 1978 1981 Brown No Reserve Pick Up Only | eBay



They would be perfect, and maybe you can get them cheap.

the dude says local pickup only, but if you contact him as a legit buyer, he might be flexible. Who knows -- maybe you are close enough to make abroad trip in the car.

Drive to jersey, bolt them in, drive home. And Bob is your mother's brother.