Salvage title

ncskier · 07:45 AM

I'm curious about how much a salvage title takes away from the value of a collector type car. I'd love to hear your opinions as to how it affects p-cars but also in general. I have a friend offering me a 2000 M-Coupe at slightly less than HALF (corrected) the price of a comparable non-salvaged car. Is that about right? Also, how will affect the value 15-20 years down the road? Will it be less of a black mark?

Matt Monson · 05-30-2015, 06:52 AM

The newer the car the more the hit. On a 2000? I would expect 10-15%, even for an M. It's not a rare or unique car.

On a 1967 911S that has been well repaired? Almost no hit.

What will the long term hit be on the BMW? Nobody knows. Really depends on if the car ever becomes truly collectible. They don't all become interesting to collectors.

2ndTARGA · 05-30-2015, 07:28 AM

Here's a good thread on this topic from earlier this year.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-marketplace-discussion/844985-effect-salvage-title-prices-skyrocket.html

Would love to hear more opinions on this as I'm in the market for another 911 and there are a number of them out there with salvage histories.

Thanks in advance.

ncskier · 05-30-2015, 07:43 AM

I'm sorry. In re-reading my post I left out a very important word. He's offering me the car at less than HALF of the value of a comparable non-salvaged car. And they are somewhat rare. Only about 2200 were imported to the U.S. in 1999-2000 (E36/8)

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2ndTARGA · 05-30-2015, 07:50 AM

Are you sure you're on the right forum? Pelican has plenty of good BMW groups.

Matt Monson · 05-30-2015, 08:37 AM

Um yeah...that one word changes things a lot. I'd buy that car if I wanted one and was sure the chassis is straight. But then I rarely worry about resale value. I buy because I want to drive the car. Future value be damned.

si Banker · si Banker's Garage

If you are never going to sell the car and you are 100% sure that it has been fixed correctly then maybe.

It is also important to know why it was totaled; has it gone swimming, aka submerged in fresh water or salt water. Most insurance companies will total a Porsche if it gets submerged. Was it stolen and stripped or was it totaled because of a crash. Also you may have trouble getting insurance and nobody will lend on it.

Once a car gets a "rebuilt" title you will not be able change back no matter what people tell you can be done. I know because I have been there.

puggi · puggi's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

What will the long term hit be on the BMW? Nobody knows. Really depends on if the car ever becomes truly collectible. They don't all become interesting to collectors.

The 'Clown Shoe' M Coupe is a collectable car and is definitely on my short list of cars I will someday own.

Buy the car and have fun with it. If you ever need to sell you'll probably even make some money on it.

2ndTARGA · 05-30-2015, 12:47 PM

+ 1 on knowing the reason for the salvage. Not like the seller of this nice looking 993 that just sold for just $29.1K. Only three bidders all week and one of those retracted. I feel for him/her but the "I don't know" statement couldn't have helped. Then again perhaps they made a profit.

Porsche 911 Carrera Coupe 2 Door | eBay

ncskier · 05-30-2015, 01:18 PM

Front right corner damaged in 2003. Frame not impacted. Thank you puggi, that's kinda what I've been looking for.

Also, I did pose the same question on the Bimmer Forums but they don't have a board for marketplace discussion and I am very curious about how salvage titles, in general, affect the value of collectors cars including Porsches as they are my first love and the primary focus of my search.

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2ndTARGA · 05-30-2015, 01:31 PM

Thanks for clarifying - and welcome to the forums. I certainly didn't mean for my earlier post to sound unfriendly - just wasn't sure you knew about the BMW section.

I've learned more than I cared to know about salvaged/rebuilt/washed titles in my recent searches. Amazing what goes on out there. But it sounds like the M Coupe is a good deal and I don't think it could be a bad decision if you can get it at half the going rate.

Matt Monson · 05-30-2015, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puggi

The 'Clown Shoe' M Coupe is a collectable car and is definitely on my short list of cars I will someday own.

Buy the car and have fun with it. If you ever need to sell you'll probably even make some money on it.

While I don't question that it is a great little car, IMO 15 years old is too young to deem any car collectible except maybe a super rare special edition. They only made 500 of my '99 2.5RS and it's market value has gone up 30-40% in the last coupe of years. But it sure isn't a collectible.

I completely agree with your 2nd statement, which I ultimately think matters more to the op's situation.

pnut_lee · 05-30-2015, 06:23 PM

The reason for a salvage title is pretty simple. It's repair cost vs actual value. Simple as that. When 964 cars were sub $20k in value, they totaled easily for minimal damage. Cost to repair exceeded replacement value. Those same cars today may likely be repaired and given a new life without a branded title. This whole Carfax generation is ridiculous. Title brand means nothing as long as repair was done correctly.

COLB · COLB's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by pnut_lee

The reason for a salvage title is pretty simple. It's repair cost vs actual value. Simple as that. When 964 cars were sub $20k in value, they totaled easily for minimal damage. Cost to repair exceeded replacement value. Those same cars today may likely be repaired and given a new life without a branded title. This whole Carfax generation is ridiculous. Title brand means nothing as long as repair was done correctly.

I get what you are saying, but don't blame the car fax generation -- a branded title has always meant something in terms of value.

ohenryinatlanta · 05-31-2015, 11:24 AM

why / how was it salvaged ? pics of damage before ?

my brother has a car with a salvage history. someone backed into it and damaged the passenger door / rocker area.

cars get salvaged out for various reasons and many are not because it was hit hard.

pnut_lee · 05-31-2015, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COLB

a branded title has always meant something in terms of value.

I'm blaming the ignorance that carfax thrives on. People don't understand the marketing ploy, very succssful by the way, that carfax has employed. Joe shmoe reads the carfax and sees a branded title and walks away, then Purchases a non branded title car and feels good about it. All the while not knowing that the car he bought may have been hit just as hard, but the numbers game at the body shop or the insurance company completely changed the dynamic of the situation. I've been driving salvage branded cars for the last 15 years. I've saved a boatload of money. I suppose the shady dealers knowingly selling damaged vehicles with poor repair history are the ones to blame........

Branded titles in a collector car market are generally not worth concerning yourself over. These cars are likely rebuilt to a higher standard, not to say you shouldn't be diligent with inspections. A lot of non branded cars have had serious rust repairs and more body panel replacements than some branded cars. There are also fewer states issuing titles for older vehicles, so branding a title is irrelevant.

Matt Monson · 05-31-2015, 05:23 PM

In a vintage car market where tin worm is everywhere and multiple body panels are often replaced during a restoration the car with the branded title may in fact have needed less metalwork to make right than many of the restorations we are seeing.

COLB · COLB's Garage

I understand your point, but don't really get the hate.

Carfax has issues. And perhaps there is too much attention paid to branded titles.

But personally, I'm a believer that more information is better. Prior to companies like Carfax or Autocheck, consumers had limited information on cars -- and got routinely taken advantage of by dealers/sellers who pawned of shoddy repairs, flood damage, etc with no disclosure.

I get caveat emptor -- and a person familiar with cars can usually figure out a car that has been in a major wreck or flood. 90% of the buying public isn't that savvy.

If you have the capability to know a good car from bad, you actually derive an advantage by the discount a salvage title gives.

pnut_lee · 05-31-2015, 06:14 PM

The hate comes from the marketing that clouds free thought and gives a false sense of security. "it has a clean title, it must ge good to go"..................

I wonder how many people buy a car with a clean carfax only to later find that simply plugging a VIN number into the computer is not due diligence.

si Banker · si Banker's Garage

I had the unfortunate bad luck to hit a donkey and it totaled my 87 Carrera. I was with State Farm and they were a ***** to deal with. Mu car was ;ow miles,52k long list of extras. We stetted for a check for $28K and I got to keep the car and my title.

I parted the car out and could have sold the tittle and the tub a number of times for for $3,500 which was rge hughest offer and if you pulled a car fax it showed ckear.

I did not want somebody to get screwed. I would not touch a salvage title. You should do your research