Convince me to buy a 944.

[rwilner]

I've been an air cooled guy up until now. 914, now a 911. Lots of wrenching on both..clutches, suspension rebuilds, even put a custom microsquirt fuel injection system on the 914 (yes, that was before I had 2 kids).

My dad always wanted a 944. I had a poster in my room of a 944 with our family name on it, given to my dad by the dealership when he put a deposit down on one. He backed out for reasons I still don't understand.

I've got a nice piece of property now and space for a 4th car. My plan was to get another 914 and built it into something special, maybe a 3.2 DE car, or a big four. But you can get a cream of the crop 944 for less than the cost of a big four kit...

I know nothing about the 944, nothing about the water cooled cars, except the usual...but the best one you can afford...look for maintenance records...get a PPI...change the timing belt and water pump...etc.

I think I'd only consider a later car, like an 87 944s, just based on improvements and power.

People that have had a 944 and an air cooled 911 or a 914...what did you think? Did you keep both? I searched...but what are the best threads out there abut 944 ownership? Are the fun to work on the way a 911 and a 914 are?

[Nick Triesch]

Hi. There is a reason that 924's, 944's don't cost very much. They were never thought of as a real Porsche and they were under powered. But they did handle well.

[thamlin000]

Sounds like you know the basics for finding a good 944 (ppi, belts, service history). A project car will put you in the hole really quickly.

When properly maintained, they are great cars. Go drive a few good ones and make sure that you will be happy with one. They are a different flavor from aircooled Porsches, which is a good and a bad thing depending on your perspective.

They drive and handle great. There is plenty of DIY support on pelican.

Personally, I prefer 83-86 since these can fit Fuchs. And 83s, with no power steering, are a bit lighter weight than later models. I also heard that the connecting rods were forged in 83 only. For the 8v na, the power went from 143 in 83 to 163 hp in 89. The S was 188 hp and the turbos were 217 and later 240 hp in the 88 turbo S and 89 turbo. 208 hp in the S2.

Turbos can be made really fast. But I'm still happy with my 83, even after owning a few 911 and 912 cars.

[rwilner]

Originally Posted by thamlin000

Sounds like you know the basics for finding a good 944 (ppi, belts, service history). A project car will put you in the hole really quickly.

When properly maintained, they are great cars. Go drive a few good ones and make sure that you will be happy with one. They are a different flavor from aircooled Porsches, which is a good and a bad thing depending on your perspective.

They drive and handle great. There is plenty of DIY support on pelican.

Personally, I prefer 83-86 since these can fit Fuchs. And 83s, with no power steering, are a bit lighter weight than later models. I also heard that the connecting rods were forged in 83 only. For the 8v na, the power went from 143 in 83 to 163 hp in 89. The S was 188 hp and the turbos were 217 and later 240 hp in the 88 turbo S and 89 turbo. 208 hp in the S2.

Turbos can be made really fast. But I'm still happy with my 83, even after owning a few 911 and 912 cars.

Thanks for that perspective.

What is it like to work on it? My 911 was a major project for a year and has been fluid changes ever since. Same for a 944 or am I taking the thing apart every year?

Obviously this depends on the level of deferred maintenance ... let's assume I buy a well maintained one to start.

[Racerbvd]

I own 911s, 914s and 944s, the 944 is a fun and functional car, I load it with Porsche parts, my BMX bikes and great for grabbing grub at the store. I use as a daily driver
Hauling model A wheels, tires and vintage gas pump parts.

BMX bike






Hauling Porsche parts.


Hauls a$$ and can even carry your track wheels to the track.

[thamlin000]

The 944 is more complex than a 911 and the engine bay is more cramped. The cooling system adds a layer of complexity. Thermostat fan switches fail periodically; this turns on the radiator fans. Its a cheap and easy fix though. The water pump should be replaced every second or third t-belt/roller change. Special Porsche tool is needed for belts. Motor mounts are a common failure. Clutch is a big job. The switches and minor electrical are another weak point. Window switches go out all the time; just pop out and replace, easy enough. Exterior door latches fail too. The engine and fuel injection have never problems for me. Tune ups are easy. The rear window hatch tends to separate from the frame and leaks occur here. Overall, the body is really solid and doors ping when you shut them. Only area that I know of that rusts badly is under the battery. These cars were all galvanized and rust doesn't seem to be much of a factor.

[Matt Monson]

I had a 924S (944 in a 924 skin) for 2 years. Only maintenance I did other than oil changes was to clean leaves out of the drain vents at the base of the windshield so the cockpit didn't flood.

[omnivore]

944 is the next gen collectible Porsche. My 85.5 is a 23k mile time capsule and is available.

[Alfasrule]

Sounds like the bad rap the ALFA 116's have. I got 5 of them.
Would love to try a 944 out!!
They seem to be a very good handling car? I totality love the way the 116's drive and handle.
Nothing else like it. The 50/50 weight is awesome, and I drive one in the WINTER DA Winta Beata
They have their quirks, but I believe it's how you drive these type of cars increases their reliability exponentially.
Electrical issues BS the cars are OLD, that's easy to repair. Well in an ALFA, don't know about the 944

[JackMan]

I have owned and tracked/raced both 1989 911, 1988 944 (both set up with DE suspension/brakes) and a full blown 1989 944S2 race car with aero for NASA GTS2.

Both car series have their good/bad.

944s are cheaper to maintain that a 911
944s handle better than a 911
911s have torque, 944s have little if any torque relative to the 911
944, 2.5 NA, properly set up will give a 1989 911 a run for its money on a track w lots of twisties

I love them both. I instruct and it's fun to watch 911 drivers' eyeballs popout when I take them for a spin in my 1989 944s2 race car. 944s are much more fun on the track than 911s. I drive a 944 on the track with the utmost fun and confidence. I drive the 911 on the track on the edge of fear with a big smile on my face.

Hands down the 911 has more fun factor on the street because of the torque, but I took my 1988 944 and slipped in a short ratio gear box and hello.....

The solution to 944 boredom on the street is short gears. Top speed of 120 and the engine wakes up quickly.

Now, none of the above is cheap. No Porsches are cheap. Each variant of Porsche hides its own demons that suck money, but the rewards are fantastic, espec if you can wrench yourself.

I steer away from the 2.7 liter models because the price diff between the 2.7 and 3.0 is minor.

Best car Porsche ever made was the 944S2 w MO30 option. With a short gear box, firm suspension, brake cooling and aero front/rear and you have a track beast that won't break the bank unless you drive it into a wall (rebuilt) or roll it a few times (rebuilt). The 944 is built like a tank and with a well constructed cage offers fantastic safety on the track.

[JackMan]

Oh, as for collectability its real simple. The 944 production numbers were crazy high, there are some 944/924 short production run series that are collectible, such as 924 turbo, race series cars like the 944 turbo cup or any super low mileage car like the beautiful 1985.5 944 shown above.

I define collectable as someone that wants to buy a car and then sell it in the near future and make a profit. I don't collect cars. I acquire them and drive the snot out of them.

[JackMan]

@Byron, love what you do with your 944. It is the ultimate hauler. I have watched a 944 driver show up at a swap meet with no rear hatch. Buy a ton of stuff including a gearbox, load it up and drive away. He just kept the windows cracked or down to keep the exhaust from coming back into the cockpit.

[manbridge 74]

I'd suggest an S. I believe the regular models aren't equipped with the beefier suspension and brakes.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by JackMan

@Byron, love what you do with your 944. It is the ultimate hauler. I have watched a 944 driver show up at a swap meet with no rear hatch. Buy a ton of stuff including a gearbox, load it up and drive away. He just kept the windows cracked or down to keep the exhaust from coming back into the cockpit.

Lots of people talk about what they can load, I load it. I wouldn't do this with my 88 911 or the matching numbers 914-6.

Best car Porsche ever made was the 944S2 w MO30 option. With a short gear box, firm suspension, brake cooling and aero front/rear and you have a track beast that won't break the bank unless you drive it into a wall (rebuilt) or roll it a few times (rebuilt). The 944 is built like a tank and with a well constructed cage offers fantastic safety on the track.

So true, and the HP & torque of the 3.0 is not shabby.
Our 85 is a ton of fun, but only because the full race susp (and the car is for sale, street legal too.

And yes, if you screw up and roll them, they hold up well, and can keep driving.
(The doctor who bought this car from us did this, not me..)

The rear window hatch tends to separate from the frame and leaks occur here.

A cheap, effective fix for that.


Well, I have been driving them since almost new, so I have a bit of experience with them (love my cheated 87S on track, but am building another 911 track car too)


Did I bring up that you can carry a lot of stuff..

And fun on track..

[Contadino]

I just don't like the bumpers on the standard 944's. IMO the S2 and turbo look so much better. An '89 turbo has a lot of power and has better suspension - feels like a more modern car.

Sent from my XT1058 using Tapatalk

[Milesaway]

I just bought a turbo and find it a refreshing change financially and mechanically from my 911's. A more modern comfy driving experience for a fraction of the cost.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Non-turbo 944s are pretty gutless (as SickNick mentioned), butt the 951/turbo variants are surprisingly powerful for a four popper (responds well to mods, too).

[OK-944]

For the great twisty roads here in Vermont - I think my 85.5 944 NA is about perfect. Why is this? Well, for one, with a non-turbo combined with a circular throttle cam…my throttle response is basically instant. Turbo lag does not, IMHO, combine well with curvy roads, especially when loose gravel is also present. I want a throttle which is instantly responsive, predictable, and which offers good “off-on” symmetry. True - 150 horses ain’t exactly huge…but these horses play out well, and feel about right from an engine-braking perspective - meaning that the car truly behaves when I want/need it to (no suddenly skating rear), and does otherwise with a just a bit of extra work. Finally - if…in the middle of a blind curve, I find myself suddenly face to face with a moose (happens up here), I can stomp on the brakes without going ass-backwards!

I purchased this 85.5 nine years ago for 2500.00. I then dropped and resealed the engine (everything), rebuilt the PS rack and pump, rebuilt the brakes, rebuilt the ball joints, rehabbed gauge cluster, replaced waterpump/t-stat/temp switch/belts/rollers, replaced sway bar bushings, replaced fuel strainer, filter, and adjacent fuel lines, replaced front wiper motor, replaced all coolant hoses, replaced expansion tank, replaced some vacuum hoses, replaced old, dry Michelins with Kumhos. Did all of this for about (another) 2500.00. Oh…and I cleaned/recoated all ground points (very important!). Also - I designed/built/installed a padded dog-shelf to cover the rear seats, which still allows the rear seats to fold forward.

The car came to me chipped, and the only “performance” mod I performed was to install a circular throttle cam…a five-minute procedure and absolutely worth the 40 bucks.

Was any of this rocket science? No. In fact, all has been extremely satisfying, although some patience is needed for accessing some tightly/awkwardly placed components. All has become easier with the recent purchase of a low-rise “EZ-Car-Lift” (brilliant design, offers great access to everything, great portability/storage, and inherently safe - I highly recommend this lift!).

FWIW - I borrowed a tension-tool to check/adjust timing/balance belts the first time, and since then have done this by hand (without “the tool”) and feel completely confident about this.

Am I done? No. I still want to address issues with the heater/ac blower motor, parking brake, sunroof, windshield washer, hatch window wiper, and passenger-side mirror switch/motor. Possibly also get the AC working - but this is really not important to me here in Vermont.

In the meantime…this car continues to be an extremely reliable as a three-season near-daily driver, is a total kick to drive, is actually practical due to its large hatch/trunk capacity, and has never left me stranded.

No maintenance has been required for the past three years other than replacing engine oil and filter, plus tranny fluid flush/refill. Yearly running costs - insurance/registration/inspection/oil and filter, (not counting fuel and actual fixes) remain at less than one dollar per day.

So yes…I absolutely recommend that you consider a 944 - but by all means, either look at a known-good example, or at least come into this with some understanding of just what a well-adjusted/maintained example is truly capable of. Also know that the turbo versions, depending on what you truly need/want, aren't necessarily the better choice.

[rwilner]

Ok-944 that is perfect feedback. Thanks.

I hope the parts cost you mention is pretty consistent with the parts cost today! That's certainly not true for my 911. I spent 2500 on suspension parts just to get it refreshed to stock like performance.

[JackMan]

ok guys here's the secret to waking up the passion in your NA 944, get short gears or a 4:11 r/p. Trust me, it's a game changer. The 89 944s2 has the stock box, short fifth and the 4:11 r/p, you get it from the Audi 5000 gearbox and some other Audi's. The 88 NA has a Albin short gears in the box with a top speed of 125.

Both engines are stock except for intake, and on the Race car there are other goodies that make it expensive to build.

My lesson here is put 15 inch wheels on a NA 944 with a 4:11 r/p and away you go - gear effect is a wonderful thing.