Good time to grab a 993?

[Kansas]

With SCs, 3.2s hitting the stratosphere right now, and even the middies starting to climb, seems like now would be a great time to get into a 993. They seem to have hit their peak back in 2014-2016, dipped a little bit, and now have kind of plateaued. At least that's what Hagerty valuations is indicating. Any thoughts?

[specialtyoneinc]

What 993 are you looking for? Same story across the board on aircooled 911 models these days. The good ones are getting more difficult to find and values vary immensely dependent on condition, options etc...

[Kansas]

I'm looking for a manual coupe. I'm doing a PPI on one this week that I can have for $45K. Only drawback is that it has 115K miles.

[SalParadise]

Originally Posted by Kansas

With SCs, 3.2s hitting the stratosphere right now, and even the middies starting to climb, seems like now would be a great time to get into a 993. They seem to have hit their peak back in 2014-2016, dipped a little bit, and now have kind of plateaued. At least that's what Hagerty valuations is indicating. Any thoughts?

Middies starting to climb? Where have you been? They've been climbing for 6 years.

I don't believe that SCs and 3.2s are in the "stratosphere" right now - especially when you are considering a $45K 993. You can get a decent SC or 3.2 for this price.

[davewadd]

For $45k, I'd get a good Carerra or SC instead of a 993. All day long..... But that's me.

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Kansas

I'm looking for a manual coupe. I'm doing a PPI on one this week that I can have for $45K. Only drawback is that it has 115K miles.

This is the difference from an SC or 3.2. With 115k miles, you wouldn't (or shouldn't) be paying $45K (well maybe for the 3.2). The 993 is the last air cooled, but at that mileage I'd be just as careful as I would with the others. Price isn't bad for that model. What year?

[Matt Monson]

You can get a nicer 3.2 for $45k than a 993, generally speaking.

[Kansas]

Originally Posted by NYNick

This is the difference from an SC or 3.2. With 115k miles, you wouldn't (or shouldn't) be paying $45K (well maybe for the 3.2). The 993 is the last air cooled, but at that mileage I'd be just as careful as I would with the others. Price isn't bad for that model. What year?

It's a '95, and since we don't have smog emission stuff here in Kansas, I thought a 95' would be good. I just thought that if I'm going to be paying upwards of 45K for a 3.2 or SC, might as well get a 993. I personally like the styling much better(but that of course is just my opinion) and I think they will always be the more sought after. Finally, they are the most evolved of the air-cooled cars.

The 3.2s and SCs are currently going for more than they EVER have in their history, and I'm just not sure about buying something at its historical peak. I have talked to several good sources (two of the most prominent Porsche air-cooled mechanics in California and another long time air-cooled Porsche dealer) who really believe that there is a market correction coming soon on them. Whereas the 993s already hit their peak a few years ago, so I thought it a good time to look at them.

[NYNick]

993's should be more expensive than 3.2's, 3.2's more than SC's, SC's more expensive than middies, and then we run into longhoods...all things being equal, which they never are

Make sure your car is extensively checked out. Make sure. A 993 manual C2 coupe is a desirable car, at least to me. The mileage and maintenance are the keys to your purchase. I don't care what model you're buying. At 115K miles, I want the best verification and assurances I can muster. Could be great, or not.

Good luck. A 95 manual C2 coupe? Yummy.

[Matt Monson]

C4s.

[Kansas]

Originally Posted by NYNick

993's should be more expensive than 3.2's, 3.2's more than SC's, SC's more expensive than middies, and then we run into longhoods...all things being equal, which they never are

Make sure your car is extensively checked out. Make sure. A 993 manual C2 coupe is a desirable car, at least to me. The mileage and maintenance are the keys to your purchase. I don't care what model you're buying. At 115K miles, I want the best verification and assurances I can muster. Could be great, or not.

Good luck. A 95 manual C2 coupe? Yummy.

Absolutely going to be doing a thorough PPI. I'm an out of state buyer so I have to do my due diligence. You're right, it could be a total dud, but based on what I'm seeing, it's worth checking out on a PPI. Thanks for the encouragement. I appreciate that.

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

C4s.

Huh? He never says c4s.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[Kansas]

Originally Posted by NYNick

Huh? He never says c4s.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Couldn't afford a c4 anyways

[specialtyoneinc]

Originally Posted by Kansas

I'm looking for a manual coupe. I'm doing a PPI on one this week that I can have for $45K. Only drawback is that it has 115K miles.

Sounds like a fair price if the PPI is clear of any major issues. I foresee values holding pretty steady in the near future on driver condition 993s coupe/6spds. The low mileage C2S and C4S are fetching good money and should continue to do so also. Especially the 1998s.

[mattC2993]

Its always nice to find a 993 that has had money spent on it. The gearing isn't great, the suspension didn't last and came from the factory at SUV height and of course valve guides can be a problem. I spent a bundle upgrading mine and then sold it

[Macroni]

Not in price range but very cool.....


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/993700-97-993-rs-tribute.html

[matt930s]

Best of both worlds?

https://charleston.craigslist.org/cto/d/1986-porsche-911-conv/6534888051.html

[SalParadise]

Originally Posted by Kansas

The 3.2s and SCs are currently going for more than they EVER have in their history, and I'm just not sure about buying something at its historical peak. I have talked to several good sources (two of the most prominent Porsche air-cooled mechanics in California and another long time air-cooled Porsche dealer) who really believe that there is a market correction coming soon on them.

Except when they were new.

Market correction? An '89 Carrera 3.2 was $52k new. Now, almost thirty years later you can get the same car for the same price. Many people appreciate them, and many people (me included) believe that $50K for a nice 3.2 in 2018 is very good bargain.

Aircooled 911s are actually not that high - compared to other things. A 2018 Audi R8 is $170K, a new 2018 911 is $95K plus.

What people fail to see when they say these things is that an aircooled 911 Gbody is no longer a used car - it is a hobbyist, enthusiast collector car.

You ever drive a 993 vs. a 964 vs G-body 911? The 993 is heavy. It's incredibly refined and lacks a personality.

I don't see a market correction. There just aren't enough clean cars on the market at any one time. How many lowly '74 or '75 911 Coupes or Targas are on sale in the world in any given week. 20? 30? I don't think it's even that high.

There will always be buyers at the current prices - and the cars were undervalued for so long that people just got used to it.

[Kansas]

Originally Posted by SalParadise

Except when they were new.

Market correction? An '89 Carrera 3.2 was $52k new. Now, almost thirty years later you can get the same car for the same price. Many people appreciate them, and many people (me included) believe that $50K for a nice 3.2 in 2018 is very good bargain.

Aircooled 911s are actually not that high - compared to other things. A 2018 Audi R8 is $170K, a new 2018 911 is $95K plus.

What people fail to see when they say these things is that an aircooled 911 Gbody is no longer a used car - it is a hobbyist, enthusiast collector car.

You ever drive a 993 vs. a 964 vs G-body 911? The 993 is heavy. It's incredibly refined and lacks a personality.

I don't see a market correction. There just aren't enough clean cars on the market at any one time. How many lowly '74 or '75 911 Coupes or Targas are on sale in the world in any given week. 20? 30? I don't think it's even that high.

There will always be buyers at the current prices - and the cars were undervalued for so long that people just got used to it.

I don't entirely disagree with you. I don't think prices are necessarily going to take a dive, but I do think they may soften a bit over the next year or two compared to now. I have owned a 964 and a 997, and driven 993s and 3.2s. The 993s and 964s are more insulated from the road and less raw than the 3.2s, but nothing like a 997.

And as far as there not being enough clean cars on the road, well, that's just the thing. Even $45K SCs and 3.2s seem to have one issue or another that will require several grand in sorting. I think it's getting to the point of driving a lot of people away from the hobby as they are becoming unaffordable. I bought my 964 back in 2011 for $18K and doubled my money on it just a few years later. Most anyone can afford an 18K car, but 40K?. That eliminates quite a number of people, thus driving demand down. Furthermore, the European market is not nearly as strong due to a weaker euro. A dealer confirmed that he has taken massive losses on late 70s turbos because of the declining European demand. Every other collectible car has gone through the same trend. Why would porches be exempt?

[thamlin000]

Originally Posted by SalParadise

Except when they were new.


You ever drive a 993 vs. a 964 vs G-body 911? The 993 is heavy. It's incredibly refined and lacks a personality.

I don't see a market correction. There just aren't enough clean cars on the market at any one time. How many lowly '74 or '75 911 Coupes or Targas are on sale in the world in any given week. 20? 30? I don't think it's even that high.

There will always be buyers at the current prices - and the cars were undervalued for so long that people just got used to it.

Agreed on these points.

As the former owner of a 95 993 couple C2, which I sold for $21k back on 08, I can say that the next time I buy a 993, it will be as a fun commuter car. The 993 is so comfortable with a great ac, power steering and smooth shifting. It's really easy to drive and live with. I drove mine across country a few times and really enjoyed it. Fast forward to now, I have a lightly modified 77 coupe. It is raw, stiff, uncomfortable and no ac. It is complete fun but not something I'd like to drive across the country. But even with the 2.7, it's much more fun to drive than my 993 was.

Since I only put on less than 1k miles per year, I'd rather have a torsion bar 911. If I was doing 15k miles per year, I'd get a 993.