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Jeff NJ's Avatar
 
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B&B muffler install issue

So I got a used B&B muffler from a member here recently and went to install it tonight after I got some gaskets. Everything came off relatively smooth. When I went to dry fit the muffler, I can't seem to get the flange that mounts to the turbo to mate flush with the turbo flange. (stock turbo for now, didn't take it off today either). The top right side of the muffler hits some sort of flange that stops me from getting a flush fit. (see red arrow in pics below) There is a larger gap in the top rear where the gasket goes. (See yellow arrow in pics below). I really don't want to cut the metal above the top right of the muffler where the red arrow is, but I don't see how I can get this to mount flush without either cutting above the muffler, bending the muffler tube, or somehow repositioning the turbo. None of these are things I want to do. Am I missing something? Thanks in advance!



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Old 06-23-2014, 07:36 PM
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Is this the dual out B&B? I have it on my car with B&B headers and stock turbo, I can pop out the garage and take a gander if you want.
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Old 06-23-2014, 08:21 PM
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It's the single out one, but I believe the muffler is the same for both as far as I can tell from the B&B site pics.
I have stock turbo and headers, the mounting bracket for the turbo looks original, so I figured this should bolt right on...

Can you see how close the top right of the muffler is to the metal flange I pointed out with the red arrow on your car? That would be so helpful!
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Old 06-23-2014, 08:30 PM
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I have installed 2 B&B mufflers on 2 different 930's and have not had any clearance issues. Maybe the PO some how bent the front pipe in the past. I don't think you should have to modify anything for the muffler to fit. Is your turbo in the proper position? Is the support bracket for the turbo installed correctly?
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Old 06-24-2014, 03:03 AM
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I ran a B&B on my car for 7 years and took it on and off the car several times, it is a fairly tight fit but no interference with the body.
Stock:


B&B:
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Old 06-24-2014, 03:45 AM
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I had to knotch that location on my '77 turbo when I ran my B&B muffler. I have aftermarket headers which may have contributed to the problem. At that time was running a K27-7006 with the exhaust flange cut down 10MM to help retain the stock location.
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Old 06-24-2014, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike80911 View Post
I have installed 2 B&B mufflers on 2 different 930's and have not had any clearance issues. Maybe the PO some how bent the front pipe in the past. I don't think you should have to modify anything for the muffler to fit. Is your turbo in the proper position? Is the support bracket for the turbo installed correctly?
This is what I was looking into last night in the wee hours of the morning. It all looks original, unbent and unmolested. I loosened the support bracket for the turbo and the two bottom bolt holes are over-sized so there is some adjustment possible for the mount bracket, but the top one has a very tight tolerance and no adjustment is possible. So I left the top bolt out, angled the turbo outlet down a little bit and installed the muffler and then tightened the bottom mount bracket bolts. I was able to get it installed and seal the turbo to the muffler, but the muffler is hard up against that frame flange that I originally pointed out with the red arrow.

I plan on replacing the headers and turbo this fall and I am fairly sure I can make it all fit then, but what do we think about leaving the top bracket bolt off and having the muffler hit that flange for a few months?
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Old 06-24-2014, 07:36 AM
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I will take a look at mine when I get home tonight for you as well.
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Old 06-24-2014, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dap930 View Post
I had to knotch that location on my '77 turbo when I ran my B&B muffler. I have aftermarket headers which may have contributed to the problem. At that time was running a K27-7006 with the exhaust flange cut down 10MM to help retain the stock location.
Same here. I also had a 7006 on there then and still do for the moment.
B&B most likely designed their 930 mufflers on a car with the stock 3ldz turbo mounted on it and the 7006 has a bigger diameter and wider turbine housing than the 3ldz so that moves the muffler over to the right more.
Old 06-24-2014, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JFairman View Post
Same here. I also had a 7006 on there then and still do for the moment.
B&B most likely designed their 930 mufflers on a car with the stock 3ldz turbo mounted on it and the 7006 has a bigger diameter and wider turbine housing than the 3ldz so that moves the muffler over to the right more.
So when I install your old HFS turbo this fall, it will move the muffler more to the right and make my problem worse? Bummer.

Is it a big deal to notch out that flange where the muffler hits? How much clearance do I want there?
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Old 06-24-2014, 08:47 AM
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That I don't know. Also the headers you have control the exact position the turbo is in when it's mounted and that has a lot to do with it. I don't know what headers you're using and every set of them may be a little different especially if they are bought second hand because you never know if they were on a car during an accident and got bent a little.
The K27 HFS uses the smaller K27 7200 turbine housing and turbine wheel, not the larger K27 7006. The 7006 and 7200 use the same bearing housing but everything else is different.
I had to notch that spot for the K27 7006 I have on the car now.
The HFS uses the smaller K27 7200 exhaust turbine housing and wheel so it spools up faster than a K27 7006 and it has less turbo lag because of that.

Last edited by JFairman; 06-24-2014 at 09:05 AM..
Old 06-24-2014, 09:02 AM
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It is the original exhaust right now, but I plan on upgrading them when I install the turbo. I don't actually own them yet, however, so I don't know what it will be (Rarlyl8, B&B, etc). Since good headers rarely come up for sale, I am thinking I will likely be buying new ones.
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Old 06-24-2014, 09:47 AM
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A couple more things you can do to get more clearance.
The B&B mufflers I've seen have a flange that sticks out beyond the ends of the muffler about a half inch and you can hammer that top edge down about 45 degrees to make some clearance there.
The other thing you can do is remove both gaskets. You don't need them.
If the B&B muffler flange is flat like they are when new you can install the muffler with high temp red silicone sealant on the flange where it mounts to the turbo. Put some on the support bracket that gets sandwiched in between the muffler flange and turbo too. It won't leak if the surfaces are flat.

Doing that will move the muffler to the left about 3/16". Removing the original turbo support bracket thats sandwiched in there and installing another one that supports from the back turbo mounting bolt up to the top left engine cradle mount bolt will move the muffler a little more to the left.
Old 06-24-2014, 10:49 AM
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Great suggestions Jim. I will be working on it again tonight!
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Old 06-24-2014, 11:20 AM
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Or clip the corner of the muffler, re-weld it.
Cut the muffler, not the car.
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Old 06-24-2014, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboKraft View Post
Or clip the corner of the muffler, re-weld it.
Cut the muffler, not the car.
Best solution so far...
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:32 PM
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Or clip the corner of the muffler, re-weld it.
Cut the muffler, not the car.
Exactly.

Make the parts fit the car....not....
the car fit the parts!
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:51 PM
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Or use a BFH to the muffler!

Cheapest, fastest, and easily make whatever clearance you want.
Old 06-24-2014, 06:10 PM
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So ends day two of my muffler install. I didn't start tonight until 10:30 because I had a softball game after work. After a little more tweaking of the turbo bracket and following Jim's advice to bend the flange of the muffler, I got it to mount up without touching the frame. I have a legit eighth inch clearance! (Tippy - I used a LFH. I'm not a barbarian! ). Almost done putting it together. I had to fabricate a muffler strap bracket, since the stock one was not even close to usable. Made it out of aluminum L bracket. Kinda proud how it came out. See pics below.
Thanks for all the help.

I did start it and it sounds great!

Eighth inch clearance:


custom strap bracket:



Almost done:

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Old 06-24-2014, 10:08 PM
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Good job! a hammer and a pry bar come in handy at times.

I can't tell from your picture if you put the two gaskets back in but you'll gain some more clearance without them if you ever need it and as long as the thick muffler mounting flange is still flat which it probably is it won't leak with a little high temp red silicone smeared on the mounting surface.
Our cars are the same color, venetian blue. What color is your interior?
Old 06-25-2014, 05:13 AM
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