Pelican Parts Forums - 911 SC Engine Removal

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- - 911 SC Engine Removal (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/1017315-911-sc-engine-removal.html)

yes, good point, I can't imagine trying to realign the engine to the transmission while under the car. New day tomorrow and will see if I can get engine out and if not will borrow a friends transmission jack and remove both simoultaneously. Either way I agree, the engine and transmission are going back in as one unit. Thanks :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by subseamark (Post 10306627)

Thanks Tony, but since I maybe ignorantly went for choice b and am now fairly far down that path, any words of wisdom from your emails and personal interviews? Should I see if I can put engine back in transmission re-bolt and drop both?

Hi Mark, I have just yesterday finished removing the engine (so leaving the trans on the car) from my 1979 SC. It was my first time too and I recognize the situation you're in :-)
The two critical components (in my case) were the vent on the back of the engine (hits the rear bumper of car) and the top right bolt that connects engine to trans (that's the largest bolt as it also connects starter engine)

What we did is simply to carefully lower the engine further (indeed, the trans gets pulled down a bit as well) and move it backwards further until all bolts were free. Needless to say you need sufficient clearance (mine was on a bridge)

Again, pay attention to the top right bolt while doing so. Good luck!

Quote:

Originally Posted by boyt911sc (Post 10306620)

Subseamark,

There is a good reason why dropping the engine and transmission together makes more sense. Unless you are an experienced mechanic with the right set up, removing the engine alone is not as easy as think for 911 engines. And because of this controversial procedure, I contacted more than 50 Diyer’s, Porsche mechanics, shop owners, and engine rebuilders across the country and a few from overseas to find out their preferred procedures or methods.

The question was “ I have an SC with 915 manual transmission and like to do a clutch job so what is your preferred method?”.
a). Remove the engine and transmission as a tandem. Or
b). Remove the engine separately and leave the transmission in the car.

Everyone recommended “a” except for one who claimed to do both “a” and “b”. There were 3 known individuals well known in this forum who advocated “b” method. So in my spare time, I contacted some via emails and drove hundreds of miles to personally interviewed some of these participants in my survey.

Tony

+1. By far the esiest way to pull the engine - and get it back in!

Quote:

Originally Posted by subseamark (Post 10306402)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1546728672.jpg

Pic shows it's misaligned.

Fix that and it should ease out nice and easy like a knife thru butter.

Pmax,
I’ve been adjusting the engine and transmission and everything freely moves, just not far enough back to clear bolts. Fan is flush against back of engine compartment with no room to clear bolts.

Makes me wonder if longer spec studs were put in at some point. Only need about 1/4-1/2”

^^^
Need to get to this as per Wayne's book. Hard to tell from the photo angle in your second pic but the fan shroud looks high, a pic from the side will show the crossmember clearance better. Wayne used a 3.0 so it should be identical for your car ... if I recall, the clearance was an inch or so during the separation. I assume you have the shift coupler disconnected.

Your engine looks original so I highly doubt the studs are non-standard. When you get it out, can you do me a favor and take pics all around ? I have an 80 as well but would like to have close up pics of the original setup. Thanks !

https://www.pelicanparts.com/techart...set1/pic19.JPG

Got it! Main issue was to keep jacking rear end as Steve suggested to help gain fan clearance. Plus some patience which I lack at times. Thanks for all the suggestions now the real fun starts. Broken head stud:(http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1546817894.jpg

congrads, very cool accomplishment

-I have same issue with broken head studs, I have my engine totally broken down now, fun project, exercise patience and post questions here and you will have an enjoyable time

oh and life is so much easier with an engine stand

Nicely done.

More pics please !

I am out of town until weekend and will post some more pics when I return. Anything in particular you are looking for?

Just pics of the routing at the back of the engine and on the two sides will do. Thanks.

That's a mighty clean engine!

Having pictures of everything looks like a great idea for a first time disassembly.

Having removed engines both with and without the transmission attached, my take is that when time is critical (like getting an engine ready for a race), and you have the experience, pulling just the engine is the way to go - the main time and PITA saver is the CV joints. Lining up the transmission to chassis bolt holes can also be a pain, and leads to cross threading if you are rushed.

But in my case this is for a race motor where lots of little things have been done to make unplugging the engine easier and quicker, and the rear valance is Dzused on. I even cut out the center of the rearmost cross member so the fan housing will fit through, with the center then bolted back into place. Plenty of room to get the engine in and up or down and out, clearing the studs for connecting to the transmission. Shops go one better so that the whole cross member unbolts, and the engine comes out straight backward all the way.

For me, the major problem is with getting the throwout fork right on the TOB on reinstallation. With just an engine reinstall, sometimes I get things right off the bat, and by feel. Other times it takes numerous trials.

With everything on the garage floor you have a pretty good view - a great one if you leave the starter off - as you mate the engine and transmission. Nowadays, borescopes adequate for the purpose are cheap, and help to get this right first try.

If you have a lift, I imagine pulling both together is an easy decision - stand up to deal with CVs, the ability to use various cradles or articulated attachments to deal with the angled part, and none of the tricky balancing a guy like me faces lying under his car doing this alone, whether just the engine or both.

Pulling both deals with the need to prop up the transmission. On my car with solid mounts, I had a way of using a piece of chain to hold the transmission. Then, by accident, I found that the mounts alone would hold it! Either way, you can push the car around. With the transmission out you need to find a way to hold the axles up (unless you removed those, too) if you want to move the car.

Two years ago I pulled just the engine to replace a broken head stud so I could make a race. Because of the particular stud, I thought I had a chance of getting the broken part out without taking the head off. I think it was the lower right #1. A little grinding on some non-essential aluminum allowed me to weld a tube over the broken part and extract it, though not without a fight. Got it all back together and to the event in time.

But the usual DIY one reads about here doesn't fit that paradigm. I think it is good for anyone who aspires to DIY to know you can pull just the engine if you see a reason to do it that way. But to understand that pulling both, as the factory manual says to do, is usually best.

In this case, with the engine already out, simple to pull the transmission when it is time to put the engine back in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by subseamark (Post 10322885)

Pmax,
Apologies for taking so long to post. hopefully these are still helpful

Thanks, that's one clean engine.

If I may, a close up pic of the wiring tangle behind the 2 hoses in the red oval would be great, it's good to know what the "factory routing" of the CIS lines is. I was also wondering if the tie in the green oval is factory....

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1548289717.jpg

That breather hose looks like it performs better than the soon soggy factory hose.

PMax,
Apologies I haven't been keeping up with the forum. Look at these two pics and let me know if they help. If not I can pull the oil hoses to side and take some more - the CIF is off now but in one piece. The tie is not factory it is just a regular tie wrap that must have been put there previously.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1549679164.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1549679164.jpg

Thanks !

I'm good.

Just noticed the decel valve , lower "flying saucer" shaped gizmo, should have a plug on the nipple. It's a common mod.