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Help, advises needed
This is my SC (RS 3.0 look, track used)
We have opened the engine, two parts broken, One piston and one "hammer" (dont know the english name). There are the pictures. Any suggestion is welcome ! Target: reliability and power. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheMVC-001S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheeMVC-002S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheMVC-003S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheeMVC-004S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheeMVC-005S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/pheMVC-006S.JPG |
Looks like one "piston" and one "rocker arm" (hammer) are toast (broken).
Rebuild time. |
Yep, but what do I put?
phe |
Dismantle and inspect everything, and rebuild as required.
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Doug,
I am in the middle of the rebuild. :D Planned: chain tensionner kit reinforced clutch close ratio gearbox and LSD race seats segments (now I have to think again) :mad: Already have SSI, bilstein, torsion 19/29,C2 4 pistons brakes,...... :p This is a 204hp engine, I can rebuild with the same cylindre/piston (high compression), but maybe there are other possibilities... phe |
Phe,
I never learned Dutch or Flemmish, but my French is OK. I lived in Namur for some years. You can send me a private mail if you need some information but your English is very good. I would suggest purchasing the re-build book, 101 projects, and Bentley at a minimum. Measure everything. If it is out of spec, replace it. I would seperate the halves and make sure there are no metal particles floating in the motor. What kind of head studs are on the motor right now? Should those also be replaced? I would look into doing the valve springs, guides, etc. Your top photo is the rocker arm. I would have the valve on that cylinder inspected and pay attention to the piston. Best of luck! |
David,
This is fun I live in Ciney(Namur/Belgium) ! I forget to mention that, but valves guides and springs were already planned, I have got the wayne's books and the Bentley;). My tentation is to go for a 3l2 pistons/cylindres for the SC:D. Another option is the 3.3 RSR:rolleyes: (less interesting I guess). The wise solution is to rebuild with the same spec:) . I have 1 or 2 days to think about that and any comment is welcome. phe |
I just bought the Mahle kit for building a 3.2 out of a 3.0 (short stroke 3.2). It's not cheap (about $3600 retail), but it is definitely the way to go for more HP. I'm ditching the CIS and putting carbs or and engine management system on there...
-Wayne |
Mahle 3.2 kit is on the way.
Swap the CIS,good idea but here good carb are not easy to find. Still searching for a solution :confused: But actually with the $/€ conversion, it could be a good deal to order from US. I will try to get info from PMO ;) phe |
We resell the PMO setups, what do you want to know?
-Wayne |
First do I put 40 or 46 ?
Does it really worth the $$$ ? I always wanted seach a setting, as my bill will be already huge why not put everything. :D I know I will not resist to that. What about transatlantic support from PMO ?? phe |
They are pretty good - all you need to do is bolt them on - they will be set from the factory to your car. Follow the tuning procedures in 101 Projects, and you will be set...
You can run either 40s or 46s. I'm going to run 40s on my short-stroke 3.2, primarily because I have a set onhand... -Wayne |
Can I still use my SC fuel pump without problem with the 46 carb?
phe |
Phe,
The best way is a newer higher volume lower pressure fuel pump. You will also need a regulator to manage pressure to the carbs. The carbs use about 3-4psi of fuel pressure whereas the CIS uses much more (30-70?). If you use a tank return line before the pressure regulator I guess you could use the CIS fuel pump... |
I have found the pieces of my piston:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/mvc-021S.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...eeMVC-022S.jpg |
Some of the new material :
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...eeMVC-001S.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...eeMVC-009S.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...eeMVC-012S.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...eeMVC-007S.JPG PMO 46 are on the way from US. I cant wait anymore ...... Phe |
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Forget to say an ENORMOUS thank to the garage. They takes a lot of time in explanations, pictures,.....
I would recommend it (private mail) to anybody in France, I am very satisfied by the service (until now:p :p :p ) phe |
That wouldn't be an open drail and a gallon of parts cleaner, would it?
-Wayne |
Great pictures..
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What happened? Looks like moderate overrev? Why not go for EFI? ... carbs are hard to tune.
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beepbeep,
Overrev??, as everybody is telling me that, I guess it is. I am driving at high rpm from time to time, but I do not remember any overrev. EFI was the reason choice, but I always wanted carbs I am building my dream car which will not be the reference 911 3.0, but simply the one I wanted. I hope that new carbs will not create to much problem (My dream will comes true in a few days.... 10-9-8-..) Philippe |
Looks good!
-Wayne |
Carbs are NOT hard to tune. It takes about 1/2 hour max and is very straight forward ( as long as the engine, carbs, and linkage are in good condition). They will stay tuned for a very very long time.
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Jack,
God bless you and your words....;) phe |
Swapping the CIS for Carbs opens up a whole new realm of tuning possibilities for improving the HP. I'd take a look at some cams with more duration and overlap like an early S or a GE60 grind, neither of which will work with CIS, but work great with carbs. You may need to open your intake ports up to about 38 or 39 mm's if they are not that large already. The result will be an engine which will generate peak torque at around 4500 RPM and generates peak HP at about 6500 RPM and will rev to 7000 - 7500 RPM. Just make sure that your engine builder is aware of your intended rev range since he may recommend some additional modifications to support those sorts of engine speeds.
If you really want to go all out you can go for "Full Race" cams like the 906, RSR or GE80, but then you're talking about rebuilding the engine as an 8000+ RPM engine which is a whole new can of worms. |
Ok not really engine, but parts are arriving...
8 days to wait.... http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...o-MVC-001F.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...o-MVC-002F.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...o-MVC-007F.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...o-MVC-008F.JPG |
Quote:
So even if it might be easy to "tune" them in such sense that you fiddle them to make car run (w/o belching black smoke) they have nothing to do in modern high performance engines. EFI can and should be mapped for all loads and revs and will result in cleaner running, stronger and more fuel efficient engine. I think you are still stuck in Chevy-land tough... |
Wayne has a good primer on EFI systems in the rebuild book. After reading it, I would never consider carbs as an alternative to my CIS.
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Phe,
Je me bien regardez le garage !! Tu vas d’avoir une bonne journée ou track. |
I'd gladly trade an old CIS system for a set of Webbers. Anyone want to take that deal? I think a good EFI system and CIS (K-jetronic) are two different things.
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Quote:
-Wayne |
Quote:
Now if you happen to have a library of maps for similar engines, that's a different story. |
Hey Phe
just been reading your posting. Looks like the same thing happened to me. I've not started tearing the engine down yet, but I have a broken rocker arm. I'm expecting to find more damage (similar to yours) when I do. So a rebuild will be on the way, though I expect mine will take longer to do than yours (circumstances in time and money). The post has come up with some interesting issues that I have been considering during my own rebuild. I have some 40's on mine and would also like to increase to 3.2. I would also like to do some work on the gearbox, so keep us informed of how things work out. Wayne, your project sounds interesting too, are you intending to give out some details of this one? Good Luck Tom |
I don't want to make this thread into some carbs vs. EFI flame war but I believe that people are afraid of all this "EFI-thing" as something strange, complicated and expensive.
I understand that it isn't as straight-forward as carbs or CIS but it really isn't that complicated (or expensive) at all, especially compared to MFI. You basically measure air-pressure in plenum, revs and squirt enough fuel...that's about it! EFI systems are cheap and new ones can be mapped on the road with pretty good results, especially if using wideband lambda. I believe that biggest obstacle is in people's minds...(on the other hand, I designed electronic devices for living so i probably find it easier/less frightening) |
Rebuild Step 1,
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-001F.JPG Forget to say fully balanced engine http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-002F.JPG 6 "rods" weight 702,1gr http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-003F.JPG |
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http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-008F.JPG
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-009F.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-010F.JPG This is really killing me, I want to drive my car !!:eek: :eek: :eek: Phe |
Still working Step 2
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-001S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-002S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-003S.JPG http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1_MVC-004S.JPG Just a word for wayne's book, really a valuable book in my situation :D :D :D phe |
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