1974 911 Targa -rebuilding original engine vs replacing engine.

[Ladyheat]

Hello,

I have a 1974 911 Targa that has the original 2.7 liter engine and original transmission. I'm not sure of the exact mileage on the engine because the speedometer was not working when I bought the car. I did have the speedometer repaired and the mileage showing on the speedometer is around 130,000 but who knows how far off that actually is. The engine has been leaking oil ever since I bought it and it smokes pretty badly when it is running. Because I wanted to keep the original engine and transmission with matching numbers I recently started checking into what it would cost to have the engine rebuilt. I have been given a ball park figure of anywhere from $17,000 to $25,000 and that doesn't include an additional $5,000 to remove the engine, ship it to the machine shop and then re-install the engine when it is finished.


Consequently, because of the high cost to rebuild this engine I am considering just buying a different engine and having it installed. If I decided to do this what should I be looking for as far as a good replacement engine that would be compatible with this transmission and the car itself? Also, what would be a reasonable price for the replacement engine and to have the replacement engine installed?

Thanks

[jess p]

I have a 74 911 Targa. All 911 “replacement” engines be it a 3.0L, 3.2 and 3.6 are going to cost the same if not more. 911 cores are going for $20 grand and up. I know your engine is up there in miles
but rather than having it rebuilt you could get a diagnosis on oil leaks. A top end rebuild might solve burning oil issues if the leak down and compression tests come back on the down side. I’m not going to mention possible engine transplants such as V8’s type 4 etc. Don’t go down that road. Your car will maintain its value with the original engine and trans.
Another mention I’ll make from something I learned from a well known Porsche transmission guy. If the transmission shifts fine, leave it alone. Finally, $5 grand to me is excessive to remove a 911 engine and to reinstall it. I’ve removed one in 2-3 hours of work.

[KMoore68]

I have a 1977 911 S Targa and was in a similar situation. A compression test on my original 2.7 showed that the rings were compromised on 2 cylinders and a full rebuild was necessary. I imagined a cost of about $25K to rebuild it but that also include a 9 month down-time as the case was shipped to Ollie's for a remachining.

The car is still drive-able, although down on horsepower and burning oil so I picked up a short-block 3.0 case and plan to build the new engine myself. Once that is done, hopefully this winter, i'll install it in the car and sell the 2.7.

[Ladyheat]

A top end rebuild was what I originally thought would take care of the problem but apparently because the engine is smoking so badly the mechanic believes the entire engine needs to be rebuilt. And yes the transmission shifts fine so I don't intend to have anything done to it. I will run the leak down and compression tests by the mechanic and ask again about just having just the top end rebuilt and why he believes the entire engine needs a rebuild. I agree with you about $5,000 being high to remove the engine and reinstall it. It has always been my understanding that those engines have about 4 bolts to remove and the engine would come right out. Thanks for your input.

[Ladyheat]

My car is still drive-able as well but it's pretty embarrassing to drive it because people think it's on fire because it smokes so badly. I wish I had to knowledge to rebuild the engine myself but unfortunately I don't so that's not an option for me. I was also told the car would be down for at least 9 months while the machining was done so at least I know that's accurate information. Thanks for your input.

[Ladyheat]

Any ideas as to what this car would sell for if I decided not to rebuild the engine and just sold it "as is"?

[KMoore68]

FYI, when I had my local shop address a couple of leaks on my car, it cost me about $3K (Canadian) for them to drop the engine, resolve the Triangle of Death leaks, compression test the engine, install a new sound pad, install new muffler gaskets and reinstall the engine.

Your estimate of $5K to drop the engine seems very high, I'm guestimating about 10 hours to drop and reinstall the engine.

I'm not sure what you car would be worth, check out BringATrailer for some comparables or the For Sale forum here on Pelican.

[jess p]

Ladyheat

First, if you decide to keep the car and have it repaired, find another mechanic. I’ve not seen your car but with the current issues I’ll say $20K. Ballpark. It all comes down to emotional content. How much you love the car.

[Ladyheat]

Thanks. I appreciate the info.

[Billthebuilder]

I would say 500. To remove it and 4500 to install and getting it running correctly is probably a good estimate. Do it and don’t look back. These cars are not being made anymore and they will only go up in value especially if they are sorted

[47silver]

If the rest of the car is in great shape rebuild the motor. Contact one of the builders who post here and ship car to them.
If the car is not in good shape you will get sick of paying for repairs.
The following are ballpark figures, some may be higher some lower.

If car needs body work and paint >15000
Interior? 4000 do yourself 2000
Front end rebuild: 4000
Rear end rebuild: 4000
New fuel lines: 1500
Clutch and cAble: 2500
If you have a garage you can do a lot of this work yourself. Need tools and determination.
Other than the motor and transmission these are simple cars.
Engine rebuild though leave to the pros.

[PeteKz]

It doesn't sound like you are wedded to the car, if you are considering selling it as-is. In that case, you will net more money by selling it as a running drivable car, than by rebuilding the engine and then selling it. Once you start down the road of rebuilding, you WILL find other things that need to be done "while you're in there." Pretty much everyone here has that experience.

Either you keep it and consider it a fun but expensive hobby, or you sell it now, as-is. There are no rational middle courses.

[mepstein]

I would make a business of removing, shipping and reinstalling Porsche engines if I could charge $5k - and I have a Porsche business.
Where are you located. Perhaps you could get a second estimate.

[Ladyheat]

Oklahoma City, Oklahoma

[Neil Harvey]

I'm currently working with Mike @ Dumont's in Oklahoma City. Someone I can recommend.

[Black 993]

What is the $5k quote for, exactly? It can't be for just R&R'ing the engine, because you said the mechanic said he would ship the entire engine to a "machine shop" to be rebuilt. Mechanics ship certain engine components to machine shops to be reconditioned, not entire engines. Something is getting lost in translation here.

Additional comment: If the engine is smoking from the tailpipe, your problem is piston rings or valve guides and either way you're going to have to spend some money. However, if the engine is *not* smoking out of the tailpipe, then the source of the smoke is oil leaking onto the exhaust and burning off. That could be something cheap and easy. It's important that you know which problem you have (perhaps both) before proceeding.

[Tony V]

OK just a thought. Is it possible that the oil was checked while the engine was not running? Common mistake with new owners. If so, there’s much too much oil in there and will cause smoking and leaks. No insult intended. My friend bought a really nice SC, for a song, because it smoked like a fog machine. Found it was overfilled. Drained and correct amount of oil filled and he has a great car at a “needs a rebuild” price.