Rebuilding a 962 motor

[Carrera3.5L]

Originally Posted by 84porsche

Ralph,

Thanks again, that was an awesome experience. The uploaded quality is a little less than I had hoped for but I can mail you a DVD if you would like.

Chris

Chris, thanks for taking the video/sound clips, hopefully other people than just Van enjoy it as well. It's a bit old-skool I suppose compared to modern racing powerplants but at the time it was the top of sportscar endurance racing. I'm also glad that all you got were my arms removing the turbo restrictors whereas you got Neil who will now need to re-enter the witness protection program.

Since it's a tad grainy and difficult to read in the amount of time given, here are the columns and what they represented on the desktop screen. The bold red outline was the peak number of that particular column:

Column 1 - Engine RPM
Column 2 - Corrected Torque
Column 3 - Corrected Power
Column 4 - Oil Pressure
Column 5 - Fuel Pressure
Column 6 - Air Fuel Ratio/Left Bank 1-2-3
Column 7 - Air Fuel Ratio/Right Bank 4-5-6
Column 8 - Boost

Other functions like oil temp, intercooler in & out temp, water inlet & out temps (both banks) were among other data that were also able to be viewed.

I'd like a CD at some point and I'm sure that Tim would as well.

Ralph

[89turbocabmike]

Thanks Ralph and Chris for your efforts on this! Ralph, thanks for the break down on the columns as I was trying to guess them. Any concern about the left bank A/F numbers? The right side looks great, but the left seems a bit lean according to some standards. Any word on what the factory recommends/expects as A/F targets?

[sand_man]

This:

equals this:

which equals this once it started:


AWESOME!!!!!!!!!

[450knotOffice]

I'm sorry I missed it Ralph. You got my message, right? I had to work Saturday and Sunday. Chris told me about this video he put up.

[Carrera3.5L]

Originally Posted by 89turbocabmike

Any concern about the left bank A/F numbers? The right side looks great, but the left seems a bit lean according to some standards. Any word on what the factory recommends/expects as A/F targets?

Hi Mike,

There really wasn't much choice on the matter, as Neil doesn't have the VS2000 to be able to read the info from the 1.7 ecu and make changes. We had no idea as to what the ignition timing even is/was!

Neil was just happy that the ecu wasn't in "pace car" mode, as if it was he wouldn't have been able to change the mapping anyway and the motor wouldn't have developed any boost at all, thus any power runs would have been for nothing.

Since we didn't have the diagnostics necessary to make any changes, the goal was to simply "run what you brung" so to speak and see what happened after the initial run-in process. There wasn't a great deal of load placed on the motor and certainly not held constant at a high rpm like you would normally see which is why you didn't see the headers & turbo exhaust housing turn orange. It would have been nice to see for the video though...

Simply put, the idea was to run-in the motor to make sure there weren't any oil & water leaks (very common) and see what it made for torque & power in this configuration without trying to break it. As Helidoc mentioned and I'm sure Van will also attest to, it takes deep pockets to keep one of these motors running and with the scarcity and price of parts, it just doesn't make sense to try and eek out every last horsepower for vintage racing like it was for an IMSA or WSC race 20 years ago.

Ralph

[Mark020]

Wow, what a tread. This is one of the best ever.... Amen

[Wayne 962]

Originally Posted by Carrera3.5L

There really wasn't much choice on the matter, as Neil doesn't have the VS2000 to be able to read the info from the 1.7 ecu and make changes. We had no idea as to what the ignition timing even is/was!

I wonder how I have missed the followup on this thread for so many years! For future reference, I have the VS20 for the 1.2 cars, and would happy to loan it out if anyone needs it for dyno testing...

-Wayne

[paulgtr]

thanks for bringing this back up. what a cool read!

[m110]

My god, what an awesome thread. Truly one of the best reads I have ever seen.

[Flieger]

Yeah, I don't think Wayne was even dreaming of owning a 962 back when this started.

[lvporschepilot]

Ahh to hear these driven in anger with the Lancia/Ferrari LC2 would have been something. Some seriously terrifying speed here folks. 800bhp+ in qualy trim all these motors had.

[Neil '67 911S]

Originally Posted by Flieger

Yeah, I don't think Wayne was even dreaming of owning a 962 back when this started.

Wayne and I were both geeks at MIT back then. My lab was across Vassar St. from where he worked on the Solar Car, as were the vending machines in Building 26 for us night owls. I remember meeting him, I doubt he remembers meeting me. Mine was the silver '67 912 parked out in front of Building 48 (Parsons Lab) that left by 9 AM when the Honeywell Multics main frame charges went up from $5/hour connect time to $150/hour CPU time.

[MAH77]

I thought I would bump this awesome thread.

[Neil Harvey]

Who said the past will not haunt you????

[Neil Harvey]

Still build some of these for customers around the globe. Parts are almost extinct now. We have to make most. I saw an ad for an engine case in Europe for 20,000.00 Euro's. I have a few left here I was going to scrap. seems there is a "boat" in my future.

Recent rebuild completed.




Or we receive them like this

This was all that was left of the engine after the fire.
After a lot of work and on its way back.

I have many more pics of these engine during rebuilding if this is of interest. These C engines were all water cooled and the earlier 56 engine had water cooled heads. These are the basis of the modern Cup and Turbo engines of the mid to late 2000's.
Because the C Cylinder heads were extremely hard to find and would crack after approx 30 hours of use, we decided early on to remove the cylinders and fit liners. The later engines came with Liners and separate heads, be it 1 head each side.

[ian c2]

Originally Posted by Neil Harvey

I have many more pics of these engine during rebuilding if this is of interest.

I’m interested in seeing more Neil !!!
Let’s do a deal ...
You post more pics , and I’ll drink some more beer and call you again next week

[clutch-monkey]

a local guy has stopped racing his 956 because of parts worries. i always wondered- surely with today's tech parts could be made?

[Neil Harvey]

Originally Posted by ian c2

I’m interested in seeing more Neil !!!
Let’s do a deal ...
You post more pics , and I’ll drink some more beer and call you again next week

After our conversation yesterday, I am convinced I'm not the crazy one, anymore.

You Sir, make me look quite sane!!!!

Seriously though, build the engine on paper first, understand the budget available. Do not buy anymore parts until you know exactly what you are trying to achieve and how to make that happen.

Your project is interesting, I would never attempt it but hats off to you for trying. Huge amounts of work, $$$$ and prototyping for a street engine.

Are there not easier things to do in your spare time. Golf, boating, Parachuting????

nh

[ian c2]

I prefer to spend my spare time drinking beer by the pool and thinking up new ways to make things more complicated for myself .

[JKav]

Consider 3D printing (selective laser melting) the metal parts that are NLA, particularly aluminum. If there truly are impossible-to-find parts, it could make all the difference. This process has proven a godsend for many in the same situation.