zenith Upgrade parts from MM

nabilious · 09-08-2007, 05:45 AM

Hi All - I was rebuilding a modified 2.4L motor expecting to use the Zeniths with the bigger jets and venturi's available from Motor Meister. I got the engine back together and now was ready for the carbs. After calling them to order the parts he says " we're low on inventory so we're not selling the parts for outside jobs.....if you send them in for 1100.00 we will take care of everything...." The whole reason I went out and found a nice set of Zeniths was that I was expecting to buy these parts for a few hundred $$'s. Does anyone have any ideas of how I should proceed? I have a jet reaming kit but i'm not sure how much larger to go. I also have a suspestion that the venturies are too small for what I'm doing. Calling all carb and zenith guys. Lets make these things usable again. I hate being held hostage to the monopoly zenith parts source. After all this expense I would have been better off just going the weber route at this point but I woulld like to see if I can make this work.
Thanks,
Nabil

Grady Clay · 09-08-2007, 08:35 AM

Nabil,

Absolutely don’t send your carbs out to MM.

Call PMO.

Venturi and jets and be made or modified.

Best,
Grady

nabilious · 09-08-2007, 09:02 AM

Thanks Grady - I know the reputation and everything that comes with it but I thought that it would be harmless if I just bought the parts and had at it myself. These carbs aren't rocket science and I talked with them once before and they said "No Problem", Now when push comes to shove and I'm ready to go I get the old bait and switch from them. Very frustrating. I'll call PMO and see if they have any suggestions for something non-weber like this.
Thanks
Nabil

Eagledriver · 09-08-2007, 09:58 AM

This is very typical MM. The parts they advertise are never actually available at those prices.

-Andy

304065 · 09-08-2007, 10:22 AM

Richard Parr does not take telephone calls-- send him a detailed fax with a description of the engine, its intended purpose and what you want to do with the Zeniths and he'll be back in touch.

nabilious · 09-09-2007, 08:07 AM

I'm figuring that out now Andy! Just wish I didn't base a few large purchases on crappy info from MM, I thought "what harm could buying parts do?", I found out. John, should I just Google Richard Parr? His name is unfamilar to me but I can't hardly wait to hear from him.

nabilious · 09-09-2007, 08:23 AM

Hey John - Everytime I click on the search function on the Pelican BB's It kicks me out of my internet connection. I was trying to search for more on Richard Parr. Could you PM me his fax #? it woulb be a huge help.
Always appreciated,
Nabil

john walker's workshop · 09-09-2007, 08:45 AM

word of advice, forget the zeniths. endless screwing around for a less than satisfactory result. there are some here who managed to get them to work though.

nabilious · 09-09-2007, 09:08 AM

Alright I found Richard Parr's info. Thanks all. John I feel like taking your advice but the problem is its a buddys car/engine and he has gone too far down the zenith path now. Since the mods aren't too crazy it just might work with slightly bigger jets and I'm sure the Venturis need to be bigger. But you mentioned that some here have made them work.....got any names for me!!! I do hate re-inventing the wheel but sometimes it has to be!
Nabil

911quest · 09-09-2007, 09:50 AM

I find it hard to believe that the jets for 911 zeniths are different then other zeniths carbs. I would do some research and see if you can get the parts from another source maybe a different model car that used a zenith carb. The cool thing about webers is parts were interchangeable on many different style carbs which makes finding jets easier.

john walker's workshop · 09-09-2007, 06:09 PM

making jets larger amounts to buying a jet gauge from pelican and a set of jet reamers or jet drills. old vw bugs have the same idle jets. weber venturis are a few mm shorter, but slip right in.

nabilious · 09-10-2007, 05:05 AM

Thanks John - Now I understand your comment about how it'll drive me crazy trying to make these work....you've been there before haven't you. I searched our hosts catalog and wasn't able to find a Jet Gauge. Anyone know where that is in the catalog or if not available where a guy can fetch one of these?
Thanks,
Nabil

P.S. Do you think the fact that the weber venturi's are a tad shorter is an issue in there use or that it would be unnoticable?

john walker's workshop · 09-10-2007, 05:50 AM

you might want to call pelican about the jet gauges to be sure. otherwise, the other PP has them. get both sets, small and large and the set of reamers. drills are fixed sizes, reamers do any size. there are those who think that reaming or drilling jets is not a good thing, but i've been doing it forever with fine results.

nabilious · 09-10-2007, 05:58 AM

Thanks again John - I, too, have been reaming jets for a while on the dirtbike and enduro application. Nothing very scientific mind you, but just increasing sizes little by little until it ran right (air box mods and exaust stuff). I'll check PP for the gauge, Motor meister has one for sale but I'm sure if I called them to buy it they would tell me to just send my stuff in!! Arseholes. I would only send them a box full of my personal excrement now.
Thanks and I this could be interesting if we get this to work out.
Nabil

p.s. I faxed Richard Parr a letter from me today begging for some guidance on my recipe, I'll keep you posted as to his reply.

kenikh · 09-10-2007, 07:50 AM

I seem to recall there is a guy in the Netherlands that rebuilds Zeniths for vintage racing purposes. Apparently when he's done bleeding you dry of a small fortune, the Zeniths are nearly up to snuff with PMOs. Is this rumor or do we have anyone who has actually seen a set of these "Super-Zeniths"?

nabilious · 09-10-2007, 07:58 AM

Kenik- Currently I believe it to be just rumor!! The fellas at MM say they do it (no credibility), This guy in Holland (Rumors from a distant land carried to us on the sea breeze). I believe John Walker has done it but by the sound of it he would rather not try to replicate that feat. I'm gonna document this project really well and we can start to de-mystify these things and make them usable in other applications than just a straight-up 2.2T. Anyone have any Weber Venturi's in 30 or 32mm? I also just ordered my jet gauge from PP. Any idea's on emultion tubes.....I really don't even know much of what they do!!
Nabil

kenikh · 09-10-2007, 08:03 AM

I got motivated; here's some good info:
http://www.early911sregistry.org/forum/showthread.php?t=13064&highlight=solex+rebuild

kenikh · 09-10-2007, 08:09 AM

Found a thread on the Netherlands rebuilder, too, called DUEL:

http://www.early911sregistry.org/forum/showthread.php?t=10769&highlight=solex+rebuild

nabilious · 09-10-2007, 08:14 AM

Question regarding my Jet Gauge. I bought the one that measures from .40mm- 1.5mm
I would think that this will cover all of my needs but they also have one that goes from 1.5 - 3mm. that sounds too big for my needs but thought i'd check it out with you guyz first.
N

john walker's workshop · 09-10-2007, 02:48 PM

air correctors are around 1.70/1.80 and mains may go to 1.50 depending on application. emulsion tubes are a problem. i never heard of any other than stockers. so delivering the proper amount of fuel at the proper rpm/vacuum/throttle position is going to be an issue. i would spend time reseaching what others have done with emulsion tubes before anything else. the rest is just normal jetting and venturi size, just like a weber.