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-   -   Saving a 906 (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/686273-saving-906-a.html)

Mighty2.0 08-03-2012 03:07 PM

Beautiful engine. Couple questions:
1. What oil pump did you use, and is it modified or different from a street pump?

2. Do you actually measure the Play-Doh after it squished, or just see if there's enough clearance?
I've been reading about the solder method, which holds up enough to measure.

Thanks for the pics, looks great.

Henry Schmidt 08-03-2012 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mighty2.0 (Post 6892255)
Beautiful engine. Couple questions:
1. What oil pump did you use, and is it modified or different from a street pump?

The oil pump is a flow modified 3.0 911SC pump.
Quote:

2. Do you actually measure the Play-Doh after it squished, or just see if there's enough clearance?
I've been reading about the solder method, which holds up enough to measure.

Thanks for the pics, looks great.
The substance is actually modeling clay. It is rigid enough to measure.
You turn the engine over, squish the clay and simply push the depth gauge through the clay to measure the thickness.
I've been doing it this way for 30 years. I have never seen a better way to check multiple clearance dimensions.

Joeaksa 08-16-2012 11:30 AM

Very nice build. Brings back old memories...

blue72s 04-04-2013 01:11 PM

Great engine. Henry, years ago you posted a thread about your own 81mm 906 cylinders with later sealing surface (link http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/288133-81mm-906-cylinders.html). Why was it not chosen for this engine?

Henry Schmidt 04-04-2013 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue72s (Post 7368932)
Great engine. Henry, years ago you posted a thread about your own 81mm 906 cylinders with later sealing surface (link http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/288133-81mm-906-cylinders.html). Why was it not chosen for this engine?

The 906 cylinders are already aluminum and dual/full finned so we took the original 906 cylinders and had the Chromal stripped off. Then we had Millennium replace the Chromal with Nikasil. This made the old cylinders better than new.
We chose not to run my cylinders because the 906 heads have too much value and modifying then seems somewhat sacrilegious.
We actually welded a set of 906 heads recently to bring them back to original.

motogman 04-04-2013 05:16 PM

Awesome. More please... I need another fix!

panama911 12-15-2013 11:43 PM

Hi Henry,

May I ask what is the black coating used on these fasteners - and why?
Looks very good to me, something distinct from the yellow zinc plating we're used to see here!


Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt (Post 6837162)


mreid 12-16-2013 04:19 AM

That does it. If I need a rebuild, Henry gets it. Fantastic stuff here!

IXjamesXI 12-16-2013 05:45 AM

I am curious about the fasteners also! Could they be black oxide? But if I had to guess I would say they are zinc plated with an olive drab chromate. Could it be so? If so, that would be too cool for school.. I was thinking of doing that on my motor instead of yellow zinc. Better corrosion resistance, and looks bad ass.. but I am worried it might be too thick for the fasteners to thread correctly. This is based on zero experience on my part.

911 tweaks 12-16-2013 05:47 AM

his prices are very reasonable for what you receive back...= a very well built engine w/ long life ahead of it...

Henry Schmidt 12-16-2013 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panama911 (Post 7807965)
Hi Henry,

May I ask what is the black coating used on these fasteners - and why?
Looks very good to me, something distinct from the yellow zinc plating we're used to see here!

In a resent thread, I was accused of "archaic methodology" so in this case that claim fits (at least on the outside).
The hardware is black oxide because in 1964 most of the 906 hardware was either black or clear cad.
With some of these projects, appearance counts almost as much as performance.
Strangely enough, this engine had a premature failure do to what appears to be a lack of proper hardness on the lash caps we purchased from Porsche Motorsport.
Sometimes even sourcing parts from the "best" supplier can throw you for a loop.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387207751.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387207766.jpg

IXjamesXI 12-16-2013 07:14 AM

Guess I should have stuck with my first hunch based on period correctness... Maybe zinc with black chromate would give one both proper appearance and up to date performance, but maybe the thickness issue I was worried about becomes a problem then. Thank you for sharing this engine with us!

panama911 12-16-2013 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt (Post 7808186)
In a resent thread, I was accused of "archaic methodology" so in this case that claim fits (at least on the outside).
The hardware is black oxide because in 1964 most of the 906 hardware was either black or clear cad.

Thanx for the info, Henry - while black oxide then probably wouldn't be the best idea for ordinary cars driven in ordinary corrosive environments... I can totally understand that yellow zinc plating wouldn't be authentic for this very special application :)

Lapkritis 12-17-2013 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt (Post 7808186)
In a resent thread, I was accused of "archaic methodology" so in this case that claim fits (at least on the outside).

I believe the term was "antiquated" but that is another discussion/topic.

Shame to see the engine failure.

Working with aged/used parts often means you're either lucky or dead even when greatest lengths are taken to inspect, refurbish and source suitable replacements. Comes with the territory. Hopefully the owner understands this is an inherent risk of mechanized toys.

lindy 911 12-17-2013 06:32 AM

Andrew, you never cease to amaze me with your absolute grip on the obvious; thank you for that.

Henry Schmidt 12-17-2013 09:34 AM

Just to be clear for those who seek accuracy, the failure was simply excess valve clearance.
Valve noise caused by lash cap failures. After the replacement of lash caps, the engine runs perfectly.

Lapkritis 12-17-2013 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindy 911 (Post 7810148)
Andrew, you never cease to amaze me with your absolute grip on the obvious; thank you for that.

Would you have preferred me to use more color and less tact similar to that which those afford me?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt (Post 7444100)
Sometimes if you try to make candy out of shyt, you end up with shyt candy.


TimT 12-17-2013 04:25 PM

Quote:

Strangely enough, this engine had a premature failure do to what appears to be a lack of proper hardness on the lash caps we purchased from Porsche Motorsport.
Unfortunately not everything from Porsche Motorsports... is what it seems.. We sourced some Pankl ti rods for a cup engine a few years ago from them.... They were delivered in a large padded envelope 6 Ti rods, just tossed in a padded envelope... not a thing to prevent contact between the rods....

We thought for about a second that we might try to use the rods... until we took a close look... and saw the nicks and blemished that were present from the way the rods were shipped....

Returned to PMNA

Henry Schmidt 12-18-2013 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimT (Post 7811111)
Unfortunately not everything from Porsche Motorsports... is what it seems.. We sourced some Pankl ti rods for a cup engine a few years ago from them.... They were delivered in a large padded envelope 6 Ti rods, just tossed in a padded envelope... not a thing to prevent contact between the rods....

We thought for about a second that we might try to use the rods... until we took a close look... and saw the nicks and blemished that were present from the way the rods were shipped....

Returned to PMNA

Hi Tim
Thanks for the input.
Your issue sounds more like competence in the shipping department as opposed to quality control.
We have rarely seen an issue with quality from PMNA but with the advent of sourcing small quantity items for vintage race cars (old street cars as well) from previously untested or new management suppliers, we really have to be on our toes. I feel certain that this lash cap issue will be address but after 30+ years I'm constantly surprised at where the next challenge will come from.

Henry Schmidt 09-20-2022 08:22 AM

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1663690898.jpg


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