Engine swapping -- any hidden issues to address?

Sideshow_S · 03-10-2013, 08:24 AM

The quick question:

When swapping a R11S engine what are there any special provisions that need to be prepared for so the replacement doesn't cause sync issues? I can't think of anything special, even computer-wise. I think I'll be setting the old engine to TDC and the replacement to TDC just in case.

Long version:
I burned up an engine on a R11S that I had bought in late 2010. The previous owner was trying to save money by running lean and getting the mpgs up. Engine went bang on a commute home and I drained the oil that day to see the beauty of sparkling metal in viscous wonder.

Never pulled the valvetrain off to look. I feel I know what's in store and it looks much like the pics of the engine posted up a few months ago that also ran too lean too long. So I started engine parts shopping recently. Came across a 30K mile engine for under $500 shipped to my door and decided upon this route instead of draining the wallet on heads, pistons, rings, etc.

I could swap the heads/pistons from this engine, but I fear all the floating metal and potential other issues in the old one is not going to justify this route for a fix.

I've got a fair amount of miles and maintenance that I've done on my bikes, but I've yet to drop the engine. I've had swingarms off and telelevers off, but neither at the same time. Gonna be a long day or two in the garage. If anyone has tips or tricks as to how to support the bike for the swap, I'm all ears. Not sure the front end has to come totally apart, but expecting it will.

Dr. Curve · 04:06 PM

Get the bike securely mounted on a home made rack made from a 2 by 14 inch PT board about 6 feet long, two 6 inch by 6 inch by 32 inch PT post that will act as cross mounts, one near each end of the rack board tips, and of course, a home made short wedge ramp that will let you roll your bike up on this single board with it's two cross mounted ground joist. You will be raising the bike up about 7.5 inches, but thats enough. While the bike is still on the regular floor.....roll it up on the 2/14" 6' board, center it and find out where the center stand lands when you put it up on the center stand. Mark the places where the center stand support touches the board. Mark in such a way that a eye bolt can be inserted from the top (once the bike is standing still and erect on the board) over the curved part of the center stand that is now touching the board and have their (u-bolts) threads go thru the holes now drilled properly in the rack. Once the bike is up on the board, put the two U bolts in place, tighten them down to span the center arm feet, with washer and wing-nut...........now enjoy working on a bike that will not be moving around. Go for the total engine swap if possible, much faster, less expensive, and less chancy IMO.

bradzdotcom · bradzdotcom's Garage

jeez doc, how about a picture?
maybe even something scratched in crayon on a cocktail napkin?
are you describing something similar to a shortened cross?

the only PT board i can find deals with physical therapists. WTF is it?
(askin' cause the dude down the street is diving into a transplant).

wswartzwel · 03-11-2013, 10:20 AM

Dude down the street will need a diving board then Brad. A PT board will not work for him.

Sideshow_S · 03-11-2013, 03:10 PM

Ha!

I get the general idea of what Doc's contraption looks like. I like the idea of having the bike locked down to a mount. Probably wouldn't have thought of it, so thanks!

Got the engine today. Hoping it's a good one!

I've just got fears of electrical gremlins, but it's hard to think of anything that could really cause a no-fire situation. I'm just good at doubting myself.

Gonna need a few beers for this job. . .

Dr. Curve · 03-11-2013, 03:42 PM

Don't be too troubled with electric gremlins. Remember however, that conductivity is very important when working with fuel injection, O2 sensors, TPS sensors, ABS connections, and of course electronic ignitions of any kind. Buy some "Stabilient 22" or another product from local NAPA store. These type of conductivity enhancers make sure your low voltage progression pulses are linear and smooth in their transmission. Especially useful with anything around the TPS connections. Use it carefully after cleaning all exposed metal carefully with a evaporative spray of your choice.

Sideshow_S · 03-12-2013, 02:59 PM

How much force does an engine need to turn?

I'm playing with the donor engine and I'm happy to say it spins with no odd sounds. Sparkplugs are in and there is compression and the PCV stuff is removed, so there's no internal case pressure. Oil was drained for shipping purposes, but it's dripping here and there, so it's not completely dry.

What's strange is that I'm able to turn the flywheel with my hands. I'd have expected compression to be more than what it is -- requiring extra leverage to get over compression.

Does this seem right to you guys? Engine has 31K. Thanks for any insight anyone can offer. I don't really want to pull this engine apart in order to find out it's shot too. The valve covers show that it had quite the crash, but having seen similar valve covers on my other bike that's running just fine, I have my doubts that the heads are cracked.

wswartzwel · 03-13-2013, 05:25 AM

You have access to a compression gauge? Pull the plugs and hook jumper cables to the starter and check compression.

Dr. Curve · 06:13 AM

Often, depending on the accident, a head-drop that is forceful enough to break the valve covers.......can bend a valve slightly so that it does not fully close because of valve guide interference. Pull the valve covers off. Remove plugs, turn engine and observe the valve action. Of course take Bill's suggestion and check compression if you see that the valve train is working. I would check the valves first before using the starter motor however, just to make sure no further damage occurs.

I bet you have a simple engine swap that goes well. If you wish.......drain oil, and replace with about a gallon of kerosene in the engine case. Shake engine all around for a bit...........drain totally........and you will not believe how clean a engine you can start off with once your new oil and filter are put in place.

Sideshow_S · 03-14-2013, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Curve

Often, depending on the accident, a head-drop that is forceful enough to break the valve covers.......can bend a valve slightly so that it does not fully close because of valve guide interference. Pull the valve covers off. Remove plugs, turn engine and observe the valve action. Of course take Bill's suggestion and check compression if you see that the valve train is working. I would check the valves first before using the starter motor however, just to make sure no further damage occurs.

I bet you have a simple engine swap that goes well. If you wish.......drain oil, and replace with about a gallon of kerosene in the engine case. Shake engine all around for a bit...........drain totally........and you will not believe how clean a engine you can start off with once your new oil and filter are put in place.

Cool guys, thanks!

I did check the valves. Most of the intakes checked out at .006" and the exhausts were .010". A little tight for those I'd say, so I'm hoping that there's some overlap there that's stealing the compression. I'm going to reset them all once I get some oil in it.

I do expect it's fine, but it's just hard to judge it all as it sits. Ebay deals are always fun. At the very least, this one doesn't have a bunch of metal flakes floating around the crankcase like the one in it now does. It will be a better one to fix top-end issues with, if they do show up.